Jump to content
GoodDay

Clark Street Is Recruiting

Recommended Posts

A couple of days ago, Nick Kloobnikin called my dad (He is my dad's age) and invited himself over to talk. My dad asked him if it was church related and Nick said no.(He lied!). To make a long story short, Nick invited my dad to Clark Street and extended the invitatation to my Mom and my brother and myself. I talked to him for a few minutes but he said nothig until I was gone.

 

I will write more later but this is a matter that needs to be out in the open. There are a few already getting caught up in thier cult.

 

The ones who have left (except for one) need to be embraced with the Love of Jesus Christ!

The ones who have one foot in Clark Streets doors need to be shown the Love of Jesus Christ!

 

Be on guard for these ones who come not in the name of God (Jesus Christ) to pull people further away from the Truth then they are already!

 

Paul William Orloff~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Recruiting...?

 

Must have singles in the family in need of a spouse to keep the bloodline "pure"

 

That guy is in for a RUDE awakening when he stands before the Lord and has to give an account

 

15 "What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are! (Matthew 23:15 NLT)

 

Surprised FV is not front row there

 

I agree you must show them love for those who are seeking to get out or who are out

 

That would exclude referring them to another "less worse" molokan "church"

 

Since God is Love

 

7 Dear friends, let us continue to love one another, for love comes from God. Anyone who loves is a child of God and knows God.

8 But anyone who does not love does not know God, for God is love. (1John 4:7-8 NLT)

 

AND

 

You are called to worship in Spirit and in TRUTH so you must tell them the TRUTH

 

24For God is Spirit, so those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth.” (John 4:24 NLT)

 

It all works in concert

 

That cannot include "loving" them and saying it's OK to go to another molokan "church"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There was a contingent of these clarkies who were present at the Walter Shinen funeral with the women and young girls dressed in a manner to achieve their desire to look like muslims. Mohamed and mgr would be of so proud of their desire for the right look in the presence of all of us infidels. Fourvett's family would have fit right in quite well.

 

lastinline (& very fashion conscious)

 

 

Recruiting...?

 

Must have singles in the family in need of a spouse to keep the bloodline "pure"

 

That guy is in for a RUDE awakening when he stands before the Lord and has to give an account

 

15 "What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are! (Matthew 23:15 NLT)

 

Surprised FV is not front row there

 

I agree you must show them love for those who are seeking to get out or who are out

 

That would exclude referring them to another "less worse" molokan "church"

 

Since God is Love

 

7 Dear friends, let us continue to love one another, for love comes from God. Anyone who loves is a child of God and knows God.

8 But anyone who does not love does not know God, for God is love. (1John 4:7-8 NLT)

 

AND

 

You are called to worship in Spirit and in TRUTH so you must tell them the TRUTH

 

24For God is Spirit, so those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth.” (John 4:24 NLT)

 

It all works in concert

 

That cannot include "loving" them and saying it's OK to go to another molokan "church"

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There was a contingent of these clarkies who were present at the Walter Shinen funeral with the women and young girls dressed in a manner to achieve their desire to look like muslims. Mohamed and mgr would be of so proud of their desire for the right look in the presence of all of us infidels. Fourvett's family would have fit right in quite well.

 

lastinline (& very fashion conscious)

 

 

Recruiting...?

 

Must have singles in the family in need of a spouse to keep the bloodline "pure"

 

That guy is in for a RUDE awakening when he stands before the Lord and has to give an account

 

15 "What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are! (Matthew 23:15 NLT)

 

Surprised FV is not front row there

 

I agree you must show them love for those who are seeking to get out or who are out

 

That would exclude referring them to another "less worse" molokan "church"

 

Since God is Love

 

7 Dear friends, let us continue to love one another, for love comes from God. Anyone who loves is a child of God and knows God.

8 But anyone who does not love does not know God, for God is love. (1John 4:7-8 NLT)

 

AND

 

You are called to worship in Spirit and in TRUTH so you must tell them the TRUTH

 

24For God is Spirit, so those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth.” (John 4:24 NLT)

 

It all works in concert

 

That cannot include "loving" them and saying it's OK to go to another molokan "church"

 

 

I was wondering what statement they were trying to make by being there.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As in my first post, my point was to show them the Love of Jesus Christ.

 

Don't even steer them to a church. A church is not what saves a person. Forcing anyone to go anywhere is of no help.

 

Point them to the Bible. Sit and talk with them if your able. Pray with them if possible. Point them to the Lamb-The Atoning Lamb of God!

 

 

 

Paul

Edited by GoodDay

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree a Church cannot save anyone

 

My point was to give them a chance to break the bonds of the religion of men

 

If they came to know the Truth, they would hopefully make the right decision

 

 

As in my first post, my point was to show them the Love of Jesus Christ.

 

Don't even steer them to a church. A church is not what saves a person. Forcing anyone to go anywhere is of no help.

 

Point them to the Bible. Sit and talk with them if your able. Pray with them if possible. Point them to the Lamb-The Atoning Lamb of God!

 

 

 

Paul

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
'LTTBT' date='Sep 25 2009, 08:01 AM' post='35538']

I was wondering what statement they were trying to make by being there.

 

They are doing a sinister bate and switch to try to return to favor of many Molokans. As in the political arena where bi-partisanship is pretty much a case of the liberals game of expecting conservatives to give up their principles and become good-little comrades in arms.

 

I can only hope that Walter's family was uncomfortable with them being there.

 

Just as four(NO)vetta wallows in pig-pin of hateful rhetoric toward true-Christianity, their desire is to merely succeed in turning the naive into comrades of evil.

 

lastinline (& with a watchful eye) :135:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Anonymous

The clarkies are attempting to gain favor so that when their leader, or elders, say it's time for them to go on their pohot, they will try to get as many Molokan souls as possible to go with them. Thus ending all relationships and cutting themselves off as they did in the past. Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it. I think they already got a few, one being ******* ***********. Not sure of the other names. Those who really know their leader *********** has Narcissistic personality disorder.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The clarkies are attempting to gain favor so that when their leader, or elders, say it's time for them to go on their pohot, they will try to get as many Molokan souls as possible to go with them. Thus ending all relationships and cutting themselves off as they did in the past. Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it. I think they already got a few, one being ******* ***********. Not sure of the other names. Those who really know their leader *********** has Narcissistic personality disorder.

The Clarkies and New Israel Are no different. Both worship a false "god".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The clarkies do practice what they believe like the mormons. Of course they are completely wrong and will end up in Hell as a result, but at least they're living their faith

 

The garden variety cult of molokanism members are wanna-be "new israel". All the extra books proclaim the same nonsense but they are lazy by comparison to the clarkies

 

Both are handling strange fire and are in for a rude awakening on that day.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

REGARDING NEW ISRAEL: The Clarkies will never die because they are transformed every 100 years, they will return to their homeland Russia and thereafter will travel back and forth to a new land. Spirit and Life page 639.13-14.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The clarkies do practice what they believe like the mormons. Of course they are completely wrong and will end up in Hell as a result, but at least they're living their faith

 

The garden variety cult of molokanism members are wanna-be "new israel". All the extra books proclaim the same nonsense but they are lazy by comparison to the clarkies

 

Both are handling strange fire and are in for a rude awakening on that day.

Very true. That is an excellent summation of the 2 groups of "new Israel". I would venture to say that if the Clarkies didn't break themselves away from the mainstream "new Israel", that many of the blind mainstream elders (DECEIVERS) wouldn't have that much of an issue with their worship of MGR.

 

The mainstreamers were more offended on how they were "treated" not really their "beliefs".

 

It goes to show how really DECEIVED and BLINDED both groups are. And, to the people that go and don't know a lick of Russian, your elders have you right they want you. Just keep filling the building, put your money on the table and all is good in the hood.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It goes to show how really DECEIVED and BLINDED both groups are. And, to the people that go and don't know a lick of Russian, your elders have you right they want you. Just keep filling the building, put your money on the table and all is good in the hood.

 

Knowing the Russian language makes things worse..... For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, Hebrews 10:26 NKJV

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

It goes to show how really DECEIVED and BLINDED both groups are. And, to the people that go and don't know a lick of Russian, your elders have you right they want you. Just keep filling the building, put your money on the table and all is good in the hood.

 

Knowing the Russian language makes things worse..... For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, Hebrews 10:26 NKJV

How do you get from one point and always end up way on the other side?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

How do you get from one point and always end up way on the other side?

 

Changing from one orbit to another, without having a path........"quantum mechanics"......A fundamental branch of physics which deals with physical phenomena at nanoscopic scales where the action is on the order of the Planck constant.

 

Planck Constant, Example: "The Clark Street Shuttle".... page 638.6, page 639.12,13 and 14 Those that believe in this will go on a journey to a far land, while the unbelievers will remain in place. Then God will lift the boundaries of the ocean. Two steamships will leave to cross the impassable ocean: one for twenty years and the other for seventeen. Then they (the steamships) will return to their homeland, and thereafter will travel back and forth. They do not die, but are transformed every hundred years.

 

Isn't religion fun, you bet your life.......SF

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Hmmm...

Just wondering about this. Going on 6 years since. I personally know of several instances that they have tried to infiltrate by preying on the "weak". Taking charge of funerals and such. Why do some Molokans turn to them,I wonder. Is it because they foot the bill???

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Guest 2

Are you a member of the Molokan Churches? If you are.......

 

Do you think you are better than they are? Years ago, they were welcomed to all the Molokan Churches, they were your friends, relatives, cousins. I give them credit that they walk their walk and talk their talk. How are they different from you? You are both on the same side, still a cult. Trying to get to heaven by works, being good, wearing the "right" clothes or colors, believing you are the New Jerusalem, the chosen ones and everyone else is Nenash. You deny Jesus for what he has done for you and the gift he gives by doing things to get to Heaven and if not, can still be prayed into heaven when you die. At extini, your parents asked that your name be written into the Book of Life. That is not how you are saved. Are you really any different that they are? How so?

 

If you are not a member, these questions do not apply to you. As I have left the church and am on the outside looking in, it sickens me of the attitude they have toward other people, the Nenash, as well as the Clarkies. How can they treat anyone for that matter with so much disgust, hatred, disdain? That is not how Jesus treated anyone.....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are you a member of the Molokan Churches? If you are.......

 

Do you think you are better than they are? Years ago, they were welcomed to all the Molokan Churches, they were your friends, relatives, cousins. I give them credit that they walk their walk and talk their talk. How are they different from you? You are both on the same side, still a cult. Trying to get to heaven by works, being good, wearing the "right" clothes or colors, believing you are the New Jerusalem, the chosen ones and everyone else is Nenash. You deny Jesus for what he has done for you and the gift he gives by doing things to get to Heaven and if not, can still be prayed into heaven when you die. At extini, your parents asked that your name be written into the Book of Life. That is not how you are saved. Are you really any different that they are? How so?

 

If you are not a member, these questions do not apply to you. As I have left the church and am on the outside looking in, it sickens me of the attitude they have toward other people, the Nenash, as well as the Clarkies. How can they treat anyone for that matter with so much disgust, hatred, disdain? That is not how Jesus treated anyone.....

Well said, accurate on every point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Clarkies are devoute Khlysti while the Molokans are a hybrid faith, a mixture of Christianity and the Khlyst Russian sect....... Shake N Bake.

 

Molokanism, all "isms" for that matter deny Jesus at some point.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest
On 11/1/2014 at 5:44 PM, seeking_truth_1 said:

The clarkies do practice what they believe like the mormons. Of course they are completely wrong and will end up in Hell as a result, but at least they're living their faith

 

The garden variety cult of molokanism members are wanna-be "new israel". All the extra books proclaim the same nonsense but they are lazy by comparison to the clarkies

 

Both are handling strange fire and are in for a rude awakening on that day.

pretty sinful to condemn someone to hell, you are taking the power of God, thats his job to judge

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I guess you're not interested in The Truth as the Bible spells it out

I'd also imagine you're not really liking the cult rules and regulations that have ZERO basis in the Bible

Why even bother in a place like this if you are "happy"?

Man made rules designed to enslave but not to Save are at the core of any cult granting power to those who make up the rules

Do you not have room in your heart for the Truth?

31 ¶  Jesus said to the people who believed in him, “You are truly my disciples if you remain faithful to my teachings.
32  And you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”
33  “But we are descendants of Abraham,” they said. “We have never been slaves to anyone. What do you mean, ‘You will be set free’?”
34  Jesus replied, “I tell you the truth, everyone who sins is a slave of sin.
35  A slave is not a permanent member of the family, but a son is part of the family forever.
36  So if the Son sets you free, you are truly free.
37  Yes, I realize that you are descendants of Abraham. And yet some of you are trying to kill me because there’s no room in your hearts for my message. John 8

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

Are you not happy still after leaving the molokan church last? By your name I can tell you are still seeking truth, my friend you are further than when you started, look into the eyes of the poor misguided kids of clark street, and tell them theyre going hell if you think thats right, God be with you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God

Romans 3:23

 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 6:23

Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

John 14:6

Do YOU know (not know of) Jesus?

1 ¶  Therefore I exhort first of all that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks be made for all men,
2  for kings and all who are in authority, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and reverence.
3  For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
4  who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
5  For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,
6  who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time,
7  for which I was appointed a preacher and an apostle--I am speaking the truth in Christ and not lying--a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and truth.
8  I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting; 1 Timothy 2

What are YOU telling the kids?

But if you cause one of these little ones who trusts in me to fall into sin, it would be better for you to have a large millstone tied around your neck and be drowned in the depths of the sea.

Matthew 18:6

By the way, seeking truth is in the present progressive active tense

Look it up

 

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

The kids dont know any better. God loves all, christ loves all, do you know for a fact they dont believe in Christ? Their hearts may belong to christ, they just dont announce it because of fear of being cut off and dishonoring their parents. Put yourself mentally what they feel, being slanderized by the stubborn people who wish they were dead. How do you think that makes them feel to be treated mean and not know what they did wrong? Think back to when you were 5yrs old and the way you were, meek shy and emotional , how would you handle being told that hell is your punishment. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

God loves all... This is true

I believe there is an age where someone becomes resonsable for their decision about Christ

I also believe young children do not end up in Hell for the above reason

How do you know "Their hearts may belong to Christ"?

How do you know anyone's hearts may belong to Christ other than by what they say and do?

If one denies who Jesus says He Is, is trying to "work" their way into Heaven or has another "savior" and "holy book", the best I can say about that person is I don't know if they are a Christian

Back to my original questions

Do YOU know (not know of) Jesus?

Since you say " The kids dont know any better", what are YOU telling the kids?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

its what the parents tell the kids, yet some parents are realizing that their parents made a mess, now some of them are realizing what is wrong with our two groups not getting along. If they do not understand who Christ is, they have no clue of his existence thats a whole different story. but what is known is that they believe in 1. God 2.Christ 3. AXMET YOULIA a God to the 3rd face. they read the bible. if they still accept christ do you think theyre hell bound? 

 

In the past it was said that Maxcim is the new Jesus, that was 1 or 2 individuals, some people who know the group told me the order they believe 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you are referring to these, there's a problem and the Truth is not in those who profess such

Pg. 417  Bk. 8  Art. 1  Ver. 13-14
    And truly He [Christ] is the very one that has anointed me personally as a king and prophet for a thousand years, and therein has given me a new name:  Akhmet Ulia.  And He has also clearly confined in me the new law of freedom, and the forgiveness of all sins through me, His anointed, but only for those who believe upon Him. 

There is forgivess for the penalty of sin from only one ONE source... Jesus

Pg. 580  Bk. 13 Art. 6 Ver. 1-2
    Thus I [M.G.R.] am called by a new name, which I have written here in the lines for you by the testimony of the true Spirit.  
    The first name is Enfayil--firm God.  The second is Savakhan--King of the promise.  The third is Ulia-Yar--the Prince of Peace, father of the age hereafter. 

mgr is calling himself God and identifies as the "prince of peace"

There's only ONE Prince of Peace... Jesus

6  For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. Isaiah 9

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

i guess the order someone believes is an individual feeling, but you cant assume that of a whole group of people because we dont know for sure that some of them dont accept Christ as their savior, i know some of them do

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
3 hours ago, seeking_truth_1 said:

If you are referring to these, there's a problem and the Truth is not in those who profess such

Pg. 417  Bk. 8  Art. 1  Ver. 13-14
    And truly He [Christ] is the very one that has anointed me personally as a king and prophet for a thousand years, and therein has given me a new name:  Akhmet Ulia.  And He has also clearly confined in me the new law of freedom, and the forgiveness of all sins through me, His anointed, but only for those who believe upon Him. 

There is forgivess for the penalty of sin from only one ONE source... Jesus

Pg. 580  Bk. 13 Art. 6 Ver. 1-2
    Thus I [M.G.R.] am called by a new name, which I have written here in the lines for you by the testimony of the true Spirit.  
    The first name is Enfayil--firm God.  The second is Savakhan--King of the promise.  The third is Ulia-Yar--the Prince of Peace, father of the age hereafter. 

mgr is calling himself God and identifies as the "prince of peace"

There's only ONE Prince of Peace... Jesus

6  For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. Isaiah 9

 

 

It is written in Proverbs 3:7 - Do not be wise in your own eyes; Fear the Lord and depart from evil. Likewise in the same chapter in verse 35, it says - The wise shall inherit glory, But shame shall be the legacy of fools. In regards to fools - If a wise man has an argument with a fool, the fool only rages and laughs, and there is no quiet. Prov 29:9. Therefore, I hope that our friend “seeking truth” will prove me wrong, and not act like a fool, and make me not guilty of violating the following Scripture, which says, “Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you be like him yourself.” Prov 26:4.

He quotes 2 passages from the writings of MGR, and proceeds to rip them out of context for his own purposes. One must ask himself, if “seeking truth” is genuinely “seeking” the “truth,” then why does he proceed to propagate falsehood? A man of the “truth,” should state the “truth,” and prove to all that he does indeed, have the indwelling of the “Spirit of Truth” within him.

1. The first passage is located in Book 8, Article 1, Verses 13-14. Within this passage MGR is writing regarding his spiritual position/rank within/during the Kingdom of our Lord Jesus Christ upon the land for 1000 years. He states that he has been anointed (by Christ) to be king and prophet during this time period. This in itself is completely Scriptural, as king David was also anointed king (1 Sam 16:13 - Then Samuel took the horn of oil and anointed him (David) in the midst of his brothers; and the Spirit of the Lord came upon David from that day forward) and anointed prophet (Heb 11:32 - And what more shall I say? For the time would fail me to tell of Gideon and Barak and Samson and Jephthah, also of David and Samuel and the prophets). MGR follows this by stating that Christ has given him (MGR) a “new name” and/or “title” (Rev 3:12 - I will write on him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from my God: and I will write on him my new name), which is, “Akhmed Ulia.” The next verse states that Christ has confined in MGR the “new law of freedom”, which was often spoken of by Apostle Paul, “Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. In Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life has set you free from the law of sin and death.” Rom 8:1-2. MGR also claims at the end of the passage the same right from Christ, that Christ gave to His Apostles, “If you forgive anyone's sins, they are forgiven. If you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven." Through Jesus Christ, our sins are forgiven, He is the source of this grace given freely from God, however, He also states that His Apostles (those who have seen Him or represent Him) have the authority to forgive sin, because His Spirit is active in them.

2. Regarding MGR 13:6:1-2. Here MGR is simply conveying to us the new name of Jesus Christ, which is - Firm God, King of the Promise and Prince of the age hereafter. Isa 9:6. This new name has been written upon/given to him. Scripture is full of passages that state that the name of God and of His Son, will be written upon every believer. Each believer also will have various ranks of service and will be called by various new names and/or titles. Rev 14:1 - Then I looked, and behold, the Lamb was standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His name and the name of His Father written on their foreheads. Dan 9:19 - For Your own sake, O my God, do not delay, because Your city and Your people are called by Your name. Num 6:27 - And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them….

In conclusion:

MGR does not claim to be God. On the contrary, he believed in and worshipped God. His wish was for all of God’s people to recognize God, as the sole true God among all the nations. MGR 3:17:5.

MGR does not claim to be Jesus Christ. He himself prayed to Jesus in the following manner: “Oh Jesus! The sweetest Lamb of God. You are the redeemer of all of us the chosen! For everywhere You are alone the intercessor for the love of those crying out unto You in truth!” MGR 741:XII.

If "Seeking Truth" wishes to proceed, he must walk upon the path of the "truth" and refrain from deliberately misinterpreting and distorting what MGR actually wrote, and proceed to debate in an orderly and righteous way, showing the fruits of the Spirit of Truth. If he doesn't, then we must conclude that he is a fool according to the Scripture in Proverbs 29:9. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Really...?

Forgivness of sin through mgr?

Pg. 417  Bk. 1 Art. 8 Ver. 14
And has therein given me [M.G.R.] a new name:  Akhmet Ulia.  And He has also clearly confined in me the new law of freedom, and the forgiveness of all sins through me, His anointed. 

Pg. 612  Bk. 14 Art. 13 Ver. 20
For this reason I [M.G.R] suffer the long while always in prisons and lasting confinements, always presented for the sins of my chosen people as a sacrificial lamb offering

The "new jewish messiah" is mgr? Jesus is the Messiah of all who call upon Him

Pg. 526  Bk. 10 Art. 31 Ver. 1
 The writer of this message is a man, by birth a resident of this world, named Ulesar, the King Ures, the new Jewish Messiah. 

Pg. 498  Bk. 10 Art. 8 Ver. 7
    For I am Ulesar, the king Ures, the new Jewish Messiah.  And the Jew and all the tribes of the nations shall bow down to me. 

The earmarks of a cult

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

you dont know for a fact that they consider him their savior, i know for a fact some of them accept christ, dont be so quick to assume

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
1 hour ago, seeking_truth_1 said:

Really...?

Forgivness of sin through mgr?

Pg. 417  Bk. 1 Art. 8 Ver. 14
And has therein given me [M.G.R.] a new name:  Akhmet Ulia.  And He has also clearly confined in me the new law of freedom, and the forgiveness of all sins through me, His anointed. 

No. Incorrect. Forgiveness of sin is through Christ.

MGR writes: All of us recognize Him (Christ) as being sent from God solely to take away all the sins of the world, and give eternal life and the law of freedom in the Spirit of truth unto all. MGR 5:9:4. And...O Jesus, the sweetest Lamb of God! You are the redeemer of the sins of the world and the Lord of all! For You are everywhere, alone the Mediator unto God. Your Father and ours, for us who believe in You in truth. MGR 711.

Christ said to the Apostles: As the Father has sent me, so I am sending you.” Then he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive anyone’s sins, they are forgiven. If you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.” John 20:19-22.

And to Peter he said: And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. Matt 16:19.

After Christ breathed on the Apostles, He gave them the authority to bind on earth what shall be bound in heaven. They were granted this authority through the Holy Spirit of Christ. For when the Holy Spirit comes, He will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment. John 16:7.

Ahmed Ulia is a name/title of the Holy Spirit fulfilling the will of Him (Christ) who sent me (MGR) for one thousand years. MGR 8:2:7. It is only within this context that you can interpret the 2nd Article of Book 8 accurately.

Time does not permit me to explore every dubious passage or write an entire volume of commentary for you just so you can drag it through the mud. You've already proven yourself to be void of the Spirit of Truth, who if He was in you, would be speaking the “truth” and not “falsehood”. An earmark of a fool is one who refuses to listen and accurately portray his opponents views, and instead begins to mock, laugh and be rude. You are a provocateur, who enjoys to poke the bear all day long behind your computer. Enjoy. We have more important things to attend to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Guest guest said:

you dont know for a fact that they consider him their savior, i know for a fact some of them accept christ, dont be so quick to assume

You are correct however, there's a spiritual dilemma

One who is considered a "prophet" albeit a false one, clearly claims to be the one doling out "salvation"

The extra book is regarded as "scripture" and is held in a farily high degree of esteem to share a place next to the Bible

That should be a REAL problem for a Christian who still attends the cult

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Guest newname said:

No. Incorrect. Forgiveness of sin is through Christ.

MGR writes: All of us recognize Him (Christ) as being sent from God solely to take away all the sins of the world, and give eternal life and the law of freedom in the Spirit of truth unto all. MGR 5:9:4. And...O Jesus, the sweetest Lamb of God! You are the redeemer of the sins of the world and the Lord of all! For You are everywhere, alone the Mediator unto God. Your Father and ours, for us who believe in You in truth. MGR 711.

Christ said to the Apostles: As the Father has sent me, so I am sending you.” Then he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive anyone’s sins, they are forgiven. If you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.” John 20:19-22.

And to Peter he said: And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. Matt 16:19.

After Christ breathed on the Apostles, He gave them the authority to bind on earth what shall be bound in heaven. They were granted this authority through the Holy Spirit of Christ. For when the Holy Spirit comes, He will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment. John 16:7.

Ahmed Ulia is a name/title of the Holy Spirit fulfilling the will of Him (Christ) who sent me (MGR) for one thousand years. MGR 8:2:7. It is only within this context that you can interpret the 2nd Article of Book 8 accurately.

Time does not permit me to explore every dubious passage or write an entire volume of commentary for you just so you can drag it through the mud. You've already proven yourself to be void of the Spirit of Truth, who if He was in you, would be speaking the “truth” and not “falsehood”. An earmark of a fool is one who refuses to listen and accurately portray his opponents views, and instead begins to mock, laugh and be rude. You are a provocateur, who enjoys to poke the bear all day long behind your computer. Enjoy. We have more important things to attend to.

Much like the Quuran, the extra book is full of inconsistencies and WORSE but of course the really disgusting parts have been redacted from the "holy" book

If you are familiar with the law of abrogation in islam, stronger verses superceede weaker one

How does one in your cult explain away contradictions?

Do you also use abrogation?

By the way, we need to differentiate between one DISTICT difference between a single word - sin

Sin is a condition, because of the fall of man through Adam & Eve, all are born with

Sins are wilful transgressions of God's law

In every instance when mgr refers to himself as the one who forgives sin, it's SINGULAR

That should be a REAL problem for any Christian attending the cult of molokanism

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

they accept christ, youre just assuming that they dont, they believe (like I said earlier) Maxcim is the God to the 3rd face their trinity is God, Christ, Maxcim , its still wrong , but they still accept christ as their savior, i appreciate the quotes from scripture but i have the information from word of mouth. Dont you hope the ones who cant leave the strength and courage to break away? or do you want them being clueless to die with the faith? We all know which one christ would do.....are you going to pick the one christ would?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Which Jesus?

The religious leaders knew and met a man named Jesus but that's where it ended

They knew of Him but did not recognize him for who He Is

13 ¶  "But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of heaven against men; for you neither go in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in.
14  "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you devour widows’ houses, and for a pretense make long prayers. Therefore you will receive greater condemnation.
15  "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel land and sea to win one proselyte, and when he is won, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves.


Matthew 23

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Quite the contrary... That's the cult of molokanism and all other cults view

Who do YOU say Jesus is?

Is He Immanuel?  God With Us?

14  "Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel.

Did He Dwell among us?

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Who is the Word ( The Logos)?

Reference John 1:1

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
On 2/1/2018 at 7:17 AM, seeking_truth_1 said:

Much like the Quuran, the extra book is full of inconsistencies and WORSE but of course the really disgusting parts have been redacted from the "holy" book

If you are familiar with the law of abrogation in islam, stronger verses superceede weaker one

How does one in your cult explain away contradictions?

Do you also use abrogation?

By the way, we need to differentiate between one DISTICT difference between a single word - sin

Sin is a condition, because of the fall of man through Adam & Eve, all are born with

Sins are wilful transgressions of God's law

In every instance when mgr refers to himself as the one who forgives sin, it's SINGULAR

That should be a REAL problem for any Christian attending the cult of molokanism

 

Inconsistencies, contradictions, errors...I wonder if the Bible would stand up to your own criticism if you applied this same logic consistently across the board? These inconsistencies are only in the eye of the beholder who maintains this presupposition before hand. The Law of Abrogation within Islam is used by some Muslims to "abrogate" texts that were revealed earlier. In other words, the later texts take precedence over the earlier ones. Regardless, there is no "abrogation" within these passages regarding the forgiveness of sins. MGR is clear in all his writings that Christ is the one who forgives sin: 

All of us recognize Him (Christ) as being sent from God solely (singular) to take away all the sins of the world, and give eternal life and the law of freedom in the Spirit of truth unto all. MGR 5:9:4.

A little bit of advice. Since you are so obviously and willfully misinformed, not led by the Spirit of Truth, it would be wise of you to cease speaking of what you know not, and instead, do actual research in your poor excuse of an outreach ministry. Or, you can do what you always do. Look foolish and make for some great morning comedy. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Bible is without error.

The Quuran, like the s&l, are illustrations of writings not inspired by God

So when mgr claims to forgive sin, you just ignore that?

I guess ignoring the obvious is one way to deal with the inconsistancies

Seeing as you claim the cult of molokanism is "christian", can anyone else come and join your cult?

Say perhaps a non-white Christian?

23  Before the way of faith in Christ was available to us, we were placed under guard by the law. We were kept in protective custody, so to speak, until the way of faith was revealed.
24  Let me put it another way. The law was our guardian until Christ came; it protected us until we could be made right with God through faith.
25  And now that the way of faith has come, we no longer need the law as our guardian.
26  For you are all children of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
27  And all who have been united with Christ in baptism have put on the character of Christ, like putting on new clothes.
28  There is no longer Jew or Gentile, slave or free, male and female. For you are all one in Christ Jesus.


Galatians 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
11 hours ago, seeking_truth_1 said:

The Bible is without error.

The Quuran, like the s&l, are illustrations of writings not inspired by God

So when mgr claims to forgive sin, you just ignore that?

I guess ignoring the obvious is one way to deal with the inconsistancies

To begin with, "inconsistency," is spelt with an E, not an A. The word "Quran" also does not have two U's.

Errors and inconsistencies, are only "apparent" in your eyes. Not real errors, but only apparent errors. 

We also cannot argue against a straw man. MGR never claims to forgive sins personally. You are deliberately misapplying, misinterpreting and twisting the text to come to that view. While also completely ignoring numerous passages which state that Christ and His Spirit are exclusive in that only they can forgive sin. 

The fact remains. The Bible would not survive your exegesis if you applied this logic consistently. Ignorance is bliss. 

I will not engage with you further. As I am now repeating myself way to often. As already stated, "an earmark of a fool is one who refuses to listen and accurately portray his opponents views." 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/7/2018 at 9:39 PM, seeking_truth_1 said:

Seeing as you claim the cult of molokanism is "christian", can anyone else come and join your cult?

Say perhaps a non-white Christian?

23  Before the way of faith in Christ was available to us, we were placed under guard by the law. We were kept in protective custody, so to speak, until the way of faith was revealed.
24  Let me put it another way. The law was our guardian until Christ came; it protected us until we could be made right with God through faith.
25  And now that the way of faith has come, we no longer need the law as our guardian.
26  For you are all children of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
27  And all who have been united with Christ in baptism have put on the character of Christ, like putting on new clothes.
28  There is no longer Jew or Gentile, slave or free, male and female. For you are all one in Christ Jesus.


Galatians 3

 

A single typo negates what I stated?

Forgive me oh spel czech'r from on high

Seems more legalistic then anything else on your part

Blind guides! You strain your water so you won't accidentally swallow a gnat, but you swallow a camel! Matthew 23:24

Good "luck" trying to sell that nonsense

What about the part following the dreaded typo?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Guest newname,

A couple of questions:

1)  Has JESUS given you a "new name," and if so, what is it?

2)  Do you read Russian/Cyrillic, and if so, are you able to translate it into English?

Thank you.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
1 hour ago, anonymous said:

Guest newname,

A couple of questions:

1)  Has JESUS given you a "new name," and if so, what is it?

2)  Do you read Russian/Cyrillic, and if so, are you able to translate it into English?

Thank you.

Greetings Anonymous,

I'm afraid I do not understand to what end your questions are leading to. Therefore I will politely refrain from answering them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/3/2018 at 1:26 PM, seeking_truth_1 said:

Quite the contrary... That's the cult of molokanism and all other cults view

Who do YOU say Jesus is?

Is He Immanuel?  God With Us?

14  "Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel.

Did He Dwell among us?

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Who is the Word ( The Logos)?

Reference John 1:1

 

 

 

This too you managed to ignore

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Greetings Anonymous,

I'm afraid I do not understand to what end your questions are leading to. Therefore I will politely refrain from answering them.

Your politeness is appreciated, however, the questions posed are relative to your explanations of mgr's claims, and the importance of interpreting his claims "accurately."

Examples:

Quote

Ahmed Ulia is a name/title of the Holy Spirit fulfilling the will of Him (Christ) who sent me (MGR) for one thousand years. MGR 8:2:7. It is only within this context that you can interpret the 2nd Article of Book 8 accurately.

Quote

Regarding MGR 13:6:1-2. Here MGR is simply conveying to us the new name of Jesus Christ, which is - Firm God, King of the Promise and Prince of the age hereafter. Isa 9:6. This new name has been written upon/given to him. Scripture is full of passages that state that the name of God and of His Son, will be written upon every believer. Each believer also will have various ranks of service and will be called by various new names and/or titles. Rev 14:1 - Then I looked, and behold, the Lamb was standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His name and the name of His Father written on their foreheads. Dan 9:19 - For Your own sake, O my God, do not delay, because Your city and Your people are called by Your name. Num 6:27 - And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them….

Question #1 --- is directly related to your explanation concerning mgr's "new name" (Ahmed Ulia) which you believe is "a name/title of the Holy Spirit," and "the new name of Jesus Christ...." and its being written upon/given to mgr...."This new name has been written upon/given to him"---as well as your supportive statement---"Scripture is full of passages that state that the name of God and of His Son, will be written upon every believer."  Hence, the question---have you, presumably a believer, been given a "new name," and if so, what is it?

Question #2 --- is directly related to your ability in reading (and understanding) mgr's memoirs in Russian/Cyrillic, and translating them into English.

Simple questions that shouldn't require much effort on your part---only "truthful" answers since you have, in so many words, made a distinction between seeking and yourself, as one who is filled with THE SPIRIT of TRUTH thus speaks "truth" not "falsehood."

Thank you for taking the time to respond.

 

P.S.  BTW, FYI --- the "to" in your below statement is misspelled; it should be "too" meaning: more than enough; excessively:

Quote

To begin with, "inconsistency," is spelt with an E, not an A. The word "Quran" also does not have two U's.....As I am now repeating myself way to often. As already stated, "an earmark of a fool is one who refuses to listen and accurately portray his opponents views."

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
3 hours ago, anonymous said:

Your politeness is appreciated, however, the questions posed are relative to your explanations of mgr's claims, and the importance of interpreting them "accurately."

Examples:

Question 1) --- is directly related to your explanation concerning mgr's "new name" (Ahmed Ulia) which you believe is "a name/title of the Holy Spirit," and "the new name of Jesus Christ....This new name has been written upon/given to him"---as well as your supportive statement---"Scripture is full of passages that state that the name of God and of His Son, will be written upon every believer."  Hence, the question---have you, presumably a believer, been given a "new name," and if so, what is it?

Question 2) --- is directly related to your ability in reading (and understanding) mgr's memoirs in Russian/Cyrillic, and translating them into English.

Simple questions that shouldn't require much effort on your part---only "truthful" answers as you have made a distinction between seeking and yourself, as one who is filled with THE SPIRIT of TRUTH.

Thank you for taking the time to respond.

Greetings Anonymous.

Your questions were quite simple and clear enough. But I believe you have misunderstood what I had stated.

I still do not know to what end your two questions are leading to. My reasons for wanting to know are:

1) I do not know you.

2) My own personal experiences are not something that needs to be on the internet.

3) After studying/researching your threads/responses on this site, it is apparent to me that you are quite keen on using "leading questions."

Therefore, if you have a statement to make, then make it. I will respond accordingly. If it is of benefit to the discussion. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
13 hours ago, anonymous said:

P.S.  BTW, FYI --- the "to" in your below statement is misspelled; it should be "too" meaning: more than enough; excessively:

P.S. Thank you for taking the time (which I know is valuable) to comb through my messages and finding this error in "grammar."

"To" was not "misspelled." It was "misapplied."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Greetings Anonymous.

Your questions were quite simple and clear enough. But I believe you have misunderstood what I had stated.

I still do not know to what end your two questions are leading to. My reasons for wanting to know are:

1) I do not know you.

2) My own personal experiences are not something that needs to be on the internet.

3) After studying/researching your threads/responses on this site, it is apparent to me that you are quite keen on using "leading questions."

Therefore, if you have a statement to make, then make it. I will respond accordingly. If it is of benefit to the discussion.

Guest new name,

What you stated initially was understood very well. 

RE:  Your above "reasons"

1)  You do not know anonymous---but neither does anonymous know you---and in the event you hadn't noticed, this is an "Anonymous" Discussion Group, hence your reason is irrelevant.

2)  If you are referring to anonymous' question 2) concerning your ability to read (and understand) Russian/Cyrillic, and translate it into English, as one of your "own personal experiences" that does not need to be on the Internet, and the reason for not responding to the question---that is your prerogative of course, but limits a serious discussion with you (as has been with every mgr devotee who's come onto this forum) concerning mgr's memoirs, in which he makes the claims he did---and frankly, is futile/pointless thus not worth the time nor effort to engage in such discussion.

3)  Even if anonymous posed what are, in your opinion, "leading questions," why should this be a problem if you speak "truth" not "falsehood"?  After all, in your own words: "A man of the 'truth,' should state the 'truth,' and prove to all that he does indeed, have the indwelling of the 'Spirit of Truth' within him."

To the point:  It has become even more apparent with your "reasons" listed above, that you are yet another mgr devotee who is fearful of facing the fact/truth that his beloved hero/leader/mentor was not everything he claimed to be, but that according to THE HOLY SCRIPTURES, he was simply one of many counterfeit/fraudulent/imposter/wannabe "Christs/Messiahs" whom JESUS warned HIS disciples about (Matthew 24:4-5; Mark 13:6; Luke 21:7-8).  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
54 minutes ago, anonymous said:

Guest new name,

What you stated initially was understood very well. 

RE:  Your above "reasons"

1)  You do not know anonymous---but neither does anonymous know you---and in the event you hadn't noticed, this is an "Anonymous" Discussion Group, hence your reason is irrelevant.

2)  If you are referring to anonymous' question 2) concerning your ability to read (and understand) Russian/Cyrillic, and translate it into English, as one of your "own personal experiences" that does not need to be on the Internet, and the reason for not responding to the question---that is your prerogative of course, but limits a serious discussion with you (as has been with every mgr devotee who's come onto this forum) concerning mgr's memoirs, in which he makes the claims he did---and frankly, is futile/pointless thus not worth the time nor effort to engage in such discussion.

3)  Even if anonymous posed what are, in your opinion, "leading questions," why should this be a problem if you speak "truth" not "falsehood"?  After all, in your own words: "A man of the 'truth,' should state the 'truth,' and prove to all that he does indeed, have the indwelling of the 'Spirit of Truth' within him."

To the point:  It has become even more apparent with your "reasons" listed above, that you are yet another mgr devotee who is fearful of facing the fact/truth that his beloved hero/leader/mentor was not everything he claimed to be, but that according to THE HOLY SCRIPTURES, he was simply one of many counterfeit/fraudulent/imposter/wannabe "Christs/Messiahs" whom JESUS warned HIS disciples about (Matthew 24:4-5; Mark 13:6; Luke 21:7-8).  

Greetings Anonymous.

In regards to reason 1. I need not know you personally in order to engage with you, nor do I need to know your name, which is kept Anonymous for your own “personal reasons,” hence your name...and if you want to keep it that way, that is your right. However, it is “relevant” to “me” because I do not know where “you’re” leading these questions to. It is a reasonable request to make in my view and in the view of many I believe. 

In regards to reason 2. I am not referring to your second question but to the first. However I do agree with you that a serious discussion regarding MGR’s texts should be examined from the Russian text alone, from which should be drawn all conclusions.

In regards to reason 3. I am glad you admit that they are indeed “leading questions.” Which I assume, are “leading” me to a destination that “you” want to take me to (you spoke of yourself in the third person and so will I). Before I answer, I would like to know what that destination is. 

Your final point only exposes what your real intentions are. Because before I even had a chance to address your future statement, you begin to accuse/slander me with an unprovable assumption on your part, in that I am somehow “fearful.” On the contrary, I look “forward to it.” If I have misrepresented your intentions, I do not do so intentionally. 

I also must beseech you, before you proceed with any slander (making a false statement in order to damage a reputation), consider the words of John 13:34, which state for people to love one another. It is only within this true love, that slander will not tempt either one of us. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

Greetings Anonymous.

In regards to reason 1. I need not know you personally in order to engage with you, nor do I need to know your name, which is kept Anonymous for your own “personal reasons,” hence your name...and if you want to keep it that way, that is your right. However, it is “relevant” to “me” because I do not know where “you’re” leading these questions to. It is a reasonable request to make in my view and in the view of many I believe. 

In regards to reason 2. I am not referring to your second question but to the first. However I do agree with you that a serious discussion regarding MGR’s texts should be examined from the Russian text alone, from which should be drawn all conclusions.

In regards to reason 3. I am glad you admit that they are indeed “leading questions.” Which I assume, are “leading” me to a destination that “you” want to take me to (you spoke of yourself in the third person and so will I). Before I answer, I would like to know what that destination is. 

Your final point only exposes what your real intentions are. Because before I even had a chance to address your future statement, you begin to accuse/slander me with an unprovable assumption on your part, in that I am somehow “fearful.” On the contrary, I look “forward to it.” If I have misrepresented your intentions, I do not do so intentionally. 

I also must beseech you, before you proceed with any slander (making a false statement in order to damage a reputation), consider the words of John 13:34, which state for people to love one another. It is only within this true love, that slander will not tempt either one of us.

Guest newname,

It appears you are "making a mountain out of a molehill" regarding your reluctance to respond to a couple of very simple questions, but be that as it may, if you feel it is that "relevant" to "you" because you do not know where anonymous' questions are going, so be it---your deal is your deal.

If as you say, you agree that a serious discussion regarding mgr's memoirs should be examined from the Russian text alone, why the wariness of anonymous' question 2)?  Why not a simple honest/truthful "yes" or "no" response?  In which case if a "yes," there would be consideration by anonymous in dialoguing concerning mgr's claims, and if a "no," there wouldn't be---no need to exaggerate the matter.  In fact, the truth of the matter is that the question was posed for the very reason of determining whether or not a serious discussion with you (one of a number of mgr's devotees that has come onto this forum) concerning mgr's memoirs is feasible.  Would you have responded if the question were more detailed, and s-p-e-l-l-e-d out the reason for the inquiry---e.g., Do you read Russian/Cyrillic, and if so, are you able to translate it into English?  I-f  y-o-u  d-o, d-i-a-l-o-g-u-i-n-g  c-o-n-c-e-r-n-i-n-g  m-g-r-'s  c-l-a-i-m-s  m-a-y  e-n-s-u-e;  i-f  n-o-t, n-o  p-o-i-n-t  i-n  d-o-i-n-g  s-o.  Would the "destination" of where anonymous' questions were "leading" be clear enough?

Anonymous' "final point" exposes a conclusion based on years of experience in interacting with mgr's devotees and their avoidance/reluctance/resistance in answering questions which they fear, yes, fear, will expose their beloved hero/leader/mentor's teachings as "falsehoods/lies/untruths."  If that were not the case, there would be no problem on your end in responding to the questions, be they "leading" (real or imagined---italics emphasized) or otherwise; speaking "truth" would more than suffice in proving otherwise.   Now if you were truly "looking forward to it" as you say, you would be more than willing to begin the process of engaging in dialogue by initially answering the questions.   (BTW, in your haste and/or oversight, you assumed anonymous admitted the questions were "leading," but if you read anonymous' statement carefully and objectively---"Even if anonymous posed what are, in your opinion, "leading questions...."---you would have noticed the phrase "in your opinion," and perhaps would not have made the erroneous assumption.)

RE:  Slander

What would you call your treatment of seeking in your responses to him?

Your statement---"If I have misrepresented your intentions, I do not do so intentionally"---is duly noted as it was never anonymous' intention to "make a false statement in order to damage a reputation" (aka slander)---yours or anyone's for that matter.  To be clear---exposure of falsehoods/lies/untruths and those who propagate, defend, support, and perpetuate them, is not "slander"---it is love of THE TRUTH (John 14:6a) first and foremost, and consequently love for the deluded/misguided fellow creature created in the image of THE LORD, and the impetus for---teaching, reproof, correction, and training in righteousness. (2 Timothy 3:16) 

John 13:34 considered---if you are willing to answer the questions, anonymous is willing to listen---and perhaps serious dialoguing concerning mgr's memoirs can commence....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
1 hour ago, anonymous said:

Guest newname,

It appears you are "making a mountain out of a molehill" regarding your reluctance to respond to a couple of very simple questions, but be that as it may, if you feel it is that "relevant" to "you" because you do not know where anonymous' questions are going, so be it---your deal is your deal.

If as you say, you agree that a serious discussion regarding mgr's memoirs should be examined from the Russian text alone, why the wariness of anonymous' question 2)?  Why not a simple honest/truthful "yes" or "no" response?  In which case if a "yes," there would be consideration by anonymous in dialoguing concerning mgr's claims, and if a "no," there wouldn't be---no need to exaggerate the matter.  In fact, the truth of the matter is that the question was posed for the very reason of determining whether or not a serious discussion with you (one of a number of mgr's devotees that has come onto this forum) concerning mgr's memoirs is feasible.  Would you have responded if the question were more detailed, and s-p-e-l-l-e-d out the reason for the inquiry---e.g., Do you read Russian/Cyrillic, and if so, are you able to translate it into English?  I-f  y-o-u  d-o, d-i-a-l-o-g-u-i-n-g  c-o-n-c-e-r-n-i-n-g  m-g-r-'s  c-l-a-i-m-s  m-a-y  e-n-s-u-e;  i-f  n-o-t, n-o  p-o-i-n-t  i-n  d-o-i-n-g  s-o.  Would the "destination" of where anonymous' questions were "leading" be clear enough?

Anonymous' "final point" exposes a conclusion based on years of experience in interacting with yet another of mgr's devotees and their avoidance/reluctance/resistance in answering questions which they fear, yes, fear, will expose their beloved hero/leader/mentor's teachings as "falsehoods/lies/untruths."  If that were not the case, there would be no problem on your end in responding to the questions, be they "leading" (real or imagined---italics emphasized) or otherwise; speaking "truth" would more than suffice in proving otherwise.   Now if you were truly "looking forward to it" as you say, you would be more than willing to begin the process of engaging in dialogue by initially answering the questions.   (BTW, in your haste and/or oversight, you assumed anonymous admitted the questions were "leading," but if you read anonymous' statement carefully and objectively---"Even if anonymous posed what are, in your opinion, "leading questions...."---you would have noticed the phrase "in your opinion," and perhaps would not have made the erroneous assumption.)

RE:  Slander

What would you call your treatment of seeking in your responses to him?

Your statement---"If I have misrepresented your intentions, I do not do so intentionally"---is duly noted as it was never anonymous' intention to "make a false statement in order to damage a reputation" (aka slander)---yours or anyone's for that matter.  To be clear---exposure of falsehoods/lies/untruths and those who propagate, defend, support, and perpetuate them, is not "slander"---it is "love" for the deluded/misguided person(s) and impetus for---teaching, reproof, correction, and training in righteousness. (2 Timothy 3:16) 

John 13:34 considered---if you are willing to answer the questions, anonymous is willing to listen---and perhaps serious dialoguing concerning mgr's memoirs can commence....

Greetings Anonymous.

Hardly a "mountain out of a molehill" as you put it. I have based my responses on a somewhat thorough overview of your previous posts on this forum, as well as your interaction with all participants within. To say that you have a track record of "being nice" would be a stretch. Although to your credit, you apply it evenly across the board. Therefore, with more important things in life to attend to, my participation on this forum will be limited.

Despite the obvious  "sarcasm" and  "mild sneer" you put forth, by "s-p-e-l-l-i-n-g" things out for me; you did give some ground this time in providing a valid reason. Therefore my Russian language proficiency (including the archaic script of MGR and his contemporaries) will not be of any hinderance in any point or statement you may put forth. You can be assured of that. To be frank, I agree with you that many of who you call "MGR devotees" have not represented themselves very well here on this forum. Although based on a scan of the threads, there were a few a while back that did put forth valid and solid rebuttals to various topics put forth by detractors. 

Of course I take exception to the claims you make regarding the "falsehoods/lies/untruths" of MGR. The same ball can be thrown back into your court regarding a myriad of "falsehoods/lies/untruths" that your own persuasion has to fess up to on a daily basis. This kind of game can be played both ways. In my own experience dealing with your kind, the subject tends to be shifted continuously until everyone is chasing their tail in circles.

I also see how on this forum in the past 10+ years, you have attacked the character and identities of various individuals with many false and slanderous accusations, some of which I know personally to be untrue. These have been downloaded and saved for my records.

 

P.S. The fact is, my treatment of "Seeking Truth" was completely valid. It is my view that he is nothing but a troll, who purposely sets forth to see who he can "annoy" next. The very fact that he has never (to the best of my knowledge) admitted that he was ever wrong or that he deliberately misuses various texts in these discussions is a very telling sign to any objective individual. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/11/2018 at 6:22 AM, seeking_truth_1 said:

Who do YOU say Jesus is?

Is He Immanuel?  God With Us?

14  "Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel.

Did He Dwell among us?

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

Who is the Word ( The Logos)?

Reference John 1:1

How is this "trolling"?

This should be easy to answer for a Christian UNLESS your cult hold views you either agree with or are unwilling to speak out against because it requre you to admit you're participating in a lie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Guest newname,

Your most current response will be taken as a "green light" for a serious discussion concerning mgr's memoirs.  Prior to actually doing so however, a qualifying question must be answered by "your kind"---

Do you accept and believe THE HOLY SCRIPTURES (Old & New Testaments---66 books/40 authors) to be the inerrant infallible word of THE LORD GOD, and the final authority with respect to---absolute truth?

 

P.S.  With reference to your statement:

Quote

Therefore, with more important things in life to attend to, my participation on this forum will be limited.

The condescending "hedging your bets" type of statement above is typically made by mgr's devotees like yourself in order to justify their retreat and/or silence when their arguments in defense of mgr's claims are proven by THE HOLY SCRIPTURES to be erroneous/false.

Which raises the question (and yes, there will be questions throughout our exchange)---

Why are you participating on this forum at all (when there are "more important things in life to attend to")---what is your objective/purpose in doing so?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
6 hours ago, anonymous said:

Guest newname,

Your most current response will be taken as a "green light" for a serious discussion concerning mgr's memoirs.  Prior to actually doing so however, a qualifying question must be answered by "your kind"---

Do you accept and believe THE HOLY SCRIPTURES (Old & New Testaments---66 books/40 authors) to be the inerrant infallible word of THE LORD GOD, and the final authority with respect to---absolute truth?

 

P.S.  With reference to your statement:

The condescending "hedging your bets" type of statement above is typically made by mgr's devotees like yourself in order to justify their retreat and/or silence when their arguments in defense of mgr's claims are proven by THE HOLY SCRIPTURES to be erroneous/false.

Which raises the question (and yes, there will be questions throughout our exchange)---

Why are you participating on this forum at all---what is your objective/purpose in doing so?

Greetings Anonymous.

Relevant questions are always welcomed and encouraged. This question indeed is one of the main core issues that separates myself from you in nearly all aspects.

As you already know...the Molokan faith, which origins stem back to the reign of Ivan the Terrible (Грозный) in the middle of the 1500s, has always used and formulated its teachings from the Eastern/Greek Canon tradition. To be even more specific, the Old Church Slavonic text (Церковнославянский), and later the Russian Synodal. Therefore, my Bible, the HOLY SCRIPTURES, consists of the Old & New Testaments, containing --- 77 books, and not the 66 books that are currently within your Protestant Canon.

The Molokan sect, certainly can be, and is, considered a "Protestant" movement within the Russian tradition, as they did "protest" the traditions and unbiblical practices of the Russian Orthodox Church. However they cannot be classified in the same vein as Western Reformers, nor within Western thought. A study of the Eastern Canon traditions, will quickly point out the fact, that they did not lend themselves to the idea of a "Canon" in the same manner as the west. One snippet of evidence for this, is that nearly all Eastern Churches disagree and vary with one another in regards to their own canons. Therefore we do not subscribe to your heavy usage of Western Protestant verbiage, such as  --- inerrant infallible word or final authority; all of which is rooted within the context of the Protestant Reformation in Europe. Within the "Molokan" context, however, the original founder of what today is called "Molokanism" was Semeon Uklein, who stated within his original statement of faith: "At the present time, the true Christian church is composed of only true spiritual Christians, who do not accept traditions, nor the decisions of the councils, nor the writings of the teachers respected by the church; but only confess to that which is taught in the Bible." I agree with his statement. MGR himself states: "My male-friends and female-friends! I beseech all of you together: Watch that you hold fast to the commandments of the Holy Scriptures of the Old and New Testaments according to the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ..." (MGR 4:9:6.)

The Holy Scriptures also state the following:

"All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness." (2 Tim 3:16.)

To sum up, the Bible is indeed inspired of God, and is inerrant in the original autographs. But unfortunately, as you well know, we do not have the original autographs, nor are we certain that we have an error free copy of the Bible in any form today. This is why our Lord, Christ Jesus, stated unto His Apostles:

"However, when the Spirit of truth comes, He will guide you into all truth. For He will not speak on His own, but He will speak what He hears, and He will declare to you what is to come." (John 16:13.)

It is ultimately God and His Holy Spirit that guides mankind unto all truth. The Bible as we have it today contains the words of God, and should be used for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, as it itself states. Therefore God is the ultimate authority.

 

P.S. With reference to your statement about my statement:

The statement was not intended to be condescending. Some of us have jobs to do, more important things to do, such as spending time with family, working, living the life that God has given us. I do not take pleasure in spending vast amounts of time (this took me an hour) on the internet, arguing with apostates (for lake of a better word), which never lead to anything productive. I would also ask you (politely) to "cut out" your portrayal of myself as somehow "hedging a bet" to "retreat," as you put it. I can throw that right back at you and state that you're simply guilty of ad hominem. If the "truth" lives in you, aka the Spirit of Truth, then you won't need to smear me beforehand to get your point across. 

The "truth" is, I never intended to participate in this forum for very long. My original intention/objective was to correct "Seeking Truth" in his deliberate mischaracterization of the texts he quoted out of context. If you wish to dialogue regarding those texts I am more then open. However, like I told Seeking, time does not permit me to explore every dubious passage or write an entire volume of commentary for everyone at their behest. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest guest

all of us who refrain to answer the word that isnt given in the name and spirit of christ choose to do so because, would you respond to the preaching of the antichrist (satan) (666 false christian faiths)? or would you accept the criticism just as christ did as well as our beloved predkie? I approach you in the name of Christ. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/13/2018 at 11:30 PM, Guest newname said:

<<snip>>

The "truth" is, I never intended to participate in this forum for very long. My original intention/objective was to correct "Seeking Truth" in his deliberate mischaracterization of the texts he quoted out of context. If you wish to dialogue regarding those texts I am more then open. However, like I told Seeking, time does not permit me to explore every dubious passage or write an entire volume of commentary for everyone at their behest. 

By the way, you failed to correct anything offering only opinions not based in the Bible

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
9 hours ago, anonymous said:

Hello???  Guest newname???  Are you there???

A little quick on the trigger wouldn't you say???

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

A little quick on the trigger wouldn't you say???

Not at all---just giving you a taste of your own medicine---and a FYI that you're not unique in that everyone has a life and responsibilities that accompany that life.

Now---for the readers who may not be aware, would you be kind enough to list the eleven (11) books in your Bible---ones which are not included in the "Protestant Canon"?

Thank you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
5 hours ago, anonymous said:

Not at all---just giving you a taste of your own medicine---and a FYI that you're not unique in that everyone has a life and responsibilities that accompany that life.

Now---for the readers who may not be aware, would you be kind enough to list the eleven (11) books in your Bible---ones which are not included in the "Protestant Canon"---and how their inclusion affected mgr's claims (the topic pending discussion)?

Thank you.

Greetings Anonymous. 

The only reason that you would post those statements in this thread would be to further your false narrative. In that, by responding 8 hours and 25 minutes late, I was somehow fitting the M.O. (Modus Operandi) of various Molokans (from which you are derivative) that you have engaged with on this anti-Molokan forum. By any normal measure of things, you did indeed "jump the gun." Although lets both be honest, my post and a few others took a few extra days to be approved by the admin. You assumed I took a few extra days to respond and posted a little reminder. Which was to be used as a way to portray myself to the readers as somehow evading, avoiding and/or forming a retreat. Therefore your statement of "not at all" is indeed false. As to what kind of medicine I've been dishing out. Not sure what you even mean, but I digress.

Although all people have life and responsibilities, they do not have have them in equal measure. Meaning that not everybody has a full plate of responsibility. Retirees with pension money are less busy then working family men making things meet. This is a fact. Not everyone shares the same responsibilities. So seeing as you have no idea what my personal circumstances are, you would be best not to "jump the gun" again and assume anything. 

As for the list of books in the Russian Synodal Bible; they are all found within the table of contents of the RSV or NSRV translations of the Holy Scriptures, minus 4th Maccabees. For anyone not aware, they can easily look this information up themselves. The structure and individual placement of all the Old Testament books are also unique to any other Bible that I am aware of.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While waiting for Guest newname to respond (or not) to anonymous’ request to provide the eleven (11) books included in his Bible and not in the “Protestant Canon,” let us review his explanations concerning mgr’s “new name” claim (Ahmed Ulia).  However, before getting started---

RE:  Guilty of ad hominem

It would do him good if Guest newname would review his own disparaging remarks:

Quote

In my own experience dealing with your kind.....arguing with apostates.....

RE:  Smearing

Not in the least---only stating a precedent set by Guest newname’s maximist compatriots.

Since Guest newname made it a point to point out spelling/typos in seeking’s posts---responding in kind, here are a couple of his own for Guest newname to mull over:

“….for lack (not lake) of a better word….”

“….dialogue regarding those texts I am more than (not then) open….” meaning: in comparison or contrast with---(not then) meaning: at that time; next in time, space, or order; immediately afterward, etc.

Now onto mgr’s claims in light of THE HOLY SCRIPTURES.

We will begin with revisiting Guest newname’s explanations regarding mgr’s “new name” (Ahmed Ulia), and anonymous’ original question 1) to Guest newname concerning his (Guest newname’s) “new name” (if, as previously stated, presumably Guest newname is a believer), which question is directly related to his explanation of [mgr’s] “new name” (Ahmed Ulia).  

According to Guest newname’s explanation:

  •       Ahmed Ulia is---a name/title of THE HOLY SPIRIT
  • Ahmed Ulia’s [full name] aka Enfayil Savahan Ulia, is---the new name (singular) of JESUS [THE] CHRIST

To support his explanation, Guest newname presented the following SCRIPTURAL references:

"Then I looked, and behold, THE LAMB was standing on Mount Zion, and with HIM one hundred and forty-four thousand, having HIS name and the name of HIS FATHER written on their foreheads." (Revelation 14:1)

"For YOUR own sake, O my GOD, do not delay, because YOUR city and YOUR people are called by YOUR name." (D a n i e l  9:19)

"And they shall put MY name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them…." (Numbers 6:27)

If we keep in view Guest newname’s explanation of mgr’s “new name” in light of the SCRIPTURAL references he provided above, and take his explanation to its logical conclusion---the answer to anonymous’ original question 1) concerning Guest newname’s own “new name” (which question he never answered) is---Ahmed Ulia.

Why this conclusion? 

Based on his statements--- 

Quote

Scripture is full of passages that state that the name of God and of His Son, will be written upon every believer Each believer also will have various ranks of service and will be called by various new names and/or titles.

---at least one “new name” of each/every believer would be---Ahmed Ulia, because again, according to Guest newname, that name is “….a name/title of the Holy Spirit….and….the new name (singular) of Jesus Christ”---and in light of the SCRIPTURAL passages Guest newname provided, THE LORD GOD’S people (past, present, future) will bear HIS NAME and THE NAME of HIS SON (JESUS [THE] CHRIST).

So Guest newname shouldn’t be taken aback or offended if we address him (and his maximist brethren) by his/their “new name” of---Ahmed Ulia.

A joyful heart is good medicine…” (Proverbs 17:22a) 

In modern-day vernacular---“Laughter is good medicine for the soul….”  

 

P.S. BTW, there is nothing---overtly stated or inferred---in the SCRIPTURAL passages provided by Guest newname in support of his statement---“Each believer also will have various ranks of service and will be called by various new names and/or titles.”  This is pure conjecture aka what appears to be “truth” in Ahmed Ulia's world.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Included in Ahmed Ulia’s (aka Guest newname) explanation of Ahmed Ulia (mgr’s “new name”), was the reference to Ahmed Ulia's (mgr’s "new name") claim that he was sent by JESUS to fulfill HIS will for---one thousand years:

Quote

Ahmed Ulia is a name/title of the Holy Spirit fulfilling the will of Him (Christ) who sent me (MGR) for one thousand years.

This “one thousand years” of course, refers to the millennial (1000-year) KINGDOM of JESUS [THE] CHRIST found in the book of Revelation (20:2-7).

To avoid burdening Ahmed Ulia (aka Guest newname) with the time-consuming task of translating Ahmed Ulia’s (mgr’s “new name”) original unedited memoirs into English (although Russian version is available for posting on the forum upon request) because of his time constraints, an already-translated English version of mgr’s perversion of JESUS’ 1000-year KINGDOM, is provided here---yes, here again is the ugly truth concerning mgr's devotees’ beloved hero/leader/mentor/shepherd, etc., which they cannot nor will not face or fess up to: 

Quote

“This is about all of my newly acquired wives who I will write about here, in detail, about their union and separation from me. To begin with, I'll mention how they were first joined to me and how, at that time, we were publicly joined in wedlock, by God himself and the Spirit of His Christ, together with the blessing given by laying on of hands of all their parents and also the prophetic word of the witness and activity of the spirit through Emilian, the prophet, who publicly joined me to them by the union of our willing flaming love, producing an eternal, unseparable, holy new covenant, like a key and its lock, and the immortal life in both our loins, for 1000 years.

“It is also necessary to remind you, my beloved wives, Marafina and Sterafina, that you are my own bone and flesh. God has joined us and no man can separate us. Stand upon this foundation. I am your eternal husband. Seek in no one else a husband for yourself. Where can you find anyone who can separate our eternal wedlock, inspired union and my precious love? Would he escape alive from my flaming hot jealousy over you, which you yourselves heard with your own ears? I said unto you in Alexanderpol, before all the people, that you are my wives. Because I was twice born, I married twice. I showed you to all the people saying, ‘This is my first wife, named Marafina, and this is my second wife, named Sterafina.’ I said this by inspiration and not of myself. You must remember this and tell all others about it. You are to say, ‘We are his wives eternally and his queens for the grace-filled 1000-year kingdom of Christ on earth.’ Not man, but God himself shall reveal, throughout every place under heaven, this, our new enlightenment.” (4.11, from the beginning, mgr)

dhs’ preface from his 1971 work copy:

“This section from the originals of Maxim G. Rudometkin starts at the beginning of that which is called the forteenth (14) book, third (3) chapter in the 1928 edition of the Spirit and Life. And continues until the end of the bk 14 manuscript. (Contains chap 3, 4, 2:1 - XIII, 7:1 - 3 3/4, & 27)”

For this reason, we, in his holy union, all ate and drank together and almost all slept in the same bed together and verily, in this holy matrimony, we all kissed and thrust together, producing great joy, as the spirit inspired us to do and as is befitting any everlasting wedlock. But the key was not put into the lock, for the time had not yet come for that. God had not yet told us to do that, just as in Adam and Eve's case in the Paradise. This was done by the serpent, but not by God, so I stood strong and did not allow their will, before the proper time, to taste of the forbidden fruit and did not give them the key. But I waited for all of that as God, by the spirit, had told me to do. To this then are many witnesses, almost all of my chosen people who believe in me.

And they were all completely happy with these, my spiritual marriages, and willing to wait for intercourse with me, as I was their holy husband. The first of these, my beloved wives, was Stenya and Varya and the rest like unto them, who now in my absence, inspired by Satan himself and without taking account of our eternal holy new marriage, almost all of them, suddenly, because of their defiled lustfulness, have lifted their adulterous tails to the dogs like a bitch in heat. And all of them took themselves husbands who are not their lawful husbands but adulterous sons of Satan in bodily form, for which reason in these god-despised mismatches, they now indulge in adultery, like unclean beasts or defiled swine, and have become demon-possessed, by God's will.

For this reason, any children born of them are cursed or like the bastard children of prostitutes and all of these unlawful children are consigned, by God, to everlasting death without chance of resurrection, as it is written, without respite. And anyone who, today, will beat them, God will make holy for it. 

It would have been better for all of you, my new wives, to have never known this, my new path, which is eternal for all who walk it rightly. For it is true, not false, just like an arrow, straight to Zion, destined. But you did not desire it but chose, instead, to go the way of adultery, like cattle with bulls or you with your cursed husbands. You have forgotten me, your God-annointed husband and king. For you all know very well what my spirit always clearly told you that you would not seek another husband besides me and not to give your virginity or holy Eve-like chastity to any deceiving serpent but only to me, your Adam. For what you had secreted in you was meant only for me, your God-given husband. 

For this reason, I am filled with wrath for you, for you have all defiled yourselves and joined yourselves with cursed demons everywhere and I can have patience with you no longer.  Only because of your need for salvation will I change my curse upon you but your husbands and children will eternally be cursed of me, and them, I will wipe off the face of the earth. But you, I'll again receive eternally, as wives, so as not to gratify this evil spirit of Satan, or to say, Simon Rudakoff and Maxim Plenin and Vasili Sikitin, for I remember that you were my eternal wives and concubines, like King Solomon within his worldwide kingdom. Although it is very repugnant and defiling this, your devilish evil, in which you, in my absence, allowed demons to be delivered into you, but I will clean all of this with the sword and fire, off of your outer man, but inwardly I will apply my own salve and heal you down there.  Then, in the wrath of my spirit, for your defilement of me, through your demon-possessed adultery, I'll give you all different names…not good names but perverted and even foul ones. 

First, Stenkoo, I will name Idessa, in that she, for the longest time, in my absence, was compelled to lie entirely [under the demon] for the sake of his demonic adultery.

And likewise, Varookhoo, I will name Akhvatoosya, in that she, in her own desire, because of her own adultery, stretched herself fully naked, completely for the demon. 

Leksookhoo, I will name Pikhtoosya, in that she disobeyed me and found for herself, for the sake of powerful adultery, right to the very bottom, the pushy demon.

Doonookhoo, I will name Nakhmanisa, in that she, without my permission, the swine, stretched her ass willfully, right onto the demon. 

Vasookhoo, I will name Akhtanisa, in that she, in carnal adultery, fell in love, willfully, directly with the demon.

Manookhoo, I will name Zhamelyoosya, in that she, willfully, adulterously, allowed [into herself] the hot demon.

Groonyookhoo, I will name Pertagoosya, in that she, not of her own initiative, with the love of her flogged ass lifted [it] up for adultery for a fat demon. All of you equally, bypassed me and strongly defiled yourselves in this eternal demonic adultery.

For this reason, you are not worthy to receive, with me, the primary glory in Israel and to be called with the holy seven names, according to the count of the seven spirits of God, which had been appointed to you by me before the creation of the world. Verily, these names will be given to my other new wives who are undefiled virgins, but you, I appoint now to only please me in physical union, or to more directly say, with such pumping of your much-used, broken woman's stomachs. The children I will begat through you will be everlastingly blessed, as David did to his wife when she returned home to him. 

But if any of you will not submit to me or have my children, then those, right now, together with their demon-husbands, I'll kill and I'll do the same thing with all those blasphemers and adulterers against this true spirit and those who hate me, the king of the world, like Simon and Levin, because of their sister, Denya, or like King David, because of his wife, Michal, or maybe even more harshly, as in David's 100th Psalm: 'For these adulterers, with others' wives, always have judgment of death placed on them by God Himself.' For as the holy Apostle Paul said, 'a woman is tied to her living husband, by the law, until his death and only then can she be joined to another.' 

And now, because of you and what you've done, I must again, a second time, choose out seven new wives, all chosen, undefiled virgins, which, for eternity, will not know the bed of another husband but me. And so I, their new husband, King, will place them over you like mistresses and queens according to the Psalm in which David sings about presenting a queen on your right, in luxurious raiment, and they will lead forth the king of virgins unto her, unto the house of the king and under the crown of the glory of all Israel....and immortality for all of us for 1000 years.  And so I, in my day, with the aid of the holy spirit and the will of my God, will give all seven of these, my new wives, eternal holy names according to the title of their new heavenly names, by the number of the seven spirits of God that eternally abide upon me." (book 14, beginning with article 3 to the end of the handwritten manuscript [of book 14], mgr)

"Command: A directive of the Spirit of Christ from the highest level, which is to say, the great God whose name is Enfael Savaghana Youlya, king of all the earth to be read and acknowledged by all those who believe in him, first of all, Emilian and Anna, the widow of Garasamitch (Klubnikin), then her daughter, Anna, my newly betrothed, with whom I was joined eternally in marriage union, physically, in which she is to always be called my beloved wife, Felhelya, only be careful not to compromise or defile yourself with anyone but me, your king of the jubilee, for I am your eternal husband and jealous in my wrath for any adultery amongst my new wives. Anyone who would touch any of you will die, no matter who he is, Amen. 

And so, after reading this spirit-inspired commandment, my friend, Emilian Enfaelovich, you are visibly to give her, from me, a verbal blessing with the laying on of your prophet hands on her head, with words of the giving of her title. `Be this young virgin, betrothed by name, Felhelya, with the rank of jubilee queen and always kept undefiled for your holy husband, named Felhiela, with the rank of jubilee king, and may you keep your holy bedchamber intact for the entire 1000 years, for your seed is holy, from which shall be born all kings and priests, servants of God on high.' 

Then you, Emilian, must at this time, give her a big kiss for me and lead her right to your own home, like a bride for me chosen, where I will consummate our marriage or, to say, become married with the crown of the blessing of God from on high and then you, Emilian, are to place us together in our bed so that we can, before you, complete this secret, together with the joyful tunes of my songs, being unashamed before the whole congregation and the other women and virgins belonging to me will also stand there in my bedchamber, singing new songs about my marriage to her, every day for 1000 years.

Contents of this new song: `I am your new wife, Felhelya, I am the mother and queen of Zion. I am to replace Maria, my sister. I was born for you, my beloved, to be your eternal wife of which Anna, my mother, did not know a thing about until today. Through this marriage to you, my holy king, I wish to wipe away all the sins of my father, Garasimova, and gain resurrection for all my dead relatives, to the third and fourth generation, and allow my mother to live in your home, with me, who you shall personally save from wrath. For truly, she is completely at fault before you, as are my brothers who all defiled themselves in like manner. Be not wrathful with them for they are my kindred and a part of the kingdom of New Israel. Let this, my song, always be a testimony before my God whom you, my king Felhiela, always served without trespassing his new law of love and law of judgment for the approaching new age and kingdom of peace on earth for 1000 years

And let our holy bedlife eternally reign in this physical love and insemination by us both, without end, in the labor of the spirit, and audible songs before all those standing in our bedroom.' Amen. Glory to our God, Amen. 

Then, this song, to be sung after our lovemaking is finished: `Amen. We thank you, Lord God Almighty, that you joined us so that we could enjoy ourselves in bed and for the physical passing of seed for the fulfillment, in us, of this great deed which you gave to Adam and Eve to do in the paradise, saying to them both, 'grow, multiply and fulfill the earth.' 

And today, Lord, you are faithful in all your words and none have been changed from the beginning, neither in heaven nor on earth. And we, your servants, willingly fulfill this labor of our marriage. We both ask you to grant us conception for the birth of a holy race which will inherit the earth as your sons and daughters, for I and my wife are both Gods of all the earth, Amen, verily.'

Then follows the congratulations for the marriage in `new flaming tongues' as each himself is directed, by the spirit, to speak in secret: `filfa, salma, xalmehar, youlxen, esvamel, darmehal, heendahoo.'" (book 10, between articles 17 and 18, mgr)

(The "sanitized" contents from the same books (10 & 14) found in dhs' 1983 translation (black book) will be presented later for comparison with the above unedited text from the originals, as prefaced by dhs himself in his 1971 work copy.)

QUESTION:  Does the above text even remotely resemble JESUS' millennial KINGDOM as described in THE HOLY SCRIPTURES?

If Ahmed Ulia (Guest newname) is willing to provide explanations and/or comments/remarks concerning Ahmed Ulia’s (mgr’s “new name”) perversion of JESUS’ [millennial] KINGDOM as seen in his unedited/unsanitized memoirs above---we are “all ears....”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest newname
On 2/18/2018 at 7:46 PM, anonymous said:

Not at all---just giving you a taste of your own medicine---and a FYI that you're not unique in that everyone has a life and responsibilities that accompany that life.

Now---for the readers who may not be aware, would you be kind enough to list the eleven (11) books in your Bible---ones which are not included in the "Protestant Canon"?

Thank you.

Admin, can you please check for my response to this post? It has not of yet appeared. Thank you. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great!  It appears Guest newname did respond after all---looking forward to his list....

In the meanwhile, the following is something else Ahmed Ulia (Guest newname) may or may not wish to address.

Here is the text from both mgr’s unedited/unsanitized originals, and dhs’ second edition (2005) of 1928 translation [of mgr’s originals] from Russian into English (black book)---for comparison:

Book 4, article 11, from the beginning---in mgr’s [unedited/unsanitized] originals:

Quote

“It is also necessary to remind you, my beloved wives, Marafina and Sterafina, that you are my own bone and flesh. God has joined us and no man can separate us. Stand upon this foundation. I am your eternal husband. Seek in no one else a husband for yourself. Where can you find anyone who can separate our eternal wedlock, inspired union and my precious love? Would he escape alive from my flaming hot jealousy over you, which you yourselves heard with your own ears? I said unto you in Alexanderpol, before all the people, that you are my wives. Because I was twice born, I married twice. I showed you to all the people saying, ‘This is my first wife, named Marafina, and this is my second wife, named Sterafina.’ I said this by inspiration and not of myself. You must remember this and tell all others about it. You are to say, ‘We are his wives eternally and his queens for the grace-filled 1000-year kingdom of Christ on earth.’ Not man, but God himself shall reveal, throughout every place under heaven, this, our new enlightenment.” (4.11, from the beginning, mgr)

Book 4, article 11, from the beginning---in dhs’ edited/sanitized second edition (2005) of the 1928 translation from Russian into English (black book):

Quote

Also I remind you, my beloved, that you are of one flesh and bone with me.  God Himself has joined us, man cannot sunder us; stand firmly upon the one foundation.  Do not look for someone else in another feature to sunder our eternal tie of spiritual union and precious love.  God Himself, and not a man, will reveal our radiance to all under heaven.” 

(More coming.....)

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Book 10, between articles 17 and 18---in mgr’s [unedited/unsanitized] originals:

Quote

"Command: A directive of the Spirit of Christ from the highest level, which is to say, the great god whose name is Enfael Savaghana Youlya, king of all the earth to be read and acknowledged by all those who believe in him, first of all, Emilian and Anna, the widow of Garasamitch (Klubnikin), then her daughter, Anna, my newly betrothed, with whom I was joined eternally in marriage union, physically, in which she is to always be called my beloved wife, Felhelya, only be careful not to compromise or defile yourself with anyone but me, your king of the jubilee, for I am your eternal husband and jealous in my wrath for any adultery amongst my new wives. Anyone who would touch any of you will die, no matter who he is, Amen.

And so, after reading this spirit-inspired commandment, my friend, Emilian Enfaelovich, you are visibly to give her, from me, a verbal blessing with the laying on of your prophet hands on her head, with words of the giving of her title. `Be this young virgin, betrothed by name, Felhelya, with the rank of jubilee queen and always kept undefiled for your holy husband, named Felhiela, with the rank of jubilee king, and may you keep your holy bedchamber intact for the entire 1000 years, for your seed is holy, from which shall be born all kings and priests, servants of God on high.' 

Then you, Emilian, must at this time, give her a big kiss for me and lead her right to your own home, like a bride for me chosen, where I will consummate our marriage or, to say, become married with the crown of the blessing of God from on high and then you, Emilian, are to place us together in our bed so that we can, before you, complete this secret, together with the joyful tunes of my songs, being unashamed before the whole congregation and the other women and virgins belonging to me will also stand there in my bedchamber, singing new songs about my marriage to her, every day for 1000 years.

Contents of this new song: `I am your new wife, Felhelya, I am the mother and queen of Zion. I am to replace Maria, my sister. I was born for you, my beloved, to be your eternal wife of which Anna, my mother, did not know a thing about until today. Through this marriage to you, my holy king, I wish to wipe away all the sins of my father, Garasimova, and gain resurrection for all my dead relatives, to the third and fourth generation, and allow my mother to live in your home, with me, who you shall personally save from wrath. For truly, she is completely at fault before you, as are my brothers who all defiled themselves in like manner. Be not wrathful with them for they are my kindred and a part of the kingdom of New Israel. Let this, my song, always be a testimony before my God whom you, my king Felhiela, always served without trespassing his new law of love and law of judgment for the approaching new age and kingdom of peace on earth for 1000 years. 

And let our holy bedlife eternally reign in this physical love and insemination by us both, without end, in the labor of the spirit, and audible songs before all those standing in our bedroom.' Amen. Glory to our God, Amen. 

Then, this song, to be sung after our lovemaking is finished: `Amen. We thank you, Lord God Almighty, that you joined us so that we could enjoy ourselves in bed and for the physical passing of seed for the fulfillment, in us, of this great deed which you gave to Adam and Eve to do in the paradise, saying to them both, 'grow, multiply and fulfill the earth.' 

And today, Lord, you are faithful in all your words and none have been changed from the beginning, neither in heaven nor on earth. And we, your servants, willingly fulfill this labor of our marriage. We both ask you to grant us conception for the birth of a holy race which will inherit the earth as your sons and daughters, for I and my wife are both Gods of all the earth, Amen, verily.'

Then follows the congratulations for the marriage in `new flaming tongues' as each himself is directed, by the spirit, to speak in secret: `filfa, salma, xalmehar, youlxen, esvamel, darmehal, heendahoo.'" (book 10, between articles 17 and 18, mgr)

Here are articles 17 and 18, respectively, from dhs’ edited/sanitized second edition (2005) of the 1928 translation from Russian into English (black book):

Quote

“O Emilian and Fitis!  Is it not time for you both to forsake all satanic business dealing and the ranks of dignity of the prince Beelzebul?  I did not compel you into bargaining, neither did I set you up as judges.  But it was the same devil incarnate who placed me, your lord, in a dungeon for your sakes.  May the Scripture of the Apocalypse be fulfilled upon me in detail, ‘Gracious are the dead who die in the Lord.  From henceforth, yes, says the Spirit, let them rest from their labors, for their works follow after them.’  In these works they lay down their soul for friends, just as I lay down my soul for all of you.  For if you both refuse to follow my instruction, it is evident I shall deal with you as my soul decrees: I shall deliver both of you unto my enemy for death by execution, without any eternal resurrection in your body unto the ending new life of the celestial Jerusalem!  Yes, amen.” (Article 17)

“This concerns the appointment of the two witnesses, the end of the kingdom of the best, the onset of the new spiritual peace for a thousand years, and the duration of the aforementioned Kingdom of Christ on the good land among the new Israel, patterned after the flaming love of the new life of a wedded couple, and where no adulterer shall dwell; and concerning the manifest descension to us upon the earth of the new, holy, heavenly city Jerusalem, where no anathema will be ever found.  Yes, amen.  Hearken unto all the new Words spoken to you concerning that which is soon to pass, and which the eyes of any vulture have not seen upon earth since the age, and which the deaf ear of the viper has not heard anywhere at any time, and every sinistral man with them likewise, except for me alone, your leader.  By the revelation of my God I came to know it in the Spirit in nightly visions, as vivid as my own face in a mirror.  I wish to reveal all of this of this to you, the new Israel, in these detailed lines; and more accurately show unto all of you the new path of the King my God, and the eternal procession upon it.  For it is honest as Abel, handsome as Joseph, and wise as D a n i e l.  Everyone who walks upon it will soon arrive in in Zion; for Zion is my beloved bride with whom I made a visible and eternal union through the Spirit of my God, like unto a groom and bride, or a young man and a young girl in love.  I and her (the bride) will surely bless all of you together; that you forever be members of Zion and leaders of the entire new house, because I have seen all of this clearly with my own eyes, and according to my understanding have harkened unto it by the spirit of the heart.  For the God of gods has appeared in Zion, and the Lord Sabaoth has sat upon His heavenly throne.  And I am His throne, manifestly setting beneath Him---named of the Spirit Ulesar, the image upon earth of the third feature, the heir to all the world according to the authority of the Holy Spirit.  This Spirit is always and everywhere my Lord.  For He gave unto me, His slave, the full authority of the new dominion, to possess and govern forever.  Wherewith Efim, the son of Gerasim, writes clearly in the Spirit that I am indeed a new king of Israel.  For this reason, at the present time I hold the victory over all adversaries of my God and the spirits of malice under heaven.” (Article 18)

Please observe and NOTE---mgr’s unedited/unsanitized original(s) text, between articles 17 and 18 above, was completely omitted in dhs’ edited/sanitized second edition (2005) of the 1928 translation from Russian into English (black book).

(More coming.....)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Book 14, beginning with article 3 to the end of the handwritten manuscript (book 14)---in mgr's originals---prefaced below by dhs himself in his 1971 work copy:

Quote

This section from the originals of Maxim G. Rudometkin starts at the beginning of that which is called the forteenth (14) book, third (3) chapter in the 1928 edition of the Spirit and Life. And continues until the end of the bk 14 manuscript. (Contains chap 3, 4, 2:1 - XIII, 7:1 - 3 3/4, & 27)

“This is about all of my newly acquired wives who I will write about here, in detail, about their union and separation from me. To begin with, I'll mention how they were first joined to me and how, at that time, we were publicly joined in wedlock, by God himself and the Spirit of His Christ, together with the blessing given by laying on of hands of all their parents and also the prophetic word of the witness and activity of the spirit through Emilian, the prophet, who publicly joined me to them by the union of our willing flaming love, producing an eternal, unseparable, holy new covenant, like a key and its lock, and the immortal life in both our loins, for 1000 years.

For this reason, we, in his holy union, all ate and drank together and almost all slept in the same bed together and verily, in this holy matrimony, we all kissed and thrust together, producing great joy, as the spirit inspired us to do and as is befitting any everlasting wedlock. But the key was not put into the lock, for the time had not yet come for that. God had not yet told us to do that, just as in Adam and Eve's case in the Paradise. This was done by the serpent, but not by God, so I stood strong and did not allow their will, before the proper time, to taste of the forbidden fruit and did not give them the key. But I waited for all of that as God, by the spirit, had told me to do. To this then are many witnesses, almost all of my chosen people who believe in me.

And they were all completely happy with these, my spiritual marriages, and willing to wait for intercourse with me, as I was their holy husband. The first of these, my beloved wives, was Stenya and Varya and the rest like unto them, who now in my absence, inspired by Satan himself and without taking account of our eternal holy new marriage, almost all of them, suddenly, because of their defiled lustfulness, have lifted their adulterous tails to the dogs like a bitch in heat. And all of them took themselves husbands who are not their lawful husbands but adulterous sons of Satan in bodily form, for which reason in these god-despised mismatches, they now indulge in adultery, like unclean beasts or defiled swine, and have become demon-possessed, by God's will. 

For this reason, any children born of them are cursed or like the bastard children of prostitutes and all of these unlawful children are consigned, by God, to everlasting death without chance of resurrection, as it is written, without respite. And anyone who, today, will beat them, God will make holy for it. 

It would have been better for all of you, my new wives, to have never known this, my new path, which is eternal for all who walk it rightly. For it is true, not false, just like an arrow, straight to Zion, destined. But you did not desire it but chose, instead, to go the way of adultery, like cattle with bulls or you with your cursed husbands. You have forgotten me, your God-annointed husband and king. For you all know very well what my spirit always clearly told you that you would not seek another husband besides me and not to give your virginity or holy Eve-like chastity to any deceiving serpent but only to me, your Adam. For what you had secreted in you was meant only for me, your God-given husband. 

For this reason, I am filled with wrath for you, for you have all defiled yourselves and joined yourselves with cursed demons everywhere and I can have patience with you no longer.  Only because of your need for salvation will I change my curse upon you but your husbands and children will eternally be cursed of me, and them, I will wipe off the face of the earth. But you, I'll again receive eternally, as wives, so as not to gratify this evil spirit of Satan, or to say, Simon Rudakoff and Maxim Plenin and Vasili Sikitin, for I remember that you were my eternal wives and concubines, like King Solomon within his worldwide kingdom. Although it is very repugnant and defiling this, your devilish evil, in which you, in my absence, allowed demons to be delivered into you, but I will clean all of this with the sword and fire, off of your outer man, but inwardly I will apply my own salve and heal you down there.  Then, in the wrath of my spirit, for your defilement of me, through your demon-possessed adultery, I'll give you all different names…not good names but perverted and even foul ones. 

First, Stenkoo, I will name Idessa, in that she, for the longest time, in my absence, was compelled to lie entirely [under the demon] for the sake of his demonic adultery.

And likewise, Varookhoo, I will name Akhvatoosya, in that she, in her own desire, because of her own adultery, stretched herself fully naked, completely for the demon. 

Leksookhoo, I will name Pikhtoosya, in that she disobeyed me and found for herself, for the sake of powerful adultery, right to the very bottom, the pushy demon.

Doonookhoo, I will name Nakhmanisa, in that she, without my permission, the swine, stretched her ass willfully, right onto the demon. 

Vasookhoo,