How Do You Test For Truth?

[Guest Guest]

Who is Jesus

How is Salvation secured

Is the Bible the inerrant Word of God

 

 

Don't know YET- still seeking the truth!

How do YOU test for truth?

This stands out in my mind, as being one of the most typical comments when quizzing a Rudometkinite

 

Rudometkinite comment; "The Bible is wrong and the Duh E Zisin has error too.

 

So then I ask "Well exactly how do you determine truth?".....And just like our "I don't know yet Guest" in the above post, the Rudometkinites won't even attempt to answer. The only conclusion that I can come to is, all Rudometkinites have a bed spring for a spine.

 

[Guest Paul W. Orloff]

Would it be better to say the Dux ee Zhisn has errors?

Or that it is truthfuly written from satan himself?

 

Who is Jesus

How is Salvation secured

Is the Bible the inerrant Word of God

 

 

Don't know YET- still seeking the truth!

How do YOU test for truth?

This stands out in my mind, as being one of the most typical comments when quizzing a Rudometkinite

 

Rudometkinite comment; "The Bible is wrong and the Duh E Zisin has error too.

 

So then I ask "Well exactly how do you determine truth?".....And just like our "I don't know yet Guest" in the above post, the Rudometkinites won't even attempt to answer. The only conclusion that I can come to is, all Rudometkinites have a bed spring for a spine.

 

[Guest mud_paddie]

Would it be better to say the Dux ee Zhisn has errors?

Or that it is truthfuly written from satan himself?

Yes Paul, you are right about that.

 

Molokan's Rudometkin says he replaces Christ as the anointed savior of the world, that he forgives sin, judges souls to eternal punishment or reward, all prayers to God MUST go through this new molokan king. Doctrines like these come from satan.

 

I think this how God would explain it.

A. Molokans partner with their church.

B. The church partners with the Dux ee Zhisn.

C. The Dux ee Zhisn partners with satan.

D. Satan partners with the molokans.

 

A+B+C+D = Accursed

Galatians 1:8-9 "But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. AS WE HAVE SAID BEFORE, SO NOW I SAY AGAIN, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed."

 

BTW; The Molokan History Seminar, Friday 9/10/2010, an "Essay on Religion" from the Spirit and Life book. This seminar has been prepared by Elders of our Churches for our Molokan Community so we thoroughly understand the Christian belief of our forefathers and the persecutions they endured. Friday 9/10/2010, 7-9 pm, Central California UMCA. Contact D. Bibayoff 559-842-8440.

 

Parents concerned about the souls of their children, attend this seminar and take a friend who loves the Lord, be an eye witness to these events, insist on teachings only from the Holy Bible. Take your camcorder, they should have no problem with documentation of these events.

 

It's interesting that they didn't have this event on September 11 th...... '911 Molokan Religion Seminar!'

 

[Guest mud_paddie]

What? No whining from the ###########'s Babbleshoff brothers or their puppets!

[Guest Guest]

What? No whining from the ###########'s Babbleshoff brothers or their puppets!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest mud_paddie]

What? No whining from the ###########'s Babbleshoff brothers or their puppets!

So this is how a Rudometkinite tests for truth, with pink little clouds! You can't defend MGR anymore can you?

 

[lastinline 0]

What? No whining from the ###########'s Babbleshoff brothers or their puppets!

So this is how a Rudometkinite tests for truth, with pink little clouds! You can't defend MGR anymore can you?

Maybe this will bring a rise from the Babbleshoff brothers in defence of their desire to fulful their leaders desirers for their ilk?

 

In light of the scrutiny of the Catholic hierarchy no longer being the only alleged child-abusers, can we in some way surmise and speculate that a strong hypostasis could be made of the beloved heretic Maxim G. Rudometkin, if left unrestrained by governing forces of his time, could and would have produced the pedophilic activities for which he was incarcerated for. His (mgr) love of young girls would have been protected by the Molokan code of secrecy built into its heretical "new israel" belief system.

 

Also, would not any devotion to mgr's heretical beliefs result in further debauchery because of mgr's love for young girls? Would not Clark Street mgr devotees entertain and/or desire much the same type of debauchery if not for the restraints put on them by the force of law? Surely shame from Biblical Truth would not restrain their activities.

 

M.G.R., with his great admiration for many of the Islamic beliefs, especially its multiple-wives or what he twisted into his need for a harem of spiritual wives, in truth, eventually lead to his proper imprisonment. I believe that it was this very delusional heretical belief that eventually brought rise to his prophetic rantings in the s&l with the proclamation that there would be thousands of Islamic women made available to him and his devotees to impregnate during the millennium with prophesies of this in his s&l writings.

 

If many legal experts are correct in the belief that if God's marriage system of only one man and one women should end here, in our once- great country. Then men would be allowed to marry as many wives as they desired, I could envision that this would bring great joy to the hearts of the now dwindling numbers of Clark Streeters and many devoted Maximisti perverts that have a desire fulfill MGR's dreams of having multiple spiritual wives and are now only restrained by the current laws.

 

With the ever expanding power and reach of hate crime legislation with its proponents desirous of controlling activities in everyone's spiritual life. Would not the filings the numerous law suits objecting to the teachings of encouraging Hate because of a person's race, gender, ethnicity, nationality, religion, sexual orientation, or even ne-nash (I hate that word) characteristics, by teachings of renowned hater Maxim G. Rudometkin and his devotees.

 

lastinline (& with no more & no less insight)

 

[Guest puppet]

What? No whining from the ###########'s Babbleshoff brothers or their puppets!

So this is how a Rudometkinite tests for truth, with pink little clouds! You can't defend MGR anymore can you?

 

 

 

 

You deny that the S&L is scripture?

 

Do you consider your self a "molokan"?

 

EGK was the prophet that led the molokans out of bondage to spiritual freedom in the Americas-

Your forefathers believed this and came here.

 

Do you accept EGK to be a true prophet of God?

 

If yes- then you would accept that, through the Spirit, he witnessed onto MGR, as John witnessed onto Jesus as being the Christ.

 

If no- then your forefathers followed a false prophet to spiritual doom,

stand up for the truth and show them that they were wrong........go back to were they came from!

Yes show every one how wrong this pohod was!

 

This name calling is your example of the love of Christ?

 

Then I will have to agree with guest, that it is you that is full of hot air coming from the other end!

[Guest mud_paddie]

What? No whining from the ###########'s Babbleshoff brothers or their puppets!

So this is how a Rudometkinite tests for truth, with pink little clouds! You can't defend MGR anymore can you?

You deny that the S&L is scripture? Yes, it contradicts the Bible

Do you consider your self a "molokan"? Not since I found out that molokans respect other gods.

 

EGK was the prophet that led the molokans out of bondage to spiritual freedom in the Americas-

Your forefathers believed this and came here. All you have is folklore, you have no proof for your opinion.

Do you accept EGK to be a true prophet of God? The last true prophet was Malachi read Luke 16.16

 

If yes- then you would accept that, through the Spirit, he witnessed onto MGR, as John witnessed onto Jesus as being the Christ. EGK was a young boy compared to MGR, In fact EGK was brother in law to MGR and witnessing would be highly unlikely.

If no- then your forefathers followed a false prophet to spiritual doom, Yes, I believe this to.

stand up for the truth and show them that they were wrong........go back to were they came from!

Yes show every one how wrong this pohod was! The incentive for the molokan migration to America was fear and money motivated. Where is America mentioned in the Spirit and Life book?

 

This name calling is your example of the love of Christ? Without you having any facts, the word puppet is appropriate and kind.

 

Then I will have to agree with guest, that it is you that is full of hot air coming from the other end! You lack historical facts. You bring to the table your opinion. Lead, follow or get out of the way! Be a part of the answer, not a part of the problem

 

[lastinline 0]

'mud_paddie' date='Sep 28 2010, 08:06 PM' post='73897']

Then I will have to agree with guest, that it is you that is full of hot air coming from the other end!

I hope you aware that this hot air is categorized as a carcinogen (poison). Although, its release can in my case, bring a great deal of relief, so put that in your pipe and smoke it (so-to-speak).

 

Lead, follow or get out of the way! Be a part of the answer, not a part of the problem!

This is a great teaching moment, is it not? And of course your are to be commended. Also, is that a little like saying, "if you cannot stand the heat in the kitchen, then by all means get out of the kitchen," пожалуйста.

 

lastinline (& with no hindering spirit to concern yourself with)

[lastinline 0]

'puppet' date='Sep 28 2010, 03:34 PM' post='73883']

This name calling is your example of the love of Christ?

Does ne-nash (I hate that term) qualify? Is that pithy enough for you, honey?

 

lastinline (& where all trash and/or garbage is ALWAYS removed in very timely manner)

 

P.S. & of course, always ready to clean up your mess. Spell-check, please (пожалуйста).

[Guest Guest]

Does ne-nash (I hate that term) qualify?

Rudometkin was a "ne-nash".

 

History documents his last name was actually Komar and Mr Komar states in the Spirit and Life book that he goes by the name of Akhmet, one can't get any more ne-nash sounding than Akhmet Komar, it's anyone's guess about his lineage.

 

With the aid of his Rudometkin sponsors, AK the ne-nash, made his grand entrance into Uklein's molokanism. Religious pedigree began in America long after the death of the incarcerated Akhmet Komar at the Solvetski correctional facility.

 

Molokanism of today would be more accurately called Komarism since it is today's molokan church procedures that were initially outlined by Akhmet Komar that is now regarded as molokanism.

 

[lastinline 0]

'Guest' date='Sep 29 2010, 11:20 AM' post='73964']

Solvetski correctional facility.

Is that mistake on you part, by calling it a "correctional" facility? How could such a facility have any part in attempting to correct an attitude that comes directly form the very heart of Satanic worship?

 

lastinline (& totally dialed in-2 his psyche, i think it has something to do with Friday the 13th)

[Guest Guest]

'Guest' date='Sep 29 2010, 11:20 AM' post='73964']

Solvetski correctional facility.

Is that mistake on you part, by calling it a "correctional" facility. How could such a facility have any part in attempting to correct an attitude that comes directly form the very heart of Satanic worship?

Imagine belonging to a religion that was originated by a demon possessed and legally convicted pedophile who continued to orchestrate his religion "with this Spirit" from a prison cell.

 

From the Spirit and Life book page 276 verse 12;

"And the Lord Himself with all His faithful; then I, Maxim, king of spirits, today am with you, and govern and reign with this Spirit while under the confinement of Solovetski castle."

 

Their is one main reason why people would not leave such a religion?

 

[lastinline 0]

Their is one main reason why people would not leave such a religion?

 

And what reason would make the as little sense as possible, I hope.

 

lastinline (my door leads & swings in all directions)

[Guest Guest]

Their is one main reason why people would not leave such a religion?

 

And what reason would make the as little sense as possible, I hope.

 

lastinline (my door leads & swings in all directions)

I don't understand your comment, but I would like to hear your collective thoughts on, why a person would stay in a religion that was originated by, and honors, a convicted pedophile who contradicts the Holy Bible.

 

[KevinPolyaNazaroff 0]

Their is one main reason why people would not leave such a religion?

 

And what reason would make the as little sense as possible, I hope.

 

lastinline (my door leads & swings in all directions)

I don't understand your comment, but I would like to hear your collective thoughts on, why a person would stay in a religion that was originated by, and honors, a convicted pedophile who contradicts the Holy Bible.

Guest,

Why would you make a statement like this?

 

Molokanism was not originated by a pedophile.

More and more molokans are rejecting man and accepting the true biblical Jesus, as presented in the word of God.

 

Does this movement of God make you nervous?

 

 

Kevin Nazaroff

 

 

[Guest Guest]

Molokanism was not originated by a pedophile.

The molokan religion of today honors Rudometkin and his spirit and life book, Rudometkin/Komar was an egocentric con-man who died in prison. You are a recovering pharisee religionist who has occasional withdrawal symptoms, these are the historical facts and you don't like them.

 

When all traces of Rudometkin/Komar the nenash, are removed from current molokanism and molokanism is restored to the pre-rudometkin status of Uklein, then we can deal with the heresies of Uklein, the Mother Mary did not birth baby Jesus, that somehow Jesus coincidentally resembled the Archangel Raphael, Uklein and company continued to eat swine flesh, all are historical fact.

 

From any viewpoint you are currently in a bankrupt religion that removes all authority from Jesus and brings honor and power to a criminal who contradicts the Word of God and places himself as your new savior.

 

Do the crime, do the time, Scripture says Rudometkin/Komar is the only savior you have, because you are in his religion.

 

[seeking_truth_1 0]

All those within the cult of molokanism who adhere to the s&l as anything other that garbage do affirm mgr

 

To continue, their brand of molokanism was founded by mgr who was quite the sexual deviant

 

Sorry, I do not agree with you on this either

 

Things might be changing but to what degree?

 

Can a Black, Asian, Mexican Christian join a molokan "church"

Is the s&l still present?

Is Salvation by Grace alone taught from the alleged "elders" or "preachers"?

 

If not, you're fooling yourself

 

What message is regularly being taught from the "front row" at ANY molokan "church"?

 

Their is one main reason why people would not leave such a religion?

 

And what reason would make the as little sense as possible, I hope.

 

lastinline (my door leads & swings in all directions)

I don't understand your comment, but I would like to hear your collective thoughts on, why a person would stay in a religion that was originated by, and honors, a convicted pedophile who contradicts the Holy Bible.

Guest,

Why would you make a statement like this?

 

Molokanism was not originated by a pedophile.

More and more molokans are rejecting man and accepting the true biblical Jesus, as presented in the word of God.

 

Does this movement of God make you nervous?

 

 

Kevin Nazaroff

 

 

[KevinPolyaNazaroff 0]

All those within the cult of molokanism who adhere to the s&l as anything other that garbage do affirm mgr

I have said this before, and I will say it a million times.

 

Less than 5 percent of the current molokan brotherhood read that book.

 

Just as easy as it was put on the table, it can just as easily be taken off.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To continue, their brand of molokanism was founded by mgr who was quite the sexual deviant

Their brand of molokansism is not accepted by the majority.

 

 

 

 

Sorry, I do not agree with you on this either

 

Things might be changing but to what degree?

 

Can a Black, Asian, Mexican Christian join a molokan "church"

Is the s&l still present?

Is Salvation by Grace alone taught from the alleged "elders" or "preachers"?

 

If not, you're fooling yourself

 

What message is regularly being taught from the "front row" at ANY molokan "church"?

Religion will fool eveybody, every time.

 

Even the fundamentalists are in trouble.

 

Kevin Nazaroff

[KevinPolyaNazaroff 0]

The molokan religion of today honors Rudometkin and his spirit and life book,

This is an exagerated statement.

The molokan religion of today is in a state of crises.

 

But there are many factions of molokanism that do exist.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Rudometkin/Komar was an egocentric con-man who died in prison.

Ok.

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are a recovering pharisee religionist who has occasional withdrawal symptoms, these are the historical facts and you don't like them.

I did not recover from Pharisee-ism, I repented of it.

 

You have no clue who I am and what I like, so stop talking non-sense.

 

And..... it does not matter what you or I like.

 

It is up to God and what He desires.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From any viewpoint you are currently in a bankrupt religion that removes all authority from Jesus and brings honor and power to a criminal who contradicts the Word of God and places himself as your new savior.

 

I do not agree.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Do the crime, do the time,

What do you think the punishment should be?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Scripture says Rudometkin/Komar is the only savior you have, because you are in his religion.

What scripture is this?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Kevin Nazaroff

[seeking_truth_1 0]

You say

 

"Less than 5 percent of the current molokan brotherhood read that book.

Just as easy as it was put on the table, it can just as easily be taken off."

 

Where is the evidence of Christianity within the confines of the cult of molokanism?

 

Where is the behavior from the "leadership" that demonstrates your view?

 

When is that book "coming off" the table

 

As long as it is there you are kidding yourself

 

As to your last statement, you failed to address the issue

 

I stated

 

Can a Black, Asian, Mexican Christian join a molokan "church"

Is the s&l still present?

Is Salvation by Grace alone taught from the alleged "elders" or "preachers"?

 

 

What message is regularly being taught from the "front row" at ANY molokan "church"?

 

You sidestepped all of it

 

 

All those within the cult of molokanism who adhere to the s&l as anything other that garbage do affirm mgr

I have said this before, and I will say it a million times.

 

Less than 5 percent of the current molokan brotherhood read that book.

 

Just as easy as it was put on the table, it can just as easily be taken off.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To continue, their brand of molokanism was founded by mgr who was quite the sexual deviant

Their brand of molokansism is not accepted by the majority.

 

 

 

 

Sorry, I do not agree with you on this either

 

Things might be changing but to what degree?

 

Can a Black, Asian, Mexican Christian join a molokan "church"

Is the s&l still present?

Is Salvation by Grace alone taught from the alleged "elders" or "preachers"?

 

If not, you're fooling yourself

 

What message is regularly being taught from the "front row" at ANY molokan "church"?

Religion will fool eveybody, every time.

 

Even the fundamentalists are in trouble.

 

Kevin Nazaroff

[KevinPolyaNazaroff 0]

You say

 

"Less than 5 percent of the current molokan brotherhood read that book.

Just as easy as it was put on the table, it can just as easily be taken off."

 

Where is the evidence of Christianity within the confines of the cult of molokanism?

 

Where is the behavior from the "leadership" that demonstrates your view?

 

When is that book "coming off" the table

 

As long as it is there you are kidding yourself

 

As to your last statement, you failed to address the issue

 

I stated

 

Can a Black, Asian, Mexican Christian join a molokan "church"

Is the s&l still present?

Is Salvation by Grace alone taught from the alleged "elders" or "preachers"?

 

 

What message is regularly being taught from the "front row" at ANY molokan "church"?

 

You sidestepped all of it

 

 

All those within the cult of molokanism who adhere to the s&l as anything other that garbage do affirm mgr

I have said this before, and I will say it a million times.

 

Less than 5 percent of the current molokan brotherhood read that book.

 

Just as easy as it was put on the table, it can just as easily be taken off.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

To continue, their brand of molokanism was founded by mgr who was quite the sexual deviant

Their brand of molokansism is not accepted by the majority.

 

 

 

 

Sorry, I do not agree with you on this either

 

Things might be changing but to what degree?

 

Can a Black, Asian, Mexican Christian join a molokan "church"

Is the s&l still present?

Is Salvation by Grace alone taught from the alleged "elders" or "preachers"?

 

If not, you're fooling yourself

 

What message is regularly being taught from the "front row" at ANY molokan "church"?

Religion will fool eveybody, every time.

 

Even the fundamentalists are in trouble.

 

Kevin Nazaroff

 

You know how I feel about the current state of molokanism.

But I also have a burden of the Lord to love them in the same way our Lord Jesus loves them.

 

BTW, I also said that I would be ok if molokanism ceased to exist.

 

I have no problem telling people that I currently attend, and very much enjoy the biblical teaching at Calvary Chapel Fresno on Tuesday nights.

 

 

We have talked before, and I think we agree on the tenets of Christianity.

 

I think where we differ is on the method of "fixing" the current molokon situation.

 

 

Also, if you think that I "side-stepped", it was not intentional.

I try to respond as best I can with the time that I have.

 

The closed door policy is not enforced in San Francisco, and I think they are a model for the rest of the molokan churches.

They still hold the molokan "flavor", minus the racism.

 

Also, there have been occasions that the elders have allowed non russians to join.

It does happen, but certainly not enough.

 

Kevin Nazaroff

 

 

[lastinline 0]

The closed door policy is not enforced in San Francisco, and I think they are a model for the rest of the molokan churches.

They still hold the molokan "flavor", minus the racism.

 

Also, there have been occasions that the elders have allowed non russians to join.

It does happen, but certainly not enough.

 

Kevin Nazaroff

 

I'm a prime example, I was allowed to join and continue to be a member in good standing with all the perks, bell and whistles, that go along with membership.

 

That view from the San Francisco Molokan Church on a clear day or night continue to bring uhz and ahz to our eyes.

 

lastinline (now that will confuse those that are already confused)

 

[Guest El Scorcho Grande]

Does the San Franciso church have anything to do with the S&L. I do know that many Molokans wouldn't let their sons or daughters marry in to San Francisco.

 

When Molokans start living in the example of Christ, Molokan church won't bear much resemblance to the church as it is today. Then again when people develop a true relationship with their Lord and Savior, they aren't going to mind, of course that would go for anybody from any denomination.

[lastinline 0]

'El Scorcho Grande' date='Oct 2 2010, 06:16 PM' post='74393']

Does the San Franciso church have anything to do with the S&L.

To even consider its relevance would bring the warning from God, of "Touch not the unclean thing." Agreed?

 

Psalm 127: 1 Unless the LORD builds the house, They labor in vain who build it; Unless the LORD guards the city, The watchman stays awake in vain. NKJV

 

Псалтирь 127: 1(126-1) Если Господь не созиждет дома, напрасно трудятся строящие его; если Господь не охранит города, напрасно бодрствует страж. RSV

 

lastinline (& where HE builds & guards)

[Guest El Scorcho Grande]

Last In Line, I am absolutely in agreement with you about the S&L being unclean. Let me make that perfectly clear, I firmly believe that anyone who believes in and follows the teachings in the S&L will find themselves far away from God, and yes, I am afraid much closer to the Devil, for he is indeed the true author.

 

You have to ask yourself after hearing for the hundredth time "Our forefathers suffered and died so that we could have this" did they really intend with their dying wish that we would have the Molokanism that we have today? If they did, they were wrong and definitley not followers of our Lord and Saviour. I pray that this is not the case, I pray that this is not the outcome that they would have wanted for us, and that they are disgusted with how their names have been used to separate Molokans from God.

[seeking_truth_1 0]

Can "ne-nash" join and attend the SF "church"?

 

The closed door policy is not enforced in San Francisco, and I think they are a model for the rest of the molokan churches.

They still hold the molokan "flavor", minus the racism.

 

Also, there have been occasions that the elders have allowed non russians to join.

It does happen, but certainly not enough.

 

Kevin Nazaroff

 

I'm a prime example, I was allowed to join and continue to be a member in good standing with all the perks, bell and whistles, that go along with membership.

 

That view from the San Francisco Molokan Church on a clear day or night continue to bring uhz and ahz to our eyes.

 

lastinline (now that will confuse those that are already confused)

 

[Guest Hebrews 10-26]

Can "ne-nash" join and attend the SF "church"?

lastinline tell me about the church procedures of your San Francisco church. How long have you been a member there?

 

[lastinline 0]

Can "ne-nash" join and attend the SF "church"?

lastinline tell me about the church procedures of your San Francisco church. How long have you been a member there?

Merely walk-in and you will notice the well-coming smiles and membership is a far-gone assumption and/or conclusion.

 

lastinline (& I left my heart in San Francisco?)

[stevepiv 0]

Kevin,

 

I too have witnessed along with you many Molokans coming to know Jesus Christ and being Saved by Him and seeing The Lord work in their life is amazing.

 

Everytime I see or hear of someone else being saved, I rejoice....

 

then...I pray for them... because....

 

Something you brought up last year about Camp. Here is the post:

 

Is it a secret?

 

What a tragedy it would be if a young person is touched by the Lord Jesus at camp, only to be filled with religion and hypocrisy when they get back to their "mother church".

 

Trying to reach the youth is important, but the biblical method is to save the father, and if you can save the father or mother, than the "saved" parent can teach their kids about Jesus.

 

But if you "save" the kid, and send the kid back to UNsaved parents and "elders", there is a risk of filling a new believer with alot of unnecessary junk.

 

27 When the jailer awoke and saw the prison doors opened, he drew his sword and was about to kill himself, supposing that the prisoners had escaped. 28 But Paul cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Do not harm yourself, for we are all here!” 29 And he called for lights and rushed in, and trembling with fear he fell down before Paul and Silas, 30 and after he brought them out, he said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” 31 They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.” 32 And they spoke the word of the Lord to him together with all who were in his house. 33 And he took them that very hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized, he and all his household. 34 And he brought them into his house and set food before them, and rejoiced greatly, having believed in God with his whole household. Acts 16: 27-34 NASB

 

Now... How about these people as you metioned:

 

More and more molokans are rejecting man and accepting the true biblical Jesus, as presented in the word of God.

 

Does this movement of God make you nervous?

 

What happens with them? Just as the youth after a week of camp are sent back to the cult, so are these people as well. ACTUALLY, most of them will go back on their own.

Edited October 11, 2010 by stevepiv

[KevinPolyaNazaroff 0]

Kevin,

 

I too have witnessed along with you many Molokans coming to know Jesus Christ and being Saved by Him and seeing The Lord work in their life is amazing.

 

Everytime I see or hear of someone else being saved, I rejoice....

 

then...I pray for them... because....

 

Something you brought up last year about Camp. Here is the post:

 

Is it a secret?

 

What a tragedy it would be if a young person is touched by the Lord Jesus at camp, only to be filled with religion and hypocrisy when they get back to their "mother church".

 

Trying to reach the youth is important, but the biblical method is to save the father, and if you can save the father or mother, than the "saved" parent can teach their kids about Jesus.

 

But if you "save" the kid, and send the kid back to UNsaved parents and "elders", there is a risk of filling a new believer with alot of unnecessary junk.

 

27 When the jailer awoke and saw the prison doors opened, he drew his sword and was about to kill himself, supposing that the prisoners had escaped. 28 But Paul cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Do not harm yourself, for we are all here!” 29 And he called for lights and rushed in, and trembling with fear he fell down before Paul and Silas, 30 and after he brought them out, he said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” 31 They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.” 32 And they spoke the word of the Lord to him together with all who were in his house. 33 And he took them that very hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized, he and all his household. 34 And he brought them into his house and set food before them, and rejoiced greatly, having believed in God with his whole household. Acts 16: 27-34 NASB

 

Now... How about these people as you metioned:

 

More and more molokans are rejecting man and accepting the true biblical Jesus, as presented in the word of God.

 

Does this movement of God make you nervous?

 

What happens with them? Just as the youth after a week of camp are sent back to the cult, so are these people as well. ACTUALLY, most of them will go back on their own.

Steve,

If you read that whole thread, the point I was trying to make was the importance of parents in the raising of their kids.

God gave the responsibility to parents to raise their own children, not the church, and not youth camps.

This is clearly commanded to us by God in the following verses...

4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:

5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:

7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.

8 And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.

9 And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.

Deuteronomy 6:4–9 AV

 

 

 

But, as was pointed out in that thread, there is room for the church to aid in Evangelizing and Discipling the youth, as also commanded by Jesus.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Matthew 28:19–20 AV

 

 

But, you still bring up a good point.

What about the Christians who are hungry for the Word of God, and are not getting fed in their molokan church?

 

 

This is where I have been open in the past, and am still open in the present, that I do not have a clear answer or solution.

I wish I did, but I don't.

 

Sometimes it is better for a person to leave completely.

Sometimes it is better for a person to leave gradually.

Sometimes it is better for a person to stay and minister.

Sometimes it is better for a person to stay quietly.

Sometimes it is better for a person to stay loudly.

And sometimes, it is better for a person to attend both a bible teaching church/bible class and the molokan church.

 

 

But these are my opinions, and I am sure there are many who may disagree.

 

Don't follow my advice, seek God's will and His direction.

God will never lead you in the wrong direction.

 

 

 

I also have since refined my definition of "molokanism", based on the testimony of the bible based Christians who reside in the molokan church.

These are people who are elders and who are back row-ers.

They desire to take the spirit and life off of the table.

They desire God's way as written in the bible, and not mans way.

 

I did not know that so many of these people existed, until recently.

 

Where I once thought that all molokan churches were cults, I no longer believe that.

I do label every single molokan church in "back-slidden" status, but not cult status.

 

It is the clark st movement that is the carrier of heresy.

I categorize the clark st. movement as a cult.

They are "new Israel".

 

But amongst the remaining back-slidden molokan churches, their is in every single church, at least one elder or indvidual who is a Christian who can help and aid a new convert to Christ.

 

There is also some very exciting things happening right now in the molokan church, but some of these things are just not best defined and discussed here on the internet, at least for right now.

 

 

 

 

 

Steve,

If a new molokan church started that did not accept the spirit and life as scripture, but upheld the Bible as the word of God, would you attend that church?

 

Or, maybe it is better to ask, would that church still be considered a cult?

 

What about other currently established churches that are headed in that biblical direction?

Are they still considered a cult, even though they are changing?

 

 

Again, these are my opinions, and I could be wrong, as I have been before.

 

 

Kevin Nazaroff

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest El Scorcho Grande]

Kevin I agree that there are those who are Christians and very good people in most if not all Molokan churches. But it isn't as easy (or hard) as ditching the S&L and repudiating Maxcim. What about the issue of treating other Christians as nenash? The Molokan church can and I think will reform, but if it does change to conform to the will and example of Jesus Christ, it won't bear much resemblance to what we are used to today. Please understand I don't write this to be hurtful or because I am angry, I only write it to provide thought to what is necessary, and right.

 

Don't get me wrong the S&L and Maxcim are major impediments, and removing them would be a huge victory for Christ. They might not keep strong Christians from Jesus, but they most certainly do lead children and others who haven't known Christ yet, away from him. I think that is what they were meant to do.

[coffee 0]

.

 

But, you still bring up a good point.

What about the Christians who are hungry for the Word of God, and are not getting fed in their molokan church?

 

 

This is where I have been open in the past, and am still open in the present, that I do not have a clear answer or solution.

I wish I did, but I don't.

 

Sometimes it is better for a person to leave completely.

 

Sometimes it is better for a person to leave gradually.

 

Sometimes it is better for a person to stay and minister.

 

Sometimes it is better for a person to stay quietly.

 

Sometimes it is better for a person to stay loudly.

 

And sometimes, it is better for a person to attend both a bible teaching church/bible class and the molokan church.

 

 

But these are my opinions, and I am sure there are many who may disagree.

 

 

I also have since refined my definition of "molokanism", based on the testimony of the bible based Christians who reside in the molokan church.

 

These are people who are elders and who are back row-ers.

 

They desire to take the spirit and life off of the table.

 

They desire God's way as written in the bible, and not mans way.

 

I did not know that so many of these people existed, until recently.

 

 

But amongst the remaining back-slidden molokan churches, their is in every single church, at least one elder or indvidual who is a Christian who can help and aid a new convert to Christ.

 

There is also some very exciting things happening right now in the molokan church, but some of these things are just not best defined and discussed here on the internet, at least for right now.

 

 

 

What about other currently established churches that are headed in that biblical direction?

Are they still considered a cult, even though they are changing?

 

 

Again, these are my opinions, and I could be wrong, as I have been before.

 

 

Kevin Nazaroff

 

 

In order to be totally honest, I think we need to first admit that there is a certain "comfort zone" when it comes to taking part in our traditional "Molokan" social and religious activities. There is a certain comfort in the "familiarity" of dressing up in the same, common, traditional outfits, and sharing in common that which we have all been born and raised to esteem and value highly as part of our ethnic heritage, which we experience during the religious church doings, like weddings, child dedications, funerals, etc., and social events like wedding showers, picnics and barbecue outings.

 

Because this familiarity and comfort zone is a definite "given", it is naive for us to dismiss the fact that there is a definite tendency to cling to this comfort zone, even though one might disagree with and oppose the decisions that are made by the dominant Rudometkinite political elders who control what decisions are made with regard to what is and what is not allowed to go on in the "Molokan" community.

 

It is naive to pretend that whenever a Bible based Jesus follower makes known the truth that the "spirit" behind the so-called "revelations" in the writings of the Spirit and Life book is EVIL in the sight of God, that the dominant Rudometkinite elders and church leaders are not going to censor that person and make sure his voice is no longer heard.

 

Let us not be naive that where there is censorship, any potential opportunity for future "ministry" has for all practical purposes been eliminated, and to hold out hope that the opportunity will eventually be given one day to remove such censorship, with the expectation that established churches are supposedly "headed in a Biblical direction", is not only naive, but borders on ignorance, no disrespect intended.

 

For "ministry" to happen, voices need to be heard speaking the truth. I need to emphasize speaking the truth IN LOVE!, for God loves the sinner, in spite of one's sin, and desires for the soul of the deceived to be saved. True ministry towards the lost and the unsaved cannot be accomplished when the spirit of pride and hatred toward the deceived dominates and interferes with the efforts of the Holy Spirit to minister.

 

If voices speaking the truth are not heard, there is no "ministry", only wishful thinking.

 

So faith comes from HEARING, and hearing through the Word of Christ. (Romans 10:17)

 

When censorship exists, there is no "hearing" of the message of truth, therefore, no platform for "ministry".

 

In my experience, as it was initially for my wife and me almost 30 years ago, there exists a fine line of wishful thinking which clouds the reality of the political certainties in existence, and it is common to want to make excuses for not wanting to leave the "New Israel" dominated church activities, even tolerating, for the sake of "peace", the heresies of Rudometkin and Klubnikin in the Spirit and Life book.

 

After all, are we not maintaining peace, which is Biblical, as well as unity among family and the preservation of the rich heritage into which we were born? Is it not a good thing that God has brought us into the world as part of our ethnic "Molokan" heritage? Why then would He want us to leave it just to follow Him? Can we not follow Him and still be part of our socio-religious ethnic "Molokan" community, in spite of the Khlystical false doctrines and strange teachings of the Spirit and Life book?

 

Is it not written in the Bible this way?:

 

Only let each person lead the life that the Lord has assigned to him, and to which God has called him. This is my rule in all the churches.

 

Each one should remain in the condition in which he was called.

 

So brothers, in whatever condition each was called, there let him remain with God.

 

(1 Corinthians 7:17-24)

 

These are hard questions, but it is more than obvious that in order to follow the Lord Jesus Christ and practice the Scriptural absolutes regarding faith in Him, which are established and clearly outlined in the Bible, one cannot remain stagnant in the "Molokan" church system. There must be activity of some kind, which requires gathering together with others to stimulate one another unto love and good deeds through the knowledge and understanding of the gospel message of the Biblical Jesus Christ.

 

There is no getting around it....the message to sound the alarm regarding the heresy of the Spirit and Life book MUST BE HEARD. In order for it to be heard, it must be spoken!

 

The same applies to the Biblical truth that Jesus is our Creator God Who has come to earth in human being form, to die for the sins of mankind. Those who are believing in "another Jesus", as a created being, are standing on sand and are not firmly established on the Rock of our salvation, as recorded in the Holy Scriptures.

 

The encouragement is to speak out and not be silent, to be proactive in seeking fellowship with other fellow Bible based Jesus followers, to not take pleasure in one's own comfort zone, and not be stagnant, but be active in ministry, serving in the fields of the Lord.

 

This cannot be done while remaining silent and clinging to that which is comfortable.

 

.

[seeking_truth_1 0]

If a molokan "church" has the s&l anywhere, it is a cult

If a molokan "chuch" denies Jesus for who He is, it is a cult

 

If the "leadership" of a molokan "church" does not teach

Who Jesus is

How Salvation is secured

The Bible is the inerrant Word of God

they are a cult

 

It makes no difference what those who sit silently do or allegedly believe