So Jesus Christ Has Come "in The Flesh"

coffee · May 8, 2007

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What has become most obvious through the various dialogues here on the internet forums is that there are still many among today's "Molokan" people who continue to stumble over what is written in the Bible about the identity, and the person, of the Lord Jesus Christ:

Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of godliness:

He [or God / Deity] was manifested in the flesh vindicated by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory.

(1 Timothy 3:16)

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world.

By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God,

and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already. (1 John 4:1-3)

For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist. (2 John 1:7)

These passages from the Scriptures admittedly speak about the person of the Lord Jesus Christ. The fact that Jesus was a real historical person is well documented, and is probably accepted by most people living on earth today.

In each of the above three excerpts, we read that it is crucial for those who desire to become true believers and followers of Jesus, to know and understand that Christ has indeed come "in the flesh". The Apostles themselves obviously felt that it was very important for mankind to know that Jesus "came" in the flesh.

Where did Christ come from then? What is so significant about Him coming "in the flesh", that it had to be emphasized repeatedly as such by those who were responsible for teaching and preaching the good news about the Lord Jesus Christ?

On one hand, for those who are not led by the Holy Spirit, for those who do not have the mind of Christ and who are not spiritual minded, the revelation that Christ was a mortal man who lived his life on earth "in the flesh" is simply an insignificant triviality. To those who are thus carnal minded, how else would Christ have existed on earth, but "in the flesh".

Indeed, what is so unique about "in the flesh", if the Lord Jesus Christ was only a physical human being? If He was only a "person", if he was only a man, why all the fuss about Jesus, just because Christ happened to have been called the Son of God?

After all, since God is the One Who created all of mankind, couldn't ANY person be called a "son of God"? Couldn't ANY man give his life in death, and then have his followers say that it was done for the sins of all the world? What is so different, or unique, about Jesus that any other man could not have done the same thing?

To those who are followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, who seek to know God in spirit and in truth, the answers to the questions about Jesus Christ coming "in the flesh" are found written in the Bible.

It is written about Jesus that His Father was the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35), and that His mother was a virgin, who was told by the angel Gabriel that she would become pregnant, and that her Son was to be called "Holy", because He was the Son of God. With Jesus then having a Father who admittedly is not a human being, What kind of person then is Jesus?

Joseph, the man to whom the mother of Jesus was betrothed, was told that before he and Mary were to share any sexual intimacy together as husband and wife, Mary would become pregnant from the Holy Spirit and bear a Son Who was to be known as "God with us", Immanuel (Matthew 1:20-25). With the Holy Spirit as this child's Father, Who then is Jesus?

Again, if Jesus "came" in the flesh, then where did He come from? And, what is so significant about Him coming "in the flesh", that it had to be emphasized repeatedly as such by those whose recorded testimony was to eventually become part of the written Word of God, in the Holy Scriptures?

It is written in the Bible:

No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.

And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up,

that whoever believes in him may have eternal life. (John 3:13-15)

Again, this Scripture speaks about the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the fact that He came to earth from heaven.

The fact that Jesus refers to Himself as the Son of Man is His own personal testimony, and affirmation, that he was indeed a physical human being.

However, the Bible declares that before He came to earth, Jesus already existed in heaven as the Word of God, as "Spirit", in contrast to having an origin like that of mankind, which is from the earth (Genesis 2:4-25).

The significance of this is that everything in the heavenly realm, everything in heaven itself, exists in "spirit" form, as opposed to the realm of the earth and the created universe, where everything that was created by God exists within "physical" boundaries, in physical form, which is finite in nature.

Equally significant is the fact that even though He came from heaven, where everything exists in "spirit" form, Jesus was not just some "apparition" here on earth, as if a visible mirage, or some "spirit" that was visible to the human eye. In truth, He was an actual, living and breathing, physical human being, as it is written:

For the bread of God is he who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world."

Jesus said to them, "I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst.

For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.

For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day." (John 6:27-40)

It is written in the Scriptures that there is only ONE God over all, and that His place of residence is "in heaven" (Deuteronomy 26:15).

It is also recorded in the Bible that God is "Spirit" (John 4:24), and when we read the Scriptural passage written by the Apostle John, which confirms that the Word was God (John 1:1), we know that "the Word" was "Spirit", in "Spirit" form.

It is written in John 1:14, that the Word "became" flesh and dwelt on earth as a human being, as the unique, one-of-a-kind, never to be duplicated ever again, person of Jesus of Nazareth.

The reason that Christ's Apostles and Disciples emphasized this declaration, that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh, is because they KNEW Who He IS. They knew that Jesus is God Who previously existed in "Spirit" form, but Who became flesh, when He was begotten as the person of Jesus of Nazareth.

This is why the Lord Jesus Christ is referred to in the Bible as Savior, Messiah, God with us (Immanuel), the Holy One, or as the Apostle Thomas declared when he bowed down to worship Jesus, "My Lord and my God" (John 20:28).

Those today who are stumbled over the identity of the Lord Jesus Christ are no different from those who were likewise stumbled in the days when Jesus walked the earth, as God in the flesh, when the Word "became flesh" and dwelt among man, as it is written in the Bible:

So the Jews grumbled about him, because he said, "I am the bread that came down from heaven."

They said, "Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How does he now say, 'I have come down from heaven'?

Jesus answered them, "Do not grumble among yourselves.

No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.

It is written in the Prophets, 'And they will all be taught by God.' Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to me”

not that anyone has seen the Father except he who is from God; he has seen the Father.

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life.

I am the bread of life.

Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died.

This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die.

I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh."

(John 6:41-51)

According to what is written in the Holy Scriptures, the Lord Jesus Christ is the same person Who, prior to His incarnation here on the earth, already existed in heaven as "The Word".

From these same Scriptures, we know that "The Word" existed in heaven as "God".

It is written in the Bible that "God" is "Spirit". Therefore, when Jesus existed in heaven as "The Word", He existed as "God" in "Spirit" form.

According to what is written in John 1:14, we know that "The Word became flesh", meaning that "God", Who is "Spirit", became "flesh", in the physical, human being person of Jesus of Nazareth.

This is why it was so important to both the Apostle Paul, in his letter to Timothy, as well as to the Apostle John, in his epistles to the early Christian church, to confirm that Jesus Christ, Who they both knew to be "God", has indeed come "in the flesh".

According to what is written in the Scriptures then, the Word became flesh in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, when He came to earth willingly, and offered Himself in substitution for each one of us, as the one and only, single sacrifice that could ever be good enough, once and for all, to be the total and complete payment for the penalty of death, which is the sentence that is given to all mankind, everyone who has ever sinned against God.

Jesus was then crucified to death, was buried, and because He was a perfect and sinless human being before God, death had no hold on Him, and He resurrected from the dead in a new glorified body, which He ascended into heaven with, and with which He will return to earth, at which time all true believers in the Lord Jesus Christ, both those who have already died, as well as those who are still living at the time of His coming, will be changed from mortality to immortality, and will receive the same kind of glorified body that Jesus has, and will enter into heaven to live with Him eternally.

According to what is recorded in the Bible, we know that the Apostles and the Disciples of Christ "worshiped" Him, in the context of an unmistakable and undeniable acknowledgment that Jesus IS God.

This is especially true at the time of His ascension into heaven (Luke 24:50-53), at which time His followers were told that Christ would return to earth in the same way that He was taken up (Acts 1:6-11)

This truth is also confirmed in the words of the Apostle Paul, as they are recorded in the Scriptures:

For they themselves report concerning us the kind of reception we had among you, and how you turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God,

and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come. (1 Thessalonians 1:9-10)

To those who are students of the Bible, to those who are followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, "God" has made Himself known to mankind in three different "personages".

For example, Jesus taught that "The Father" is God. There are numerous references in the Scriptures to God as "our heavenly Father" and "My Father in heaven".

The Apostle John taught that "The Word" is God, Who became flesh, to be the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, Who is known as the only begotten Son of God. There are numerous Scriptures in the Bible that make reference to Jesus as "our great God and Savior" and "God over all".

The Apostle Peter testified that "The Holy Spirit" is God, when he used the terms interchangeably during his confrontation with Ananias and Sapphira (Acts 5:1-5).

Even in the Biblical account of the birth of Jesus, the Scriptures declare that when Mary became pregnant, she was found to be with child "from the Holy Spirit", and in another passage, that which was conceived in her "is from the Holy Spirit".

However, Mary was told by the Angel Gabriel that the child "will be called holy”the Son of God", and we read this throughout the Bible, that Jesus is called the Son of God, not the Son of the Holy Spirit. The conclusion can only be that the Holy Spirit is indeed God.

These three personages of The Father, The Word / The Son and The Holy Spirit are never referred to in the Scriptures as separate "gods". Rather, the context is always that each is the same ONE, Yahweh God.

Which then is greater? How does one place a "value", and what kind of "rating system" does one use to determine whether or not one person of the Trinity, the Tri-Hypostasis, is greater than either of the other two?

1) Is The Father any greater than the Word, in His capacity as "God", just because it is He, God the Father, Who sent The Word to earth to be the person of the Lord Jesus Christ.

When the Father "sent" the Word to earth, was He not sending Himself, "God", only in the person of The Word, as opposed to the person of the Father?

After all, Who is Messiah? Who does it refer to when the Scriptures declare that "I am the Lord, and besides me there is no Savior." (Isaiah 43:11 and Hosea 13:4)? Who is the Savior, The Father, or The Son?

Those who stumble over the identity of the Lord Jesus Christ demand an "either / or" answer, but according to what is written in the Scriptures, the correct answer is "Both / And".

Think about it, what do we call a male child Who is born as the result of immaculate conception, with His father being the Holy Spirit, and His mother being a female human being virgin? Do we not still call such a male child a "Son"?

And what do we call this Son, Who is identified in the Bible as the human being incarnation of the personage Who previously existed in heaven in "Spirit" form, Who was with God in the beginning, and Who was God in the beginning? Do we not still call Him "God", even though He is now, in His human being incarnation, "The Son of God"?

2) Is The Word any less greater than the Father, in His capacity as "God", since it is He, The Word, Who became the only begotten Son of God, Who willingly gave up all privileges of His Deity in order to offer Himself as the ONLY acceptable sacrifice that could ever be good enough to take away the sins of all mankind, thereby giving salvation and eternal life to everyone who will accept and believe (Philippians 2:5-11)?

It was not the person of God the Father, nor was it the person of God the Holy Spirit, Who came down from heaven to be the One to suffer and die on the cross for the sins of the entire world. Jesus stated that HE is the One Who gives eternal life, and that HE is the bread of life, not the Father (John 10:28 and John 17:1-2).

Who then is greater, the person of the One Who came down from heaven to give eternal life, or the person of the One who sent Him?

3) Is The Holy Spirit any less greater than the Father or the Son, in His capacity as "God", since it is He, the Holy Spirit, Who comes to dwell within the inner conscience, within the heart and mind of every believer, to accept and receive Christ's gift of grace, that being His death and His resurrection from the dead, as payment in full for the complete forgiveness of every sin committed against God during one's lifetime here on earth?

Is it not the work of the person of God the Holy Spirit, as opposed to the work of the person of God the Father, or the person of God the Son, which brings an individual to repentance, in order to receive God's free gift of grace, salvation and eternal life?

The Holy Spirit is the One who impregnated the virgin Mary with the Holy seed of God, and it is the Holy Spirit Who is the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ, yet Jesus identifies the Holy Spirit as the Spirit of Truth Who came to the believers on that Day of Pentecost, and He declares that the work of the Holy Spirit is to testify of Him, of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Which then is the greater work, the work of the person Who draws mankind to God, the work of the person Who saves mankind unto eternal life with God, or the person Who sends the other two to do their work?

In truth, it is impossible for mankind, who is the creation of God, to implement any kind of "rating system" which can then be used in order to "evaluate" the very God Who created us, or to categorize the importance of the work, or "authority", of one person of the Triune Godhead Deity, over the work and authority of the other two.

Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. (Deuteronomy 6:4)

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fourvetta · May 13, 2007

For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist. (2 John 1:7)

The end time church of Jesus Christ's Second Coming is His flesh and blood. The Lord comes with His saints. The Lord is Spirit. The scripture above applies.

seeking_truth_1 · May 13, 2007

Coffee

I guess this is FV's version of "no it's not" or "unt uhhh"

No substance, just gainsaying

For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist. (2 John 1:7)

The end time church of Jesus Christ's Second Coming is His flesh and blood. The Lord comes with His saints. The Lord is Spirit. The scripture above applies.

coffee · May 14, 2007

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It is no surprise to those familiar with these Molokan forums that fourvetta lacks the spiritual insight from the Holy Spirit to understand the very basic elementary message of what is written in the Bible, and this becomes even more obvious as he continues to stumble over the more technical and more spiritual revelations of the Scriptures, which we see in his most recent attempt to "sound" spiritual:

The end time church of Jesus Christ's Second Coming is His flesh and blood. The Lord comes with His saints. The Lord is Spirit. The scripture above applies.

The context of the Scripture in 2 John 1:7 and the Scripture in 1 John 4:1-3, especially the Scripture in 1 Timothy 3:16, all has to do with the literal human being body of the Lord Jesus Christ, the physical incarnation of the Lord Who previously existed in Spirit form as the Word, but Who became flesh when Jesus of Nazareth was begotten to be the Son of God.

Contrary to what fourvetta seems to think, in each of the 3 above mentioned passages from the Bible, the Apostle John and the Apostle Paul are not addressing the subject of "the end-time church of Jesus Christ's Second Coming". The subject and context of what they have written is specifically about the physical human being body of Jesus, the Word of God Who has come in the flesh as the only-begotten Son of God.

Rudometkinites like fourvetta are merely attempting to mimic the same foolish nonsense that has previously been expressed throughout the years in the Gnostic ramblings of their Rudometkinite predecessors, which is a situation that will continue within our brotherhood as long as our Molokan people remain complacent and even apathetic about the current level of Biblical illiteracy that exists.

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fourvetta · May 14, 2007

Contrary to what fourvetta seems to think, in each of the 3 above mentioned passages from the Bible, the Apostle John and the Apostle Paul are not addressing the subject of "the end-time church of Jesus Christ's Second Coming". The subject and context of what they have written is specifically about the physical human being body of Jesus, the Word of God Who has come in the flesh as the only-begotten Son of God.

Simply put, the church is the body of Christ. Jesus Christ in the flesh on earth.

According to the scripture you provided, anyone saying otherwise is a anti-christ.

seeking_truth_1 · May 14, 2007

I'll give this a try and see how long I can get away with it...

FV, "NO NO NO"

Ecumenical 666 spiritual beard has once become the literal flesh and not the spirit

You cannot understand the meat until you have had the lapsha as our forefathers

the anti-christ is present in the ballroom blitz which was once the houses of the holy until genesis as written by Dz. Phil

what was written is just dust in the wind and not literal until the new kids were made to understand the new sensation when not in excess

You better think of what you are trying to do to me because as with mary and martha and the vandellas they knew the better thing to do

Love hurts as it was written in Nazareth but the letter does not kill

To kill one softly and not be too petty but the re(fugee) version is better than the first

I really hate to trip but I will not be utterly cast down

Listening to you, i don't hear nor do i get the (spiritual) music.

As I walk through the valley of the shadow of death

I take a look at your life and realize there's nothing left

for you fv

On my knees in the night

Sayin' prayers in the street light

Ecumenical Ecumenical

coffee · May 14, 2007

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Simply put, it was not "the church" that became fertilized when a certain egg in Mary, the mother of Jesus, was impregnated by the seed of the Holy Spirit. Scripture is clear that it was the Word Who bacame flesh at that moment, when the Lord Jesus Christ was begotten in the flesh to be the Son of God.

Simply put, it was not "the church" Who came out of the birth canal of Mary to be born as Jesus of Nazareth. Scripture is clear that it was the Word, Who was with God in the beginning, and Who was God in the beginning, Who had become flesh, when He came from heaven and dwelled among mankind in the flesh of Jesus of Nazareth.

Simply put, it was not "the church Who was crucified on the cross, Who gave His body to be beaten and killed, Who shed His blood for the sins of the world, for all of mankind. Scripture is clear that it was the Lord Jesus Christ, in one single act of love and grace, Who willingly gave Himself in the flesh to be the only Savior, the only sacrifice that is acceptible and good enough in order to be payment in full for the sentence of death that is required of everyone who sins against God.

Simply put, it was not "the church" Who was buried, Who resurrected from the dead, and Who ascended into heaven. Scripture is clear that it was the dead and lifeless body of the Lord Jesus Christ in the flesh Who was buried in a grave, Who resurrected from the dead in a new, glorified body, and Who ascended into heaven in front of witnesses, to sit on His throne, from where He will return to gather His followers into His kingdom.

Again, the context of Scripture is that God came in the flesh when the Word became flesh and dwelled among mankind in the person of Jesus of Nazareth. According to the message of the Apostles, as it is recorded in the Bible, it is crucial that those who are the true followers of the Lord Jesus Christ know, understand and comprehend that our loving God loves us so much that He came in the flesh of the promised Messiah, the Christ, to die for us, as it is written:

For while we were still weak, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly.

For one will scarcely die for a righteous person”though perhaps for a good person one would dare even to die

but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. (Romans 5:6-8)

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seeking_truth_1 · May 14, 2007

coffee:

Your answer is much better than mine

Thank you for that

Sometimes i just can't help myself :hihi:

fourvetta · May 16, 2007

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Simply put, it was not "the church" that became fertilized when a certain egg in Mary, the mother of Jesus, was impregnated by the seed of the Holy Spirit. Scripture is clear that it was the Word Who bacame flesh at that moment, when the Lord Jesus Christ was begotten in the flesh to be the Son of God.

Simply put, it was not "the church" Who came out of the birth canal of Mary to be born as Jesus of Nazareth. Scripture is clear that it was the Word, Who was with God in the beginning, and Who was God in the beginning, Who had become flesh, when He came from heaven and dwelled among mankind in the flesh of Jesus of Nazareth.

Simply put, it was not "the church Who was crucified on the cross, Who gave His body to be beaten and killed, Who shed His blood for the sins of the world, for all of mankind. Scripture is clear that it was the Lord Jesus Christ, in one single act of love and grace, Who willingly gave Himself in the flesh to be the only Savior, the only sacrifice that is acceptible and good enough in order to be payment in full for the sentence of death that is required of everyone who sins against God.

Simply put, it was not "the church" Who was buried, Who resurrected from the dead, and Who ascended into heaven. Scripture is clear that it was the dead and lifeless body of the Lord Jesus Christ in the flesh Who was buried in a grave, Who resurrected from the dead in a new, glorified body, and Who ascended into heaven in front of witnesses, to sit on His throne, from where He will return to gather His followers into His kingdom.

Again, the context of Scripture is that God came in the flesh when the Word became flesh and dwelled among mankind in the person of Jesus of Nazareth. According to the message of the Apostles, as it is recorded in the Bible, it is crucial that those who are the true followers of the Lord Jesus Christ know, understand and comprehend that our loving God loves us so much that He came in the flesh of the promised Messiah, the Christ, to die for us, as it is written:

For while we were still weak, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly.

For one will scarcely die for a righteous person”though perhaps for a good person one would dare even to die

but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. (Romans 5:6-8)

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Christ is the head of His Body.

22 And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church,

23 which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.

Paul tell us and notice the first verse;

15 I speak to sensible people; judge for yourselves what I say.

16 Is not the cup of thanksgiving for which we give thanks a participation in the blood of Christ? And is not the bread that we break a participation in the body of Christ?

17 Because there is one loaf, we, who are many, are one body, for we all partake of the one loaf.

Christ's church is His glorified body, the Bread which descends from the heavens. The bread which gives life.

Now you would say that Christ did not yet come for His Church, that the church is yet a virgin and not a married woman. But scripture tells us otherwise.

Christ impregnated His wife which gave birth to man child, the Spirit of truth. His church is without sin or any blemish of any kind. Paul tells us that we have a new and living way to the father through His Body or His Church. Also called Zion.

22 Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord.

23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior.

24 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her

26 to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word,

27and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless.

28 In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself.

29 After all, no one ever hated his own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as Christ does the church”

30 for we are members of his body.

31"For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh."

32 This is a profound mystery”but I am talking about Christ and the church.

33 However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband.

For it is said, "The two will become one flesh." But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit.

Just as Christ said, "I and the Father are One. If you have seen Me, you have seen the Father."

Edited May 16, 2007 by fourvetta

coffee · May 17, 2007

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This is an excellent example of what lengths some will go to, rejecting the truth in order to believe the lie, just to cling to the heresy that they have been raised with....

Christ impregnated His wife which gave birth to man child, the Spirit of truth.

Rudometkinites like fourvetta, who are followers of Rudometkin and his writings in the Spirit and Life book, consider themselves to be a so-called "New Israel", and they believe themselves as a collective group to somehow be the "Woman clothed with the sun", who is written about in the Bible (Revelation 12:1-6).

Along this same line of thinking, the Rudometkinites also believe what Rudometkin wrote about himself, that Rudometkin is supposedly the very "male child" who was born of this woman, this "church" of followers who call themselves "New Israel" . It does not end there however.

The Rudometkinites also believe what Rudometkin wrote about himself, that this male child, who allegedly is Rudometkin, is "really" the physical incarnation of the Holy Spirit.

Therefore, we get the "explanation" given by fourvetta above that Christ purportedly impregnated His wife, who then gave birth to the so-called "man child, the Spirit of truth", this being the person of M. G. Rudometkin supposedly.

According to the Scriptures, the Spirit of Truth is another name for the Holy Spirit, Who Jesus also referred to as "the Helper", as it is written:

"If you love me, you will keep my commandments.

And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever,

even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you." (John 14:15-17)

"These things I have spoken to you while I am still with you.

But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you." (John 14:25-26)

"But when the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, he will bear witness about me." (John 15:26)

According to what is written in the Bible, The Holy Spirit, Who is the Spirit of Truth, Who Jesus also referred to as the Helper, IS God, Who exists forever, without beginning or end.

If we are to believe the above hypothesis which fourvetta has presented, that Christ supposedly impregnated His wife to allegedly "give birth" to the Spirit of Truth, in the person of Rudometkin, then how does one explain the existence of the Holy Spirit, Who is mentioned in the Old Testament days, centuries prior to the birth of Jesus?

According to what is written in the Bible, the Holy Spirit has existed with God from the very beginning, as it is recorded in the book of Genesis, in the account that details the creation of the earth (Genesis 1:1-2).

If we are to believe the assumption presented by fourvetta above, there should not be any acknowledgment or existence of the Holy Spirit during the Old Testament days, since He, the Holy Spirit, the very Spirit of God, Who Christ refers to as the Spirit of Truth, would hypothetically not have been "born" yet, according to fourvetta's theory, at least not until after the appearance of Jesus.

This is another example of the recurring existence of Rudometkin's heresy in the Spirit and Life book, which is contrary to what is recorded in the Holy Scriptures.

And as Jesus taught in the temple, he said, "How can the scribes say that the Christ is the son of David?

David himself, in the Holy Spirit, declared, "'The Lord said to my Lord, Sit at my right hand, until I put your enemies under your feet.'

David himself calls him Lord. So how is he his son?" And the great throng heard him gladly. (Mark 12:35-37)

The fact that Jesus mentions it in the above Scripture, we know that King David was very aware of the presence of the Holy Spirit in those Old Testament times:

Have mercy on me, O God, according to your steadfast love; according to your abundant mercy blot out my transgressions.

Wash me thoroughly from my iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin!

Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me.

Cast me not away from your presence, and take not your Holy Spirit from me.

Restore to me the joy of your salvation, and uphold me with a willing spirit. (Psalm 51:1-12)

The prophet Isaiah also recognized and acknowledged the existence and the presence of the Holy Spirit in Old Testament times, identifying Him as the Spirit of the Lord, according to what it is written:

But they rebelled and grieved his Holy Spirit; therefore he turned to be their enemy, and himself fought against them.

Then he remembered the days of old, of Moses and his people. Where is he who brought them up out of the sea with the shepherds of his flock? Where is he who put in the midst of them his Holy Spirit,

who caused his glorious arm to go at the right hand of Moses, who divided the waters before them to make for himself an everlasting name,

who led them through the depths? Like a horse in the desert, they did not stumble.

Like livestock that go down into the valley, the Spirit of the Lord gave them rest. So you led your people, to make for yourself a glorious name.

Look down from heaven and see, from your holy and beautiful habitation. (Isaiah 63:10-15)

Those who are followers of the Lord Jesus Christ are warned in the Scriptures not to be deceived by those teachings which are not from God, those teachings that are described as "diverse and strange":

Remember your leaders, those who spoke to you the word of God. Consider the outcome of their way of life, and imitate their faith.

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

Do not be led away by diverse and strange teachings, for it is good for the heart to be strengthened by grace, not by foods, which have not benefited those devoted to them. (Hebrews 13:7-9)

What could be more "diverse and strange" as to believe what Rudometkin wrote in the Spirit and Life book, that Rudometkin became "born" supposedly as the male child born of the Woman clothed with the sun AND as the literal incarnation, the physical embodiment of the "Holy Spirit", specifically by name, the Spirit of Truth, both conveniently "packaged" together in one person, Rudometkin?

This is the typical heresy that all Khlysty "christs" claimed as their so-called "passage" from being physical beings, to becoming "spiritual", from being a man of sinful bones, to becoming the physical incarnation of the Holy Spirit, as God Himself on earth.

According to what is written in the Bible, the Spirit of Truth is the One Who "fathered" Jesus:

Now the birth of Jesus Christ took place in this way. When his mother Mary had been betrothed to Joseph, before they came together she was found to be with child from the Holy Spirit.

And her husband Joseph, being a just man and unwilling to put her to shame, resolved to divorce her quietly.

But as he considered these things, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, "Joseph, son of David, do not fear to take Mary as your wife, for that which is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit.

She will bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus, for he will save his people from their sins." (Matthew 1:18-21)

It is because of Rudometkin's Biblical illiteracy that he neither understood nor was able to correctly discern the "revelation" of the written Word of God, which is something that can only come when someone is indwelled by the Holy Spirit. This Biblical illiteracy is a condition that we see repeated today among fourvetta and the rest of today's current crop of Rudometkinites.

Rudometkin was quite bold and certain of himself when he proclaimed that his own personal revelations and teachings were new, in fact so new that prior to Rudometkin, supposedly nobody on the face of the earth has ever heard them before. According to Rudometkin, his many revelations were given by a new spirit, about a new pathway to Rudometkin's "god".

In the Bible, it is recorded that the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth, the Spirit of the Lord, the Spirit of God, and the Spirit of Christ, are all names for the same ONE Spirit, Who manifests Himself and has interacted with mankind in a variety of ways, from the beginning of creation. There is nothing "new" about the Spirit of God. He is the Ancient of Days.

For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit.

For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace.

For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot.

Those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him.

But if Christ is in you, although the body is dead because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you. (Romans 8:5-11)

In this single section of Scripture alone, there are 6 references to the same One Spirit, all referring to the same Holy Spirit, all making reference to the same Spirit of Truth:

1) the Spirit

2) the Spirit of God

3) the Spirit of Christ

4) Christ is in you

5) the Spirit of Him Who raised Jesus from the dead

6) His Spirit Who dwells in you

The person who is a student of the Bible knows that according to the Scriptures, the Holy Spirit is God Himself, God the Holy Spirit.

Using what is recorded in the written Word of God as the "standard", as the benchmark for truth, fourvetta's theory quickly disintegrates into the utter nonsense that it is, that the Spirit of Truth supposedly is the man child born of the Woman clothed with the sun who, according to Rudometkin, the "Woman" is "his church", or those individuals who are followers of Rudometkin, and only them, while the "man child" is none other than Rudometkin himself, the self-proclaimed leader of the "New Israel Jumpers and Leapers".

This is heresy which is offensive to God. That our Molokan elders, past and present, would even allow such foolish nonsense to be mentioned within the churches is truly shameful, and sinful.

God has no beginning. God is eternal, forever. The Spirit of the Lord is equally eternal, without beginning, without end.

God is Spirit, and God is Holy. By what other name can His "Spirit" be known, other than the Holy Spirit?

The reason that the Holy Spirit is also called the Spirit of Christ is because according to what is written in John 1:1-14, the Lord Jesus Christ is God. If this were not true, we would not see the two terms, the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ, used interchangeably in the Holy Scriptures. It is written in the Bible that the Lord Jesus Christ is "Holy" (Luke 1:35), just as God the Father is Holy, just as the Holy Spirit is Holy.

The reason the Spirit of Christ is called the Spirit of Truth is because Christ is the Truth. In the Scriptures, the Lord Jesus Christ declares that He is the Way, the Truth and the Life (John 14:6).

The Spirit of God IS the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of God IS the Spirit of Christ, the Spirit of God IS the Spirit of Truth, the Spirit of God IS God Himself. The Spirit of God was not "born". He has always existed. He is eternal.

There is one body and one Spirit”just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call”

one Lord, one faith, one baptism,

one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all. (Ephesians 4:4-6)

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fourvetta · May 18, 2007

.

This is an excellent example of what lengths some will go to, rejecting the truth in order to believe the lie, just to cling to the heresy that they have been raised with....

According to what is written in the Bible, The Holy Spirit, Who is the Spirit of Truth, Who Jesus also referred to as the Helper, IS God, Who exists forever, without beginning or end.

If we are to believe the above hypothesis which fourvetta has presented, that Christ supposedly impregnated His wife to allegedly "give birth" to the Spirit of Truth, in the person of Rudometkin, then how does one explain the existence of the Holy Spirit, Who is mentioned in the Old Testament days, centuries prior to the birth of Jesus?

According to what is written in the Bible, the Holy Spirit has existed with God from the very beginning, as it is recorded in the book of Genesis, in the account that details the creation of the earth (Genesis 1:1-2).

If we are to believe the assumption presented by fourvetta above, there should not be any acknowledgment or existence of the Holy Spirit during the Old Testament days, since He, the Holy Spirit, the very Spirit of God, Who Christ refers to as the Spirit of Truth, would hypothetically not have been "born" yet, according to fourvetta's theory, at least not until after the appearance of Jesus.

The shoe is now on the other foot.

Just as you debate that the Son of God was not begotten until Christ was born. Although He was begotten on the first day of creation. And that the Word was "not" until Christ.

Identically as the Word of God was manifest to us in Jesus Christ and as the Word was from the beginning, the Spirit of Truth became manifest to us personified as the king of Spirits.

The Spirit of Truth was upon the Kings, Prophets and Patriarchs, but not the common man or woman. But now it is a free gift to the believer. We have access to it because of the cleansing of our sins by Jesus Christ. Now having access to the tree of life also known as the Spirit of Truth.

The Paradise within Paradise. Which none of the sons of men shall enter but only the sons of God.

It is for this reason that He came. It is because of this that we shall live forever and eternally not die.

In the time of the Apostolic church the Spirit of Truth was man child which guided the church at that time. But now as a man of full stature in the measure of maturity of Jesus Christ and not as a babe.

Sent for the announcement of the thousand year kingdom of Christ upon the earth.

Just as Jesus Christ is the head of the church, the Spirit of Truth is the heart of every living body.

Edited May 18, 2007 by fourvetta

coffee · May 21, 2007

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My oh my, how sad:

Just as you debate that the Son of God was not begotten until Christ was born. Although He was begotten on the first day of creation. And that the Word was "not" until Christ.

Identically as the Word of God was manifest to us in Jesus Christ and as the Word was from the beginning, the Spirit of Truth became manifest to us personified as the king of Spirits.

The Spirit of Truth was upon the Kings, Prophets and Patriarchs, but not the common man or woman. But now it is a free gift to the believer. We have access to it because of the cleansing of our sins by Jesus Christ. Now having access to the tree of life also known as the Spirit of Truth.

The Paradise within Paradise. Which none of the sons of men shall enter but only the sons of God.

It is for this reason that He came. It is because of this that we shall live forever and eternally not die.

In the time of the Apostolic church the Spirit of Truth was man child which guided the church at that time. But now as a man of full stature in the measure of maturity of Jesus Christ and not as a babe.

Sent for the announcement of the thousand year kingdom of Christ upon the earth.

Just as Jesus Christ is the head of the church, the Spirit of Truth is the heart of every living body.

What absolute nonsense. What is really sad is that whenever fourvetta and the Rudometkinites come up with such foolishness, it appears that they actually believe they have stated something "profound".

In the thread entitled, Is Jesus God?, fourvetta demonstrates his Biblical illiteracy with unabashed aplomb, as he attempts to debate his hypothesis that Jesus, as the Word of God, was "created", to be an actual created "being".

It was pointed out in that thread that fourvetta's theory is contrary to what is recorded in the Scriptures, where it is written that the Word was with God, and that the Word was God, in the beginning (John 1:1-3).

However fourvetta's cavalier irreverence for the written Word of God is made obvious, as he insists on clinging to his heretical theory above:

Although He was begotten on the first day of creation. And that the Word was "not" until Christ.

Rudometkinites like fourvetta want to believe that Jesus is the created "light" which was created on the first day of creation.

This hypothesis is without substance, since according to what is written in the Bible (Colossians 1:16-17), the Lord Jesus Christ IS the Creator, the One Who created that very "light" which fourvetta wants to believe is Jesus.

As Creator God, Jesus did not "create" Himself. Therefore, the "light" that was created on the first day was not the Word of God in His preincarnate existence. This means that Jesus was not "begotten" in heaven, before He was born to walk the earth.

God has always existed, without beginning and without end. The Word, Who was with God, and Who was God in the beginning, was with God in the beginning, as was the Holy Spirit.

Neither the Word, nor the Holy Spirit, were ever "created". Both are "God" from the very beginning, as is the Father.

In Post # 55 of the thread entitled, Is Jesus God?, after he has exhausted excuse after excuse and has come to the end of the discussion, fourvetta responds with the silly and pointless remark:

Based on what your are saying, then Jesus Christ also created the Father, being that He created all things.

Is this not one of the most pathetic statements ever made? The utter stupidity of such a comment, by someone who flatters himself as if he were someone "deep", as someone who is impressed with himself each time he gives a reply, even though so many of his responses are nothing but foolish nonsense.

No, contrary to the heresy that fourvetta and the Rudometkinites want to believe, the Lord Jesus Christ, in His preincarnate existence as the Word Who was with God, and Who was God, in the beginning, Who existed in heaven in Spirit form before He became flesh and walked the earth as Jesus of Nazareth, is not a created being.

According to the Bible, the very words recorded in the Scriptures were literally breathed out by God Himself (2 Timothy 3:16), and it is this very "Spoken Word of God" that was written down by specific individuals who were moved by God to do so, and which has become what believers throughout history know and understand to be the Written Word of God.

According to what is recorded in the Scriptures, the Lord Jesus Christ is the Creator God (Colossians 1:16-17).

According to what is also written in the Scriptures, the Word became flesh, and it was only at that very moment in history, when the virgin Mary conceived in her womb the Son of God, that the Lord Jesus Christ was "begotten". It was only at that very moment in time when God came in the flesh of Jesus of Nazareth, when the Word became flesh.

This is why it was so important for the disciples and the Apostles of Christ to emphasize the fact that our Lord, God Himself, came in the flesh, and that those who deny this Biblical truth are of the Antichrist.

Not to bore the readers here, but there is no place better to demonstrate fourvetta's Biblical illiteracy than when he makes up his own "Scripture", in order to perpetuate the heresy about Rudometkin that he so badly wants to believe, and he then attempts to build a case for his heretical belief system based on these very words which do not exist.

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithful.

But you, say that Lord God cannot be made Manifest in the flesh.

Which is contrary to the scripture, "The Word of God shall be made manifest in man."

Then you never understood the message of the Gospel.

(fourvetta, Post # 5 - Forvetta, Who is Jesus Part II)

What ridiculous nonsense. Every student of the Bible is aware that there is no such Scripture in the Bible. The very concept for this heresy is foreign to the Gospel message that is written in the Scriptures

This attempt by fourvetta to make up his own Scripture in order to change the true context of what is written in the Bible, is an open denial of the very warning that is the subject of this thread, and why the Apostle John and the Apostle Paul insisted on emphasizing that God the Word CAME in the flesh.

To be sure, the disciples of Christ did not teach that the Word of God was just simply "made manifest" in the person of Jesus, as if stating that this "being made manifest" could ever be replicated in another human being. The true message of the Scriptures, in context, is that the Word became flesh, and that when the Lord Jesus Christ walked the earth, He was indeed the Lord, God Who has come in the flesh.

This is why it is so important for those who are the true followers of the Lord Jesus Christ to be able to recognize the spirit of the Antichrist, namely those who deny that God has come in the flesh, in the physical human being body of Jesus of Nazareth.

It appears that the Rudometkinites are unaware that the unScriptural and heretical concept which fourvetta is constantly attempting to "explain", is taken directly from the theology of Rudometkin's ancestors, the Khlysty, who practiced this same heresy whenever any "spiritual leader" amongst them was ever exalted to the status of "christ" over his followers.

As it pertains to our current situation among our Molokan people, this is a figment of the imagination, the imaginations of those who want so desperately to believe the heresy that is written in the Spirit and Life book, that Rudometkin could possibly be the physical incarnation of the Holy Spirit, the very Spirit of Truth, in human form.

the Spirit of Truth became manifest to us personified as the king of Spirits

the tree of life also known as the Spirit of Truth

The Paradise within Paradise

the Spirit of Truth was man child....at that time. But now as a man of full stature....and not as a babe.

the Spirit of Truth is the heart of every living body

This reminds me of the old Ginsu Knife commercials on television:

The Spirit of Truth is Rudometkin, who is known by the title of "king of spirits"....

But WAIT, there's more:

....the Spirit of Truth is also the "tree of life"....

....and Paradise "within" Paradise, as if "Paradise" is not good enough, so now there is a Paradise "within" Paradise....

But WAIT, there`s more:

....and the Spirit of Truth was a man "child" at one time, who is now grown to be a "man" of full stature, no longer a babe....

But WAIT, there's more:

....the Spirit of Truth is also "the heart" of every living body.

It is extremely difficult for me to believe that any individual person, with even the least bit of intelligence within them, could ever believe such nonsense.

Without having a solid spiritual foundation that is based on what is written in the Bible, mixed together with the influences of the Khlysty heresy that he was raised in, it is no wonder that Rudometkin was a sitting target for the first unclean spirit that ever wanted to take up residence inside of him.

Likewise, it is no wonder that those among our "Molokan" people today, who revere Rudometkin's heresies that are printed in the Spirit and Life book as if they are sacred writings, are so confused about what they believe.

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seeking_truth_1 · May 21, 2007

Two points that seemed to jump out for me

First is this:

By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God

The fact that FV, and all true rudometkites, will deny this makes them not of God

From a Biblical standpoint it's quite clear

The other issue is FV's creation of "scripture"

I've caught it numerous times before but after a while your brain goes numb from all of the pig slop he posts

That is how these types of glaring heresies are "snuck in" by fv

He will make things up to defend a position that ARE not anywhere in the Bible

A case in point as fv states

"The Word of God shall be made manifest in man."

As you so aptly stated, this is not in the Bible and is Heresy

Good catch!

seeking_truth_1 · May 22, 2007

This idea of denying Jesus Christ Has Come "in The Flesh" is nothing new to FV

This was from a thread in 2006

<<snip>>
Wherever and at anytime where two or three are gathered under the name of the Spirit of Truth, there is God also. The Word of God is God. Jesus Christ incarnate in the flesh. The body of Christ is the gathering of true worshippers of God in Spirit of Truth. <<snip>>

In addition fourvetta demonstrates his Biblical illiteracy on the idea of prayer

Matthew 18 has NOTHING to do with the minimum number of people required to have Church, or have prayer heard or anything of the sort

In the context of the passage, it's dealing with Church discipline and God standing with those who are His and supporting their decision

"15 "If another believer sins against you, go privately and point out the fault. If the other person listens and confesses it, you have won that person back.

16 But if you are unsuccessful, take one or two others with you and go back again, so that everything you say may be confirmed by two or three witnesses.

17 If that person still refuses to listen, take your case to the church. If the church decides you are right, but the other person won`t accept it, treat that person as a pagan or a corrupt tax collector.

18 I tell you this: Whatever you prohibit on earth is prohibited in heaven, and whatever you allow on earth is allowed in heaven.

19 "I also tell you this: If two of you agree down here on earth concerning anything you ask, my Father in heaven will do it for you.

20 For where two or three gather together because they are mine, I am there among them."" (Matthew 18:15-20 NLT)

There are numerous examples of Believers and non praying honestly to God by themselves throughout Scripture

"13 "And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise [his] eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ˜God, be merciful to me a sinner!`

14 "I tell you, this man went down to his house justified [rather] than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted."" (Luke 18:13-14 NKJV)

Were their prayers not heard, or course they were

It's no wonder fourvetta can continue to be lead astray by mgr and the evil contain within the pages of the S&L

lastinline · May 22, 2007

Coffee & Seeking,

Thanks SO much for being up to the challenge before you, of confronting heresy.

From fourvetta

Identically as the Word of God was manifest to us in Jesus Christ and as the Word was from the beginning, the Spirit of Truth became manifest to us personified as the king of Spirits.

The Spirit of Truth was upon the Kings, Prophets and Patriarchs, but not the common man or woman. But now it is a free gift to the believer. We have access to it because of the cleansing of our sins by Jesus Christ. Now having access to the tree of life also known as the Spirit of Truth.

Here is statement that can only come from a seriously dysfunctional mind and/soul bordering on the edge of committing an action of disobedience toward the Almighty God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit, that can very possibly lead to an actual invitation for being possessed by a demon spirit.

Am I missing something or he is actually saying for all to see, that this heretic M.G.R. preexisted and influenced the "Kings, Propets and Patriarchs". In his disillusionment with the truth of the Word of God, he (fourvetta) has become a god unto himself and/or believes himself to be the incarnate M.G.R. himself!

Fourvetta, I challenge you today to openly claim today, what you seem to believe, that you are Maxim Gavrilovich Rudometkin incarnate and/or possess his (M.G.R.) very spirit!

lastinline (where the view is great)

Edited May 22, 2007 by lastinline

fourvetta · May 27, 2007

Here is statement that can only come from a seriously dysfunctional mind and/soul bordering on the edge of committing an action of disobedience toward the Almighty God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit, that can very possibly lead to an actual invitation for being possessed by a demon spirit.

Am I missing something or he is actually saying for all to see, that this heretic M.G.R. preexisted and influenced the "Kings, Propets and Patriarchs".

The fifth commandment writes, "You must immediately and of yourself, kill the last enemy of nature within yourself. That of Adam and Eve, which is disobedience to the Holy Spirit."

The Spirit of Truth was with God in the beginning. As was the Word of God. MGR book 4 article 5

Those who have refused the Spirit of Truth are transformed into a alien vineyard and have deprived themselves of the Paradise of God.

Inviting instead, the Spirit of Falsity which leads them further away from the tree of life, the Spirit of Truth.

Christ came for that very reason, to allow us to have access to the tree of life. Obtaining again, the image of God that was lost in the beginning.

7 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes I will give to eat from the tree of life, which is in the midst of the Paradise of God."`

lastinline · May 28, 2007

All you Rudometkinites out there have received confirmation that your leader has apparently made it official! Without actually saying it clearly, fourvetta is "Maxim Gavrilovich Rudometkin " incarnate.

He has reincarnated into the god to his faithful believers. M.G.R. is to NOW known as fourvetta to the faithful believers in "New Israel" your leader and the "Spirit of Truth".

He now proclaims a NEW 5th Commandment as "You must immediately and of yourself, kill the last enemy of nature within yourself. That of Adam and Eve, which is disobedience to the Holy Spirit."

All of those who are adherents to the Spirit & Life aka Book of the Sun are to now MUST disregard the Ten Commandments of Almighty God as given to the Israelites and begin to follow the

"New Pathway" as ordained by fourvetta this VERY DAY!

Your are to disregard the original 5th commandment of God:

Exd 20:12 "Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the LORD your God is giving you.

Can anyone but, God himself give His Commandments? Ask yourself that question? What spirit leads someone, to make such proclamations, such as these? (previous post)

Jesus Christ gave this warning!

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. KJV

Jesus Christ warns here:

Jhn 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

Jhn 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.

Jhn 10:29 My Father, which gave [them] me, is greater than all; and no [man] is able to pluck [them] out of my Father's hand.

Jhn 10:30 I and [my] Father are one. KJV

lastinline

fourvetta · May 28, 2007

Can anyone but, God himself give His Commandments? Ask yourself that question? What spirit leads someone, to make such proclamations, such as these? (previous post)

lastinline

I agree. Only God can give commandments. God is Spirit.

The God of all the saints from the beginning, the God of the living and not the dead, the same God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, gave us ten new commandments for each adherents of the Spirit of Truth to follow. Read MGR book 8 articles 22 & 23

The Lord is Spirit and the leader of our education.

We can see clearly by the one who is taught by the book and the letter, the mistakes and the misinterpretations of the scriptures that are made. To their own destruction.

Jhn 10:30 I and Father are one. KJV

When Christ said this, the jews made the same mistake as you. Now thinking that Jesus was equating Himself with the Father. But He did not consider Himself so.

5 Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus:

6 Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped,

7 but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.

8 And being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient to death” even death on a cross!

Christ said, "My flesh profits Me nothing. It is the Words that I speak to you that are spirit and life."

This is the bread which descends from heaven. The Words of the Father through His Son. Who also in these past days spoken to us through the king of spirits.

The believer is One with the Father and the Son.

Christ said, whom you said you believe, but do not believe at all;

20 "I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe in Me through their word;

21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me.

22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one:

23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.

24 "Father, I desire that they also whom You gave Me may be with Me where I am, that they may behold My glory which You have given Me; for You loved Me before the foundation of the world.

The believer of the Word which is sent is in the kingdom of heaven with Christ, even today.

As Christ said, "The kingdom of God does not come by your careful observation. Behold the kingdom of God is within you."

The Word of God incarnate on earth or the tabernacle of God.

lastinline · May 28, 2007

From fourvetta
The God of all the saints from the beginning, the God of the living and not the dead, the same God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, gave us ten new commandments for each adherents of the Spirit of Truth to follow. Read MGR book 8 articles 22 & 23

.

Let's take the challenge and read for ourselves mgr's teachings which can be found on pages 442, 443 & 444 of the s.&l. Take special attention to the last two verses 21 & 22 of article 23 where mgr, in true compassion and offering of his god's grace, warns us all that if we disobey these new ten commandments; he , mgr will personally send you to hell. Does this strike fear in your heart?

Jesus Himself warns us here: Luke 12:5

But I'll tell you whom to fear. Fear God, who has the power to kill people and then throw them into hell. NLT

In the strand about D.H.S and his writing articles for a Mennonite magazine, concerning pacifism, I asked the question, will you now discuss your other views/beliefs with the Mennonites? Should not adherents to the s&l, aka The Book of the SUN such as D.H.S. and fourvetta not share this truth that they hold so dear with the whole world? How can they fulfill the Commandment of Christ to "love they neighbor as thyself" and not share these new ten commandments with their neighbors, so that they can follow them and not suffer the consequences that mgr warns of?

In light of the fact that this book is aka Book of the SUN, should not it's light be shared with ALL?!!!

Jesus tenderly tells us:

Luke 8:16 "No one would light a lamp and then cover it up or put it under a bed. No, lamps are mounted in the open, where they can be seen by those entering the house.

Luke 8:17 For everything that is hidden or secret will eventually be brought to light and made plain to all. NLT

From fourvetta
We can see clearly by the one who is taught by the book and the letter, the mistakes and the misinterpretations of the scriptures that are made. To their own destruction.

We can see, oh so clearly your continual mistakes, misinterpretations and sometimes outright untruths (lies?). It feel that this is what is happening as Apostle Paul, states,

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double‘edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. NIV

From fourvetta

Jhn 10:30 I and Father are one. KJV

When Christ said this, the jews made the same mistake as you. Now thinking that Jesus was equating Himself with the Father. But He did not consider Himself so.

No mistake at ALL!! We can read further down where Jesus clarifies even more so, on WHO HE is!

John 10:35 And you know that the Scriptures cannot be altered. So if those people, who received God's message, were called `gods,'

Jhn 10:36 why do you call it blasphemy when the Holy One who was sent into the world by the Father says, `I am the Son of God'?

Jhn 10:37 Don't believe me unless I carry out my Father's work.

Jhn 10:38 But if I do his work, believe in what I have done, even if you don't believe me. Then you will realize that the Father is in me, and I am in the Father." NLT

ln the highest of regards,

lastinline

fourvetta · May 29, 2007

Let's take the challenge and read for ourselves mgr's teachings which can be found on pages 442, 443 & 444 of the s.&l. Take special attention to the last two verses 21 & 22 of article 23 where mgr, in true compassion and offering of his god's grace, warns us all that if we disobey these new ten commandments; he , mgr will personally send you to hell. Does this strike fear in your heart?

Jesus Himself warns us here: Luke 12:5

But I'll tell you whom to fear. Fear God, who has the power to kill people and then throw them into hell. NLT

Apostle Paul tenderly tells us;

1 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God.

2 Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves.

3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same.

4 For he is God`s minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God`s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil.

7 Remember those who rule over you, who have spoken the word of God to you, whose faith follow, considering the outcome of their conduct.

17 Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be unprofitable for you.

lastinline · May 30, 2007

Let's take the challenge and read for ourselves mgr's teachings which can be found on pages 442, 443 & 444 of the s.&l. Take special attention to the last two verses 21 & 22 of article 23 where mgr, in true compassion and offering of his god's grace, warns us all that if we disobey these new ten commandments; he , mgr will personally send you to hell. Does this strike fear in your heart?

Jesus Himself warns us here: Luke 12:5

But I'll tell you whom to fear. Fear God, who has the power to kill people and then throw them into hell. NLT

Apostle Paul tenderly tells us;

1 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God.

2 Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves.

3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same.

4 For he is God`s minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God`s minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil.

7 Remember those who rule over you, who have spoken the word of God to you, whose faith follow, considering the outcome of their conduct.

17 Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be unprofitable for you.

And your point is????

That, I don't do these things?? But oh contrare. I do. To the best of my ability.

To those who twist and manipulate God's ordinances with their own beliefs that nullify God's Commandments, Christ, told them forcefully;

Mark 7:6 Jesus replied, "You hypocrites! Isaiah was prophesying about you when he said,

Mar 7:7 `These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far away. Their worship is a farce, for they replace God's commands with their own man-made teachings.

Mar 7:8 For you ignore God's specific laws and substitute your own traditions."

Mar 7:9 Then he said, "You reject God's laws in order to hold on to your own traditions.

Mar 7:10 For instance, Moses gave you this law from God: `Honor your father and mother,' and `Anyone who speaks evil of father or mother must be put to death.

Mar 7:11 But you say it is all right for people to say to their parents, `Sorry, I can't help you. For I have vowed to give to God what I could have given to you.

Mar 7:12 You let them disregard their needy parents.

Mar 7:13 As such, you break the law of God in order to protect your own tradition. And this is only one example. There are many, many others."

Mar 7:14 Then Jesus called to the crowd to come and hear. "All of you listen," he said, "and try to understand.

Mar 7:15 You are not defiled by what you eat; you are defiled by what you say and do!"

To God be the Glory!

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fourvetta · May 30, 2007

That, I don't do these things?? But oh contrare. I do. To the best of my ability.

To those who twist and manipulate God's ordinances with their own beliefs that nullify God's Commandments, Christ, told them forcefully;

Mark 7:6 Jesus replied, "You hypocrites! Isaiah was prophesying about you when he said,

Mar 7:7 `These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far away. Their worship is a farce, for they replace God's commands with their own man-made teachings.

Mar 7:8 For you ignore God's specific laws and substitute your own traditions."

Mar 7:9 Then he said, "You reject God's laws in order to hold on to your own traditions.

Mar 7:10 For instance, Moses gave you this law from God: `Honor your father and mother,' and `Anyone who speaks evil of father or mother must be put to death.

Mar 7:11 But you say it is all right for people to say to their parents, `Sorry, I can't help you. For I have vowed to give to God what I could have given to you.

Mar 7:12 You let them disregard their needy parents.

Mar 7:13 As such, you break the law of God in order to protect your own tradition. And this is only one example. There are many, many others."

Mar 7:14 Then Jesus called to the crowd to come and hear. "All of you listen," he said, "and try to understand.

Mar 7:15 You are not defiled by what you eat; you are defiled by the things you say and do!"

To God be the Glory!

lastinline

To the best of your ability is not good enough. It must be without transgression of the law of Moses.

Moses is the leader of old Israel. Whereas New Israel is under the leadership of the Spirit of Truth, by Jesus Christ in His spiritual kingdom upon the earth for a thousand years.

For example, one who speaks evil of his father or mother MUST be put to death. If one does not put to death such a person, he is guilty of the same sin. He must pick up the first stone.

However, Christ came for us to have access to the Spirit of Truth. The Spirit of truth teaches us to correctly serve God. Now we pray for such a person that God would forgive his sins. The new covenant nullifies the old.

you are defiled by the things you say and do

Agreed. The third commandment covers both honoring parents and the things we say and do.;

It is necessary, first of all, for everyone to renounce his rude ways and natural habits and disagreements with ones father and mother and to divorce the matrimony were no promise is made.

Man without the Spirit cannot fulfill the will of God, try as he may. We have no promise in our flesh, we are justified and sanctified by the Spirit.

The fourth commandment;

Make certain that each of you boldly follows in the steps of the true Spirit and not by the letters of the law which bypass it.

Apostle Paul tell us;

4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.

6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

One MUST be born again of the Word and the Spirit in order to enter the kingdom of God, which is spiritual. As Christ said, "My kingdom is not of this world."

Edited May 30, 2007 by fourvetta

lastinline · May 31, 2007

From fourvetta

To the best of your ability is not good enough. It must be without transgression of the law of Moses.

Moses is the leader of old Israel. Whereas New Israel is under the leadership of the Spirit of Truth, by Jesus Christ in His spiritual kingdom upon the earth for a thousand years.

Man without the Spirit cannot fulfill the will of God, try as he may. We have no promise in our flesh, we are justified and sanctified by the Spirit.

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YOUR twisting AGAIN! Come now, I am free from the law of Moses, that no one can fulfill, because as Apostle Paul, explains:

Romans 8:1 So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ Jesus.

Rom 8:2 For the power of the life-giving Spirit has freed you through Christ Jesus from the power of sin that leads to death.

Rom 8:3 The law of Moses could not save us, because of our sinful nature. But God put into effect a different plan to save us. He sent his own Son in a human body like ours, except that ours are sinful. God destroyed sin's control over us by giving his Son as a sacrifice for our sins. NLT

Your "New Israel" is lead by the spirit of deception aka M.G.R. and we receive NO justification from him!

The indwelling of God the Holy Spirit is the result, when justification comes as Apostle Paul explains;

Romans 3:22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,

Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God

Rom 3:24 and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.

Rom 3:25 God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood. He did this to demonstrate his justice, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished“

Rom 3:26 he did it to demonstrate his justice at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

Rom 3:27 Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. On what principle? On that of observing the law? No, but on that of faith.

Rom 3:28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law. NIV

From fourvetta
For example, one who speaks evil of his father or mother MUST be put to death. If one does not put to death such a person, he is guilty of the same sin. He must pick up the first stone.

However, Christ came for us to have access to the Spirit of Truth. The Spirit of truth teaches us to correctly serve God. Now we pray for such a person that God would forgive his sins. The new covenant nullifies the old.

Absolutely wrong again with another BIG twist of the Truth, the spirit of truth, of what you speak, mgr is a spirit of deception! Jesus Christ, God the Son stated;

Matthew 7:15 "Beware of false prophets who come disguised as harmless sheep, but are really wolves that will tear you apart.

Mat 7:16 You can detect them by the way they act, just as you can identify a tree by its fruit. You don't pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles.

Mat 7:17 A healthy tree produces good fruit, and an unhealthy tree produces bad fruit.

Mat 7:18 A good tree can't produce bad fruit, and a bad tree can't produce good fruit.

Mat 7:19 So every tree that does not produce good fruit is chopped down and thrown into the fire. NLT

Matthew 11:28 Then Jesus said, "Come to me, all of you who are weary and carry heavy burdens, and I will give you rest.

Mat 11:29 Take my yoke upon you. Let me teach you, because I am humble and gentle, and you will find rest for your souls.

Mat 11:30 For my yoke fits perfectly, and the burden I give you is light." NLT

Again Jesus Christ of Nazareth states;

Luke 12:51 Do you think I have come to bring peace to the earth? No, I have come to bring strife and division!

Luk 12:52 From now on families will be split apart, three in favor of me, and two against-or the other way around.

Luk 12:53 There will be a division between father and son, mother and daughter, mother-in-law and daughter-in-law." NLT

lastinline (with HIS leading, trying to make sense of it all, whenever possible)

lastinline · May 31, 2007

From fourvetta
Agreed. The third commandment covers both honoring parents and the things we say and do.;

It is necessary, first of all, for everyone to renounce his rude ways and natural habits and disagreements with ones father and mother and to divorce the matrimony were no promise is made.

You a start with a TRUE commandment, then in your usual bait & switch, you bring in a commandment from the spirit of deception (mgr) where it can be found as I previously posted;

"mgr's teachings which can be found on pages 442, 443 & 444 of the s.&l. Take special attention to the last two verses 21 & 22 of article 23 where mgr, in true compassion and offering of his god's grace, warns us all that if we disobey these new ten commandments; he , mgr will personally send you to hell. Does this strike fear in your heart?"

These commandments are from your "spirit of deception" mgr. Again, NO thank you to that!

lastinline (I love the view from here)

fourvetta · May 31, 2007

You a start with a TRUE commandment, then in your usual bait & switch, you bring in a commandment from the spirit of deception

Christ said, "Moses did not give you the TRUE bread which descends from the heavens. For your fathers ate that bread and died."

The TRUE bread is the commandments that Christ gives us by the Spirit of Truth. Which every member of the new covenant of Christ bears His blood or His Spirit upon himself. As is written, "I will write My laws upon their hearts and upon their minds."

This does not consist of the laws of Moses but a different covenant. One of Life and not of death.

Christ said of the Spirit of Truth whom you call the Spirit of deception, which is your own judgment upon yourself.

8 When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment:

9 in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me;

10 in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer;

11 and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.

12"I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear.

13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth.

Edited May 31, 2007 by fourvetta

coffee · May 31, 2007

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Is there no shame among the Rudometkinites for their lack of credibility, and what is most obvious, that they are void of the Holy Spirit in being able to rightly divide the written Word of God?

Christ said, "Moses did not give you the TRUE bread which descends from the heavens. For your fathers ate that bread and died."

The TRUE bread is the commandments that Christ gives us by the Spirit of Truth. Which every member of the new covenant of Christ bears His blood or His Spirit upon himself. As is written, "I will write My laws upon their hearts and upon their minds."

The TRUE bread is the commandments that Christ gives us by the Spirit of Truth? What absurdity in fourvetta's Gnostic attempt to "sound" "deeply spiritual". What foolish nonsense!

From the Bible:

Jesus then said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, it was not Moses who gave you the bread from heaven, but my Father gives you the true bread from heaven.

For the [TRUE] bread of God is he who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world."

They said to him, "Sir, give us this [TRUE] bread always."

Jesus said to them, "I am the [TRUE] bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst.

But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe.

All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.

For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.

And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.

For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day."

(John 6:32-40)

Jesus is not referring to The Church here. He is referring to Himself, to His person, to His body, or as He always referred to Himself, the Son of Man.

No, the Lord Jesus Christ, the incarnate Word of God, Who came down from heaven "in the flesh", as God in human flesh, in the historical person known as Jesus of Nazareth, is the "TRUE" bread of life.

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lastinline · May 31, 2007

From fourvetta
Christ said of the Spirit of Truth whom you call the Spirit of deception, which is your own judgment upon yourself

YES, I agree. I place, judgment in the precious nail-scarred hands of "My Lord and My GOD" Jesus Christ of Nazareth as Apostle Thomas, proclaimed. I boldly proclaim that if the writings attributed to Maxim G. Rudometkin are actually his in the Spirit and Life, aka Book of the Sun (Not the Son). Jesus Christ of Nazareth, the Son of the Living God, would have only have the judgment of sending him to ????? for his words of deception.

Jesus proclaimed;

Revelation 3:13 Anyone who is willing to hear should listen to the Spirit and understand what the Spirit is saying to the churches.

Rev 3:14 "Write this letter to the angel of the church in Laodicea. This is the message from the one who is the Amen-the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God's creation:

Rev 3:15 "I know all the things you do, that you are neither hot nor cold. I wish you were one or the other!

Rev 3:16 But since you are like lukewarm water, I will spit you out of my mouth! NLT

I refuse to follow your false messiah, mgr who you call spirit of truth.

Joshua proclaimed;

Jos 24:14 "So honor the Lord and serve him wholeheartedly. Put away forever the idols your ancestors worshiped when they lived beyond the Euphrates River and in Egypt. Serve the Lord alone.

Jos 24:15 But if you are unwilling to serve the Lord, then choose today whom you will serve. Would you prefer the gods your ancestors served beyond the Euphrates? Or will it be the gods of the Amorites in whose land you now live? But as for me and my family, we will serve the Lord." NLT

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Edited May 31, 2007 by lastinline

fourvetta · June 1, 2007

YES, I agree. I place, judgment in the precious nail-scarred hands of "My Lord and My GOD" Jesus Christ of Nazareth as Apostle Thomas, proclaimed. I boldly proclaim that if the writings attributed to Maxim G. Rudometkin are actually his in the Spirit and Life, aka Book of the Sun (Not the Son). Jesus Christ of Nazareth, the Son of the Living God, would have only have the judgment of sending him to ????? for his words of deception.

I refuse to follow your false messiah, mgr who you call spirit of truth.

lastinline

To such, Christ tenderly replies;

20"Then another servant came and said, 'Sir, here is your mina; I have kept it laid away in a piece of cloth.

21 I was afraid of you, because you are a hard man. You take out what you did not put in and reap what you did not sow.'

22"His master replied, 'I will judge you by your own words, you wicked servant! You knew, did you, that I am a hard man, taking out what I did not put in, and reaping what I did not sow?

23 Why then didn't you put my money on deposit, so that when I came back, I could have collected it with interest?'

24"Then he said to those standing by, 'Take his mina away from him and give it to the one who has ten minas.'

25" 'Sir,' they said, 'he already has ten!'

26"He replied, 'I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but as for the one who has nothing, even what he has will be taken away.

27But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them”bring them here and kill them in front of me."

fourvetta · June 1, 2007

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Is there no shame among the Rudometkinites for their lack of credibility, and what is most obvious, that they are void of the Holy Spirit in being able to rightly divide the written Word of God?

The TRUE bread is the commandments that Christ gives us by the Spirit of Truth? What absurdity in fourvetta's Gnostic attempt to "sound" "deeply spiritual". What foolish nonsense!

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Moses gave Israel bread in the wilderness, the law given to him on Mount Sinai. He was the mediator of the old covenant, the letter written in stone and of things that cannot be changed.

Israel was baptized unto Moses. Only two followed faithfully the law to its end.

Christ is the mediator of the new covenant of the new law of love written upon the believer's heart and mind. The new covenant is of the Spirit and not the letter.

The true bread which always descends from the heavens and gives life.

Each believer in the Spirit of Truth is a new heaven and new earth for God, a new creation. Where dwells righteousness.

Only by the Spirit of God, which Christ gave as a free gift to the true believer, can one know the will, the path and the way to the Father.

Only those who endure to the end of the new covenant will inherit its promise.

coffee · June 1, 2007

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Only the true believer, the one who is indwelled by the Holy Spirit, is able to comprehend the truth of what has been recorded in the Holy Scriptures. Those, like the Rudometkinites, who are instead indwelled by Rudometkin's new spirit, will only continue to stumble over the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, and wallow in their confusion about the written Word of God, which is the result of their lack of understanding, as the Apostle Peter writes concerning those who he describes as "ignorant and unstable":

There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures. (2 Peter 3:16)

Christ is the mediator of the new covenant of the new law of love written upon the believer's heart and mind. The new covenant is of the Spirit and not the letter.

The true bread which always descends from the heavens and gives life.

....All of which has absolutely nothing to do with the "context" of what the Lord Jesus Christ stated concerning the very identity of the TRUE bread of life:

Jesus then said to them, "Truly, truly, I [the Lord Jesus Christ] say to you, it was not Moses who gave you the bread from heaven, but my Father gives you the true bread from heaven.

For the [TRUE] bread of God is he [a person, the very person of the Lord Jesus Christ, NOT some wacko hypothesis that this "He" somehow mysteriously and mystically refers to the "commandments" or the "new covenant" allegedly given by Rudometkin's so-called "spirit of truth"] who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world."

They said to him [the Lord Jesus Christ], "Sir, give us this [TRUE] bread always."

Jesus said to them, "I [the Lord Jesus Christ] am the [TRUE] bread of life; whoever comes to me [the Lord Jesus Christ] shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me [the TRUE bread of life] shall never thirst.

But I [the Lord Jesus Christ] said to you that you have seen me [the TRUE bread of life] and yet do not believe.

All that the Father gives me [the Lord Jesus Christ] will come to me [the TRUE bread of life], and whoever comes to me [the Lord Jesus Christ] I will never cast out.

For I [the Lord Jesus Christ] have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me [the TRUE bread of life].

And this is the will of him who sent me [the Lord Jesus Christ], that I [the TRUE bread of life] should lose nothing of all that he has given me [the Lord Jesus Christ], but raise it up on the last day.

For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him [the TRUE bread of life] should have eternal life, and I [the Lord Jesus Christ] will raise him up on the last day."

(John 6:32-40)

Try as hard as he will, fourvetta's attempt to twist the TRUE intent and context of the Scripture, by substituting and inserting the theory that the identity of the TRUE bread of life has somehow been changed to imply the assumption that instead of referring to the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, the identity of the bread of life is somehow an alleged reference to the "commandments" or the "new covenant" that Christ has given by the so-called "spirit of truth", is absolute nonsense.

There is no other way to say it....this is blatant defiance of the person of the Biblical Jesus Christ, and ignorant and foolish rejection of Scriptural truth.

And this is the difference between those who are the Bible-based followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, who use the name "Molokan" as part of their personal identity, and those who adhere to the heresies of Rudometkin that are printed in the Spirit and Life book, but who still like to use the identity of "Molokan", even though their extra-Biblical religious belief system more closely resembles that of the historical Khlysty, than that of our true, Bible-based Molokan Christian forefathers.

There is no way to get around it. At some point in time, either on this side of the grave, or on the future side of eternity, every individual WILL have to deal with the Biblical truth that God came "in the flesh" of the human being named Jesus of Nazareth, and this is the only reason anyone has even a remote possibility of being ALLOWED to live eternally in the presence of God, in the kingdom of heaven....by Grace alone, through Faith alone, in the TRUE Lord, the Lord Jesus Christ alone.

Know Who you believe in. Know what is written in the Bible. Rudometkin was one of many heretics who have lived and died. The Spirit and Life book is book of heresies. One only needs to look at the foolishness of fourvetta and the Rudometkinites to see the difference

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fourvetta · June 1, 2007

There is no way to get around it. At some point in time, either on this side of the grave, or on the future side of eternity, every individual WILL have to deal with the Biblical truth that God came "in the flesh" of the human being named Jesus of Nazareth, and this is the only reason anyone has even a remote possibility of being ALLOWED to live eternally in the presence of God, in the kingdom of heaven....by Grace alone, through Faith alone, in the TRUE Lord, the Lord Jesus Christ alone.

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Christ said, "Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God."

And, "My flesh does not profit Me anything. It is the Words that I speak to you that are Spirit and life for you."

Christ is the Hidden Manna that came down from heaven from the Father. Apostle Paul explains the "Hidden Manna" as the "Hidden Wisdom of God."

The Wisdom of God made manifest in human form. God on earth. By the Wisdom of God, all things where created.

6 However, we speak wisdom among those who are mature, yet not the wisdom of this age, nor of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing.

7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the ages for our glory,

8 which none of the rulers of this age knew; for had they known, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

This Hidden Wisdom is foolishness to the natural man and he cannot understand it. For it is not given to them, but only to those who are washed in Christ's blood.

New Israel.

Edited June 1, 2007 by fourvetta

coffee · June 2, 2007

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This gets rather old, the Biblical illiteracy, and the arrogant ignorance of the stereotypical Rudometkinite:

Christ said, "Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God."

And, "My flesh does not profit Me anything. It is the Words that I speak to you that are Spirit and life for you."

Christ is the Hidden Manna that came down from heaven from the Father. Apostle Paul explains the "Hidden Manna" as the "Hidden Wisdom of God."

The Wisdom of God made manifest in human form. God on earth. By the Wisdom of God, all things where created.

6 However, we speak wisdom among those who are mature, yet not the wisdom of this age, nor of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing.

7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the ages for our glory,

8 which none of the rulers of this age knew; for had they known, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

First of all, the Apostle Paul DOES NOT speak about fourvetta's alleged "Hidden Manna" in any of his writings. Contrary to what fourvetta wants to believe, there is no mention given by the Apostle Paul anywhere in the Scriptures that the "Hidden Manna" is supposedly the "Hidden Wisdom of God".

Secondly, regarding the "Hidden Wisdom of God", which fourvetta wants to somehow believe is God on earth, made manifest in human form, the true Biblical context of this term, the "Hidden Wisdom of God", by definition, is a message that is "spoken", which the Apostle Paul explains:

And we impart this [secret and hidden wisdom of God] in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual. (1 Corinthians 2:13)

In other words, according to what is written in the Bible, the "Hidden Wisdom of God" is the communicated truth, the very message that God has come "in the flesh" of the person of the Lord Jesus Christ.

It is NOT the physical body of Jesus, the person of Jesus, that is the "Hidden Wisdom of God", but it is the message of the knowledge ABOUT the physical body of the Lord, and Who dwells within that body, which is the "Hidden Wisdom".

Again, to review what is recorded in the Scriptures:

1 Corinthians 2:6-13

Yet among the mature we do impart wisdom, although it is not a wisdom of this age or of the rulers of this age, who are doomed to pass away.

But we impart a secret and hidden wisdom of God, which God decreed before the ages for our glory.

None of the rulers of this age understood this [imparted wisdom], for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

And we impart this [secret and hidden wisdom of God] in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual.

This "Spirit" is the Holy Spirit, given to all true believers and followers of the Lord Jesus Christ. This "Spirit" is the Ancient of Days, God Himself, Who has revealed to His children the "Hidden Wisdom of God", the very "mystery" of Christ, the Good News that God has come personally "in the flesh" to redeem His creation, to grant salvation and eternal life to all who will accept and believe.

When Rudometkinite wrote to his followers that he was introducing them to a new spirit, with a new pathway to his "god", we can be sure that Rudometkin is NOT speaking about the Holy Spirit.

Because of this, we know that the "spirit" which leads and guides the Rudometkinites like fourvetta is NOT the same as the Holy Spirit that indwells those Molokans who are the true Bible-based followers of the Lord Jesus Christ.

And this is what is evident when we compare fourvetta's Biblical illiteracy with the "spiritual truths" that are recorded in the Holy Bible.

John 6:52-65

52 The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, "How can this man give us his flesh to eat?"

53 So Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

54 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.

55 For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.

56 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him.

57 As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever feeds on me, he also will live because of me.

58 This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like the bread the fathers ate and died. Whoever feeds on this bread will live forever."

59 Jesus said these things in the synagogue, as he taught at Capernaum.

60 When many of his disciples heard it, they said, "This is a hard saying; who can listen to it?"

61 But Jesus, knowing in himself that his disciples were grumbling about this, said to them, "Do you take offense at this?

62 Then what if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?

63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is no help at all. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life.

64 But there are some of you who do not believe." (For Jesus knew from the beginning who those were who did not believe, and who it was who would betray him.)

65 And he said, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father."

There is no need to recycle this again. It has been pointed out before, but fourvetta refuses to submit to the truth of the Scriptures. Jesus did NOT say that His body "profits Me nothing". Read the verses above in context.

Also please notice the text in Verse 62, where Christ asks his disciples what they would think if they were to see Jesus ascending into heaven, where He was before.

Christ explains what it means to "feed on" His flesh and "drink" His blood. This explanation is found in Verse 56.

In the original Greek text, these words more accurately convey the image of "to ingest" or to "consume". Jesus simply explains that this means to "abide" in Him.

When Christ explains that the words He has spoken to His followers are "spirit and life", it is the content of what Jesus taught them that is spiritual truth, the very spiritual truths that sustain a person and cause those who are the true believers to "abide" in Him.

The Holy Spirit is given to all true believers and followers of the Lord Jesus Christ. This "Spirit" is the Ancient of Days, God Himself, Who has revealed to His children the information contained in the words that are the "Hidden Wisdom of God", the very "mystery" of Christ, the Good News that God has come personally "in the flesh" to redeem His creation, to grant salvation and eternal life to all who will accept and believe.

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fourvetta · June 2, 2007

The Holy Spirit is given to all true believers and followers of the Lord Jesus Christ. This "Spirit" is the Ancient of Days, God Himself, Who has revealed to His children the information contained in the words that are the "Hidden Wisdom of God", the very "mystery" of Christ, the Good News that God has come personally "in the flesh" to redeem His creation, to grant salvation and eternal life to all who will accept and believe.

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Paul explains, that Christ has become Wisdom from God for us. That the Wisdom of God is our righteousness, holiness and redemption.

26 Brothers, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth.

27 But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong.

28 He chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things”and the things that are not”to nullify the things that are,

29 so that no one may boast before him.

30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God”that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption.

King Solomon calls Wisdom, the Holy Spirit. Those who abide in it and eat of the flesh of the Wisdom of God and drinks of the Spirit that proceeds from it shall never die.

The ninth commandment;

The Savior is Wisdom only, or the omnipotent Word of God.

Jesus Christ is the Wisdom of God personified.

And in the 19th century, the bread which gives life, came down from heaven. That which was hidden is made manifest.

Edited June 2, 2007 by fourvetta

lastinline · June 3, 2007

From fourvetta
And in the 19th century, the bread which gives life, came down from heaven. That which was hidden is made manifest.

Absolutely right and just as my precious Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ of Nazareth predicted and warned of just such a person:

Matthew 24:23 "Then if anyone tells you, `Look, here is the Messiah,' (in the S.&L. aka Book of the SUN) or `There he is,' don't pay any attention.

Mat 24:24 For false messiahs (M.G.R.) and false prophets (M.G.R.) will rise up and perform great miraculous signs and wonders so as to deceive, if possible, even God's chosen ones.

Mat 24:25 See, I have warned you.

Mat 24:26 "So if someone tells you, `Look, the Messiah (M.G.R.) is out in the desert,' don't bother to go and look. Or, `Look, he is hiding here,' don't believe it! NLT

Isn't it great to know that MY LORD warned, all of us Christian Molokan Believers of the deceitful charlatan Maxim G. Rudometkin, himself. What a beautiful message from over two thousand years ago.

lastinline

coffee · June 3, 2007

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After a while, exchanges like this between those who are Bible-based followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, versus those who adhere to the various heresies of Rudometkin that are written in the Spirit and Life book, tend to become rather circular in nature, as it is in this case, with fourvetta grabbing onto any tangent that he can come up with, in order to avoid being accountable for his heresy, or having to acknowledge the obvious.

Therefore it would probably be a good time right now to simply review fourvetta's different contributions to this thread, in order to follow whatever rationale exists in the mind of the stereotypical Rudometkinites, and the lack of truth that pervades their belief system, which is based on their love affair with Rudometkin as their "King", their hero and spiritual leader, and which is fueled by the many heresies that are permeated throughout the writings in the Spirit and Life book.

The topic of this thread is to prompt serious thought, with specific attention given to the adamant position taken by those very men who were hand-picked by the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, to teach the truths that He had imparted to them while He walked the earth.

1) The instruction is given in Scripture, to those who are followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, that true believers will be able to recognize those who are of the Antichrist by one very important truth, specifically that every spirit which confesses that Jesus Christ has come "in the flesh" is from God.

The significance of this Scriptural truth is the recognition and acceptance by Christ's very Apostles and disciples, that Jesus was the physical incarnation of God Himself, and that God indeed has come to earth, and that He lived on the earth "in the flesh", in the very "flesh" that is the person of Jesus of Nazareth, the person of the Lord Jesus Christ.

2) In objection to this Biblical truth, fourvetta responds in Post # 2 that the miracle of God coming to earth "in the flesh" is instead a reference somehow to "The end time church of Jesus" and that "Christ's Second Coming is His flesh and blood", that the Lord comes with His saints, and that the Lord is Spirit, whatever that is supposed to mean.

3) It is then pointed out in Post #4 that the context of the term in the three Scriptural passages that address the subject of God coming "in the flesh" is focusing on the human being body of the person of Jesus, and that to entertain any assumption that the Apostle John and the Apostle Paul are instead somehow writing about "the end time Church" is foolish nonsense.

4) Still objecting to the Scriptural truth that God has come "in the flesh" of the person of Jesus, for the relatively brief amount of time that He walked the earth, literally, as God on earth, fourvetta argues in Post # 5 that "the church is the body of Christ" implying that the Biblical references to Jesus Christ having come "in the flesh" on earth are speaking about "the Church", who, in the mind of fourvetta, is somehow the REAL "Jesus Christ in the flesh on earth".

5) It is then pointed out in Post # 7 that Jesus had a real human being body, "in the flesh", which was begotten in the womb of Mary, which came into the world as an infant through Mary's own physical birth canal, to grow up into the very body of the historical man who was tortured and eventually died a cruel death on the cross, as the Savior of all mankind, as the only sacrifice good enough to be acceptable to God as payment for the sins of the world, after which his limp and lifeless body "in the flesh" was buried in a grave, from where He resurrected from the dead in a new, glorified body, and ascended into heaven in front of witnesses, to sit on His throne in heaven, as it is written in the Scriptures, from where He will return to gather His followers into His kingdom.

In the entire history of Jesus on earth, from birth, to crucifixion, to ascension, the context in the Scriptures is that He came from heaven to earth "in the flesh", in a human being body, and never is there any implication that the reader of the Bible is to assume the Gnostic theory which fourvetta seems so convinced of, that what is recorded in the Bible about the life and death of the Lord Jesus Christ is "really" all a symbolic reference to "the Church".

6) Continuing to reject the true context of Scripture, that God came from heaven literally and walked the earth "in the flesh", fourvetta insists in Post # 9 that his hypothesis is correct, that the context of Jesus coming "in the flesh" is in reference to "the Church", and he then proceeds to explain that "the Church" is Christ's glorified body, and that "the Church" is allegedly the "Bread which descends from the heavens", supposedly the bread which gives life.

However, to demonstrate just how confused the Rudometkinites are, fourvetta states in Post # 25 that the "TRUE bread" which descends from the heavens is "the commandments" that Christ gives us by the Spirit of Truth.

Adding to this, in Post # 29, fourvetta states that the "true bread", which always descends from the heavens and gives life, is the "new covenant" of the new law of love written upon the believer's heart and mind.

So, according to fourvetta, "the Bread which descends from the heavens" is to be understood as (A) - "the Church", or it is (B) - "the commandments" that Christ gives us by the Spirit of Truth, or it is ( C ) - "the new covenant" of the new law of love written upon the believer's heart and mind.

7) In Post # 9, fourvetta makes the statement that "Christ impregnated His wife which gave birth to man child, the Spirit of truth."

In Post # 10, it is explained that according to what is written in the Scriptures, the Spirit of Truth is another name for the Holy Spirit, and that according to what is recorded in the Bible, the Spirit of Truth has always existed, because He is eternal, because He is the very Spirit of God, the Holy Spirit, also known as the Spirit of Christ. Once again, fourvetta's hypothesis contradicts Scriptural truth, and that to imply an event in time when something happened which supposedly "gave birth" to the Holy Spirit is ridiculous heresy.

8) In Post # 11, fourvetta defends his theory by insisting that just as Christ was a "created" being, supposedly having been created in heaven, he implies that the Holy Spirit was also "created" in like manner.

9) In Post # 12, it is pointed out that fourvetta has no Scriptural substantiation for his various theories, but that his belief system is instead based on heresy that cannot be validated, to the extent that in order to perpetuate his heresy, in denial of the Biblical truth that God did indeed come from heaven to earth "in the flesh" of the Lord Jesus Christ, fourvetta shamelessly makes up an alleged "Scripture", indeed he literally "creates" something that is not found written in the Bible anywhere, and then proceeds to "explain" what he believes based on that so-called "Scripture", which is non-existant in the Bible.

10) Not to be deterred by the truth of Scripture, fourvetta offers no accountability for his obvious lack of credibility, but instead proceeds to introduce his theory that Jesus Christ is the "Hidden Wisdom of God" who is manifest in the flesh, claiming in Post # 31 that the Apostle Paul even verifies this statement somewhere in his writings in the Bible.

11) It is then pointed out in Post # 32 that according to what is recorded in the Scriptures, it is not the person or body of Jesus Christ that is the "Hidden Wisdom of God" but rather it is the message ABOUT that body, the message, indeed the very "mystery" of Christ, that God came "in the flesh", to walk the earth in the human being body of Jesus, and that the understanding of this message, is the true "Hidden Wisdom of God".

12) Still in defiance to the written Word of God that is recorded in the Holy Scriptures, fourvetta persists in his theory that Jesus is the Wisdom of God, in fact, echoing Rudometkin's heresy, that the Savior is wisdom ONLY, the omnipotent Word of God, personified in the flesh of Jesus Christ, even claiming that "Wisdom" is actually the Holy Spirit.

The context of the Apostle Paul"s explanation, that Christ "has become" the Wisdom of God, is that for everyone who becomes a follower of the Lord Jesus Christ, what this means is that to receive Christ is to become a recipient of and a partaker of the righteousness and holiness of God, in fact being able to realize the redemption from sin, which can only come through belief in and acceptance of God, Who has come to earth "in the flesh" in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, to be the Savior of all mankind.

Contrary to what Rudometkin and his followers like fourvetta want to believe, the Savior IS NOT "wisdom only". According to what is written in the Scriptures, the Savior is God. He is the Lord. He is the Creator of the universe, as it is written:

But now thus says the Lord, he who created you, O Jacob, he who formed you, O Israel: "Fear not, for I have redeemed you; I have called you by name, you are mine.

For I am the Lord your God, the Holy One of Israel, your Savior.

Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.

I, I am the Lord, and besides me there is no savior.

Thus says the Lord, your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel:

I am the Lord, your Holy One, the Creator of Israel, your King.

I, I am he who blots out your transgressions for my own sake, and I will not remember your sins."

(Isaiah 43:3-25)

I am the Lord, and there is no other, besides me there is no God;

that people may know, from the rising of the sun and from the west, that there is none besides me; I am the Lord, and there is no other.

I made the earth and created man on it; it was my hands that stretched out the heavens, and I commanded all their host.

But Israel is saved by the Lord with everlasting salvation; you shall not be put to shame or confounded to all eternity.

For thus says the Lord, who created the heavens (he is God!), who formed the earth and made it (he established it; he did not create it empty, he formed it to be inhabited!): "I am the Lord, and there is no other."

And there is no other god besides me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is none besides me.

"Turn to me and be saved, all the ends of the earth! For I am God, and there is no other.

(Isaiah 45:5-22)

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fourvetta · June 3, 2007

Absolutely right and just as my precious Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ of Nazareth predicted and warned of just such a person:

Matthew 24:23 "Then if anyone tells you, `Look, here is the Messiah,' or `There he is,' don't pay any attention.

Mat 24:24 For false messiahs and false prophets will rise up and perform great miraculous signs and wonders so as to , if possible, even God's chosen ones.

Mat 24:25 See, I have warned you.

Mat 24:26 "So if someone tells you, `Look, the Messiah is out in the desert,' don't bother to go and look. Or, `Look, he is hiding here,' don't believe it! NLT

lastinline

Jesus said, "The kingdom of God does not come with your careful observation, nor will people say, 'Here it is,' or 'There it is,' because the kingdom of God is within you."

Why do you look towards the heavens for the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ? The Lord is Spirit.

4 Whoever watches the wind will not plant; whoever looks at the clouds will not reap.

5 As you do not know the path of the wind, or how the body is formed in a mother's womb,

so you cannot understand the work of God, the Maker of all things.

lastinline · June 4, 2007

fourvetta, shame on you! You completly changed my quote and my take and/or understanding of Christ's words.

Please do not do that, here is my corrected quote.

Absolutely right and just as my precious Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ of Nazareth predicted and warned of just such a person:

Matthew 24:23 "Then if anyone tells you, `Look, here is the Messiah,' (in the S.&L. aka Book of the SUN) or `There he is,' don't pay any attention.

Mat 24:24 For false messiahs (M.G.R.) and false prophets (M.G.R.) will rise up and perform great miraculous signs and wonders so as to deceive, if possible, even God's chosen ones.

Mat 24:25 See, I have warned you.

Mat 24:26 "So if someone tells you, `Look, the Messiah (M.G.R.) is out in the desert,' don't bother to go and look. Or, `Look, he is hiding here,' don't believe it! NLT

Isn't it great to know that MY LORD warned, all of us Christian Molokan Believers of the deceitful charlatan Maxim G. Rudometkin, himself. What a beautiful message from over two thousand years ago.

lastinline

coffee · June 4, 2007

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Following is a reprint of portions from Post # 54 and Post # 60 in the thread entitled, "Would mgr have been considered and Elder / Bishop / Pastor (episkopos)?"

The purpose is to show that when Rudometkinites like fourvetta do not like what is written in the Bible, because it does not match what is written in the Spirit and Life book, they either twist the Scriptures out of context to make it fit their own heretical belief system, or as fourvetta has clearly demonstrated, they simply make up their own Scripture.

This is especially true as it pertains to their defiant rejection of the truth that is recorded in the Bible about God coming "in the flesh" to live here on earth in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ.

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithful.

But you, say that Lord God cannot be made Manifest in the flesh.

Which is contrary to the scripture, "The Word of God shall be made manifest in man."

Then you never understood the message of the Gospel.

(fourvetta, Post # 5 - Forvetta, Who is Jesus Part II)

This is the very "starting point" from which the Rudometkinites have established what they believe about the very "Word of God". This foundation is based on an alleged "Scripture" which does not exist anywhere in the Bible.

In other words, what the Rudometkinites believe about the Word of God, which includes their open denial about the the true Scriptural identity of the Lord Jesus Christ, is based on a lie. However, fourvetta and the Rudometkinites continue to "quote" these words as if they are indeed written somewhere in the Holy Scriptures.

From this un-Biblical and extra-Biblical "beginning", fourvetta has demonstrated how the Rudometkinites have taken a concept or theory that is not found in the Bible, and have developed as part of their belief system a false theology.

The theory that it was the intention of God the Father, from the very beginning, for the Word of God to somehow be "made manifest" in man, be it in the Old Testament Prophets of God, in the Apostles of the Lord Jesus Christ, in "true believers", or in Jesus Christ Himself, is not a Biblical concept.

Those who are familiar with the history of religious sectarianism in Russia are able to immediately recognize that this theology is part of the Khlysty heresy, which Rudometkin was part of.

Regarding:

The kingdom does not come by observation for it [the kingdom]is within you. - (fourvetta, Post # 86, The Hope That Is In You)

Fourvetta likes to quote the above passage from the Scriptures, which is found in Luke 17:20-21. In fact, fourvetta has obviously based much of his belief system on the theory that the Kingdom of God is found "within" a person, or "inside" of an individual.

However, there are serious problems with fourvetta's choice of mistranslation. First of all, the context of this Biblical passage is as follows:

20 Being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, he answered them, "The kingdom of God is not coming with signs to be observed,

21 nor will they say, 'Look, here it is!' or 'There!' for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you." (Luke 17:20-21)

The Greek term for the word that fourvetta misuses over and over, from the original text, which is pronounced "entos hymon", is most accurately translated in context as "in your midst" or "amongst you", a truth which is even acknowledged in the footnotes of the NIV Bible.

The term DOES NOT mean "within you", especially not the application of definition which fourvetta has twisted out of context.

Consider the scenario of the Biblical passage that is continuously misquoted by fourvetta. Especially consider who was asking the question, and to whom our Lord was answering. Jesus was NOT speaking to His disciples, nor was He speaking to those who were His followers.

The context of this term cannot be "within" an individual, as if to say that the kingdom is "inside" of a person's own mind, since Christ was answering a question that had been asked by the unrepentant and unredeemed Pharisees.

Most of the Pharisees, especially those who were constantly interrogating the Lord, would always ask Jesus questions to test Him, in expectation of "catching" Him with answer(s) that would purportedly give them cause to stone Him to death.

Except for the very few who eventually did come to believe in Christ, the vast majority of the Pharisees were unbelievers, and in this instance, Jesus most certainly would not be telling those who were unbelievers that even in their unredeemed state, the kingdom of heaven is somehow "within" them.

Consider the answer that Christ gave to these same Pharisees, as it is written in Matthew 12:28:

But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.

The context of these passages from Scripture is that the place for the authority of God's reign and rule was no longer reserved only for heaven, as in some far away, unreachable place, but with the coming of God to earth in human flesh, in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, that same authority, that same reign and rule, had now been established personally on earth also, in exactly the same manner as it is in heaven.

What is certain from all of this is that one of the primary pillars in the foundation of the Rudometkinite belief system is based on a lie, based on an alleged Scripture that does not exist, and the other pillar is based on a mistranslation of the original Biblical text, which has then been twisted out of context.

In fourvetta's most current exchange with lastinline, he continues to apply the Scripture in Luke 17:21 out of context, just as he continues to insist that there is some Scripture located somewhere in the Bible that The Word of God shall be made manifest in man.

This is a clear indication that the Rudometkinites are not interested in Biblical accuracy, nor are they concerned about the true context of Scripture, especially as it concerns the Deity of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the very Scriptures that testify of this basic Biblical truth, that God came from heaven to earth "in the flesh", to be our Savior, our Lord, our Master, our King, in the body and person of Jesus of Nazareth.

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anonymous · June 4, 2007

When THE LORD GOD`S people, HIS believers, all the saints who ever lived and will live on this planet, spoke/speak of THE ONE GOD, they referred/refer to.......THE FATHER, THE SON/WORD/JESUS, THE HOLY SPIRIT.

When mgr`s faithful ones speak of the one God, they are referring to the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin.

If they argue to the contrary, they are being unfaithful to the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed to be:

---the great God whose name is enfael savaghana youlya (mgr book 10, between articles 17 & 18)

--- For I and my wife are both Gods of all the earth, Amen, verily (mgr book 10, between articles 17 & 18)

---this Spirit who is in person God and the King of new Israel (mgr 8:15:2)

---King Ures, the new Jewish Messiah (mgr 5:23:1)

---Enfayil Savakhan Ulia, King Ures, the new Jewish Messiah (mgr 6:2:2)

---King Ures, the new Jewish Messiah (mgr 7:28:1)

---For I am Ulesar, the king Ures, the new Jewish Messiah (mgr 10:8:7)

---named Ulesar, the King Ures, the new Jewish Messiah (mgr 10:31:1)

---Enfayil Savakhan Ulia, King Ures, new Jewish Messiah (mgr 13:1:1)

---the true Spirit, descended from the heavens from God (mgr 1:30:1)

---1st Lord and King of the Spirit of truth (mgr 1:31:8)

---this Spirit who is in person God and the King of new Israel (mgr 8:15:2)

---this Spirit of truth named Gelgel Akhmet Ulia (mgr 8:22:7)

---this true Spirit personified as himself, the man, mgr (mgr 8:26:9)

---Akhmet Akhmetovitch, which is the Spirit of truth (mgr 8:29:3)

---the Spirit and the bride in the 3rd feature (mgr 9:22:7)

---the spirit of truth named Gelgel Akhmet Ulia (mgr 10:17:7)

---the new Ulia, am master and king of the 7 Spirits of God (mgr 11:5:5)

---the new Spirit Ulia (mgr 12:9:0)

Their own confessions confirm mgr`s faithful followers' belief/faith in their hero`s blasphemous claims:

---The Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits and God to the faithful. Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord. MGR Book 4 pov. 11: 12-24 (How Many Jumpers?, Post #6, fourvetta)

---The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (Who Is Jesus Part II?, Post #5, fourvetta)

---Maxim says, "I am the Gate of Zion and the entrance to the land of the living." The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (What Is A Molokan?, Post #51, fourvetta)

---So yes. The kingdom of God came to us in the 19th century......" (The Word of God, Post #3, fourvetta)

---Today, the King of Spirits is the Gate and the entrance unto the path of the land of the living. The thousand year kingdom of Christ on earth. No one can come to Christ but through him. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #47, fourvetta)

---Christ said, "I am the Door. No one comes to the Father but through Me." The King of Spirits is the Gate of Zion which leads to the Door, which in turn leads to the Father...... (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #50, fourvetta)

So, when mgr`s faithful ones think and speak of the one God, they are referring to the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, their god/idol, for to their heart/mind they are one and the same (as fourvetta has repeated ad infinitum).

And when fourvetta, who purportedly resides in Heaven, insists on presenting the written text of THE HOLY SCRIPTURES which he compares to "....basically being in Hell" (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #76), he does so with the intent and for the sole purpose of reaffirming and bolstering his belief/faith in the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, fourvetta`s......god/idol.

It is misguided and misplaced belief/faith that plays a major role in this tragic comedy.

The reason for fourvetta`s predicament is because of his unbelief in/rejection of THE WORD OF GOD WHO IS GOD WHO IS THE TRUTH, THE WAY, AND THE LIFE.......CHRIST JESUS (John 14:6), and the acceptance of and belief/faith in a man, one of many, an anti- as in "substitute" who claimed to be a "God," a "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ, the Spirit of truth, the King of the Spirit of truth, i.e., the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, fourvetta`s......god/idol.

According to "the record" aka the personal testimony of THE LORD GOD aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES, however, it is because of fourvetta`s unbelief in/rejection of THE WORD OF GOD WHO IS GOD.......JESUS.......THE TRUTH, that THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH, THE HOLY SPIRIT does not reside within fourvetta, and because GOD THE HOLY SPIRIT, THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH does not reside within fourvetta, he cannot truthfully affirm and address JESUS.......WHO IS THE TRUTH, by HIS rightful and righteous titles.......LORD and SAVIOR.

And it is for this reason that fourvetta and his s&l compatriots cannot answer the question:

Is JESUS.......GOD?

For GOD alone/only is THE LORD as HIS personal testimony "on record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES shows:

"I AM THE LORD your GOD.... You shall have no other gods before ME." (Exodus 20:2-3)

"You were shown these things so that you might know that THE LORD IS GOD; besides HIM there is no other." (Deuteronomy 4:35)

"Acknowledge and take to heart this day that THE LORD IS GOD in Heaven above and on the earth below. There is no other." (Deuteronomy 4:39)

"How great YOU are, O SOVEREIGN LORD! There is no one like YOU, and there is no GOD but YOU, as we have heard with our own ears." (2 Samuel 7:22)

"Let them know that YOU, WHOSE NAME IS THE LORD that YOU alone are THE MOST HIGH over all the earth." (Psalm 83:18)

"`You are MY witnesses,` declares THE LORD, ˜and MY servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe ME and understand that I AM HE. Before ME no god was formed, nor will there be one after ME. I, even I, AM THE LORD, and apart from ME there is no SAVIOR.... Yes, and from ancient days I AM HE. No one can deliver out of MY hand. When I act, who can reverse it?'" (Isaiah 43:10, 13)

"This is what THE LORD says; Israel's KING and REDEEMER, THE LORD ALMIGHTY: ˜I AM THE FIRST AND I AM THE LAST; apart from ME there is no GOD. Who then is like ME? Let him proclaim it. Let him declare and lay out before ME what has happened since I established MY ancient people, and what is yet to come; yes, let him foretell what will come. Do not tremble, do not be afraid. Did I not proclaim this and foretell it long ago? You are MY witnesses. Is there any GOD besides ME? No, there is no other ROCK; I know not one." (Isaiah 44:6-8)

"This is what THE LORD says; your REDEEMER, WHO formed you in the womb: ˜I AM THE LORD, WHO has made all things, WHO alone stretched out the heavens, WHO spread out the earth by MYSELF.`" (Isaiah 44:24)

"`I AM THE LORD, and there is no other; apart from ME there is no GOD. I will strengthen you, though you have not acknowledged ME, so that from the rising of the sun to the place of its setting men may know there is none besides ME. I AM THE LORD, and there is no other.`" (Isaiah 45:5-6)

"For this is what THE LORD says, HE WHO created the heavens, HE IS GOD; HE WHO fashioned and made the earth, HE founded it; HE did not create it to be empty, but formed it to be inhabited; HE says: `I AM THE LORD, and there is no other.'" (Isaiah 45:18)

"`Declare what is to be, present it; let them take counsel together. Who foretold this long ago, who declared it from the distant past? Was it not I, THE LORD? And there is no GOD apart from ME, A RIGHTEOUS GOD AND A SAVIOR; there is none but ME.`" (Isaiah 45:21-22)

"Remember the former things, those of long ago; I AM GOD, and there is no other; I AM GOD, and there is none like ME.`" (Isaiah 46:9)

"`But I AM THE LORD your GOD, WHO brought you out of Egypt. You shall acknowledge no GOD but ME, no SAVIOR but ME." (Hosea 13:4)

"O LORD, are YOU not from everlasting? My GOD, my HOLY ONE..." (Habakkuk 1:12)

"In the beginning was THE WORD, and THE WORD was with GOD, and THE WORD was GOD. HE was in the beginning with GOD. All things were made through HIM, and without HIM was not any thing made that was made." (John 1:1-3)

"Is GOD the GOD of Jews only? Is HE not the GOD of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, since there is only ONE GOD." (Romans 3:29-30)

"So then, about eating food sacrificed to idols: We know that an idol is nothing at all in the world, and that there is no GOD but ONE. For even if there are so-called gods, whether in Heaven or on earth (as indeed there are many `gods' and many `lords'), yet for us there is but ONE GOD, THE FATHER, from WHOM all things came and for WHOM we live; and there is but ONE LORD, JESUS CHRIST, through WHOM all things came and through WHOM we live." (1 Corinthians 8:4-6)

"ONE GOD and FATHER of all, WHO is over all and through all and in all." (Ephesians 4:6)

"Now to THE KING eternal, immortal, invisible, THE ONLY GOD, be honor and glory for ever and ever. Amen." (1 Timothy 1:17)

"In the sight of GOD, WHO gives life to everything, and of CHRIST JESUS, WHO while testifying before Pontius Pilate made the good confession, I charge you to keep this commandment without spot or blame until the appearing of our LORD JESUS CHRIST, which GOD will bring about in HIS own time; HE WHO is the blessed and only SOVEREIGN, THE KING of kings and LORD of lords, WHO alone is immortal, WHO dwells in unapproachable light, WHOM no one has seen or can see. To HIM be honor and might forever. Amen." (1 Timothy 6:13-16)

"To THE ONLY GOD our SAVIOR be glory, majesty, power and authority, through JESUS CHRIST our LORD, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen." (Jude 25)

"`I AM THE ALPHA AND THE OMEGA,` says THE LORD GOD, ˜WHO is and WHO was and WHO is to come, THE ALMIGHTY.`" (Revelation 1:8)

"HE is clothed in a robe dipped in blood, and THE NAME by which HE is called is THE WORD OF GOD." (Revelation 19:13)

"On HIS robe and on HIS thigh HE has a NAME written, KING of kings and LORD of lords." (Revelation 19:16)

"And HE WHO sat on the throne said, ˜Behold, I am making all things new.` Also HE said, ˜Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.` And HE said to me, ˜It is done! I AM THE ALPHA AND THE OMEGA, the beginning and the end. To the thirsty I will give from the spring of the water of life without payment. The one who conquers will have this heritage, and I will be his GOD and he will be MY son.`" (Revelation 21:5-7)

Now, let`s THINK. Since it is only in THE HOLY SPIRIT that one can say "JESUS is LORD," that is to say, GOD (1 Corinthians 12:3b), those in whom GOD THE HOLY SPIRIT, THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH does not dwell cannot say JESUS is [THE] LORD GOD.

JESUS said:

"When THE HELPER comes, WHOM I will send to you from THE FATHER, that is THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH WHO proceeds from THE FATHER, HE will testify about ME, and you will testify also, because you have been with ME from the beginning." (John 15:26-27)

"I have many more things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. But when HE, THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH, comes, HE will guide you into all the truth; for HE will not speak on HIS own initiative, but whatever HE hears, HE will speak; and HE will disclose to you what is to come. HE will glorify ME, for HE will take of MINE and will disclose it to you. All things that THE FATHER has are MINE; therefore I said that HE takes of MINE, and will disclose it to you." (John 16:12-15)

Now if fourvetta and his s&l brethren were indwelt by GOD THE HOLY SPIRIT, THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH, WHO bears witness to/testifies of, and glorifies THE TRUTH.......JESUS (John 14:25-26; 15:26-27; 16:12-15), they would believe and confess JESUS as their LORD and SAVIOR.......GOD, and if they believed and confessed JESUS as their LORD and SAVIOR.......GOD, why would they need "another" God, "another" Lord, a "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ, a "new" Savior?

Why?

Quite simply, it is because they refuse to accept/come unto/believe/have faith in THE TRUTH.......JESUS.......WHO IS LORD and SAVIOR that they have been duped by the master deceiver into accepting and believing in "another" God, "another" Lord, a "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ, a "new" Savior. And because of their "inherited" rebellious stubborn pride, they cannot and will not admit to the truth that they have been duped and have accepted a counterfeit, therefore, are compelled (by the progenitor of stubborn pride) to go to the absolutely absurd and ludicrous lengths they do by distorting/manipulating/perverting/twisting THE LORD GOD`S WORD(S), HIS personal testimony, written and INCARNATE, in their foolhardy, foolish and futile attempts at defending and proving their beloved hero`s blasphemous claims.

Who was it that distorted/perverted/twisted THE LORD GOD`S WORD(S) from the very beginning, and for what purpose?

ANSWER: The father of lies, the devil/satan; to draw THE LORD GOD`S people away from THE LORD GOD, THE CREATOR/MAKER, and after himself, the created being/creature.

Apostle Paul warned the saints in the church in Ephesus concerning this matter:

"For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. Also from among yourselves men will rise up, speaking perverse things, to draw away the disciples after themselves." (Acts 20:29-30)

Now let us take a look at what "the record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES shows:

RE: The book of life

"But one of the elders said to me, ˜Do not weep, Behold, THE LION of the tribe of Judah, THE ROOT of David, has prevailed to open the scroll and to loose its seven seals.

And I looked, and behold, in the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures, and in the midst of the elders, stood a LAMB as though it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven SPIRITS of GOD sent out into all the earth. Then HE came and took the scroll out of the right hand of HIM WHO sat on the throne.

Now when HE had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before THE LAMB, each having a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. And they sang a new song, saying:

˜YOU are worthy to take the scroll, and to open its seals; for YOU were slain, and have redeemed us to GOD by YOUR blood out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation...`" (Revelation 5:5-9)

"And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him (the beast), whose names are not written in the book of life of THE LAMB slain from the foundation of the world." (Revelation 13:8)

"...but they which are written in THE LAMB'S book of life." (Revelation 21:27)

RE: The seal of GOD

"Then Peter said to them, 'Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of JESUS CHRIST for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of THE HOLY SPIRIT. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as THE LORD our GOD will call." (Acts 2:38-39)

"Now HE WHO establishes us with you in CHRIST and has anointed us is GOD, WHO also has sealed us and given us THE SPIRIT in our hearts as a deposit." (2 Corinthians 1:21-22)

"In HIM you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with THE HOLY SPIRIT of promise, WHO is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of HIS glory." (Ephesians 1:13-14)

"And do not grieve THE HOLY SPIRIT of GOD, by WHOM you were sealed for the day of redemption." (Ephesians 4:30)

RE: THE HUSBAND clothed with a garment down to the foot

"For your MAKER is your husband, THE LORD of hosts is HIS name; and THE HOLY ONE of Israel is your REDEEMER, THE GOD of the whole earth HE is called." (Isaiah 54:5)

"`Behold, the days are coming,` declares THE LORD, ˜when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, MY covenant that they broke, though I was their husband,` declares THE LORD." (Jeremiah 31:31-32)

"The I turned to see the voice that spoke with me. And having turned I saw seven golden lampstands, and in the midst of the seven lampstands ONE like THE SON OF MAN, clothed with a garment down to the feet and girded about the chest with a golden band. HIS head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and HIS eyes like a flame of fire; HIS feet were like fine brass, as if refined in a furnace, and HIS voice as the sound of many waters; HE had in HIS right hand seven stars, out of HIS mouth went a sharp two-edged sword, and HIS countenance was like the sun shining in its strength. And when I saw HIM, I fell at HIS feet as dead. But HE laid HIS right hand on me, saying to me, 'Do not be afraid, I AM THE FIRST AND THE LAST. I am HE WHO lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen. And I have the keys of Hades and of Death." (Revelation 1:12-18)

"Wives, submit to your husbands as to THE LORD. For the husband is the head of the wife as CHRIST is the HEAD of the church, HIS body, of which HE is THE SAVIOR. Now as the church submits to CHRIST, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

Husbands, love your wives, just as CHRIST loved the church and gave HIMSELF up for her to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, and to present her to HIMSELF as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. After all, no one ever hated his own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as CHRIST does the church---for we are members of HIS body. "For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh." This is a profound mystery---but I am talking about CHRIST and the church. However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband." (Ephesians 5:21-33)

And now listen carefully to mgr`s statements keeping in view that the book of life belongs to THE LAMB WHO was slain from the foundation of the world.......JESUS; that GOD.......THE HOLY SPIRIT is THE ONE WHO seals and is THE SEAL; and that THE HUSBAND clothed with a garment down to the foot is.......THE ALPHA AND THE OMEGA.......ALMIGHTY GOD:

"O my esteemed children! Am I not your father named Akhmet Youlia, who personally in the Spirit, continually prays of you directly to the God of the heavens and earth. [1 Cor. 4:15; 1 Thes. 2:11]

In order that He would visibly in my presence, the King of Spirits, write your names into the Book of Life, and at the same time, seal them within it by His own seal, with which He Himself, eternally and always seals His manservants and maidservants. To those that are worthy of Him that have followed the commandments that were handed down from Him in various Spiritual activities seen at all times throughout the ages and millennium. All this is evident in the plans of the Holy Scriptures and have been pointed out to us in the sentences since the beginning: In Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, King David, Jesus Christ Himself and myself, the commander of all the universe.

This is why I am now called your Book of Life, the seal of the living God and the husband clothed with a garment down to the foot, or said more briefly; the fulfiller of the will of the One who sent me for the thousand years. [Rev. 1:13]" (mgr 8:2:1-7)

"Concerning this, the Scriptures dwell upon it, that everyone will be taught by God, equally the great and the small, and individually by my Book of Life, which I shall reveal to you myself; Written within me by the celestial teachings in the chambers of the very uppermost heavenly rooms in the courtyard of the King of Spirits! Amen. (mgr 8:27:5)

Remember Apostle Paul`s warning to the saints?

"For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. Also from among yourselves men will rise up, speaking perverse things, to draw away the disciples after themselves." (Acts 20:29-30)

Now, THINK. Are mgr`s claims drawing JESUS` disciples to JESUS, or, are mgr`s claims drawing JESUS` disciples away from JESUS and after mgr?

Those who answer that mgr`s claims draw JESUS` disciples to JESUS have missed satan`s "sleight of hand."

Ask yourselves, why is it that maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin is "now called .... Book of life, the seal of the living God and the husband clothed with a garment down to the foot?" Why not the Apostle Matthew, or the Apostle Mark, or Luke, or John, or Paul, or James? Were their names not written down in THE LAMB`S book of life? Were they not sealed with the seal of the living GOD? Did they not follow THE LORD GOD`S commandments? And yet not a single one of JESUS` witnesses to the world who preached and practiced HIS commandments, ever claimed they were "now called .... Book of life, the seal of the living God and the husband clothed with a garment down to the foot." .....Or God, or Enfayil Savakhan Ulia, the new Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ, or Gelgel Akhmet Youlia, the Spirit of truth, or 1st Lord and King of the Spirit of truth, or king of the 7 Spirits of God.

Why do you think that is?

Why?

As believers and followers of JESUS and members of the new covenant --- those who walk not according to the flesh but according to THE SPIRIT --- they were indwelt by GOD WHO IS SPIRIT WHO IS LOVE (1 John 4:8) WHO wrote HIS law on their hearts/minds (Jeremiah 31:31-33), and poured/shed abroad HIS love in their hearts/minds (Romans 5:5b), and in their love for/obedience to THE LORD GOD, they preached and practiced HIS commandments fulfilling the righteous requirement of HIS law (Romans 8:4) written on their hearts/minds, the first of which is:

"You shall have no other gods before ME."

Unlike the law-less one and his sons of disobedience who preach love and the law of liberty while transgressing/trespassing/violating THE LORD GOD`S commandments/word(s) which is [HIS] law (more on this later).

Now let us look at something fourvetta stated recently:

"Even Moses wrote,

38 "This is what you are to offer on the altar regularly each day: two lambs a year old.

39 Offer one in the morning and the other at twilight.

40 With the first lamb offer a tenth of an ephah of fine flour mixed with a quarter of a hin of oil from pressed olives, and a quarter of a hin of wine as a drink offering.

41 Sacrifice the other lamb at twilight with the same grain offering and its drink offering as in the morning”a pleasing aroma, an offering made to the LORD by fire.

Both lambs are a pleasing aroma to the Lord. By this He is Honored. (Where Does Maxim Instruct Us To Follow Anything Other Than God or Christ?, Post #10)"

"You do believe that Christ will come again and with a new name according to the scripture?

Remember, it will hold up in a court of law according to its evidence, without a biased opinion.

Who is the twilight lamb?

38 "This is what you are to offer on the altar regularly each day: two lambs a year old.

39 Offer one in the morning and the other at twilight.

40 With the first lamb offer a tenth of an ephah of fine flour mixed with a quarter of a hin of oil from pressed olives, and a quarter of a hin of wine as a drink offering.

41 Sacrifice the other lamb at twilight with the same grain offering and its drink offering as in the morning”a pleasing aroma, an offering made to the LORD by fire.

42 "For the generations to come this burnt offering is to be made regularly at the entrance to the Tent of Meeting before the LORD. There I will meet you and speak to you;" (Would mgr Have Been Considered An Elder/Bishop/Pastor (episkopos)?, Post #14)

"The twilight Lamb is Spirit. The Intercessor between Christ and man.

Who does not have the Spirit, does not have Christ. Who does not have Christ, does not have the Father.

26 Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

27 Now He who searches the hearts knows what the mind of the Spirit is, because He makes intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose.

29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.

Those who have the Spirit or the Mind of Christ are justified and glorified, being conformed to the image of Christ.

Before we even ask, the Lord hears." (Where Does Maxim Instruct Us To Follow Anything Other Than God or Christ?, Post #12)

Hopefully, everyone noticed this:

"The twilight Lamb is Spirit. The Intercessor between Christ and man."

Can anyone guess where fourvetta is going with these "two lambs"?

Remember when fourvetta made these statements:

"The Lord Jesus Christ is the Word of God and the Word of God came with a new name. Ignorance of the Word of God in NOT an excuse." (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #60)

"The Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits and God to the faithful. Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord. MGR Book 4 pov. 11: 12-24" (How Many Jumpers?, Post #6)

"The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull." (Fourvetta, Who Is Jesus Part II?, Post #5)

"The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull." (What Is A Molokan?, Post #51)

"So yes. The kingdom of God came to us in the 19th century......" (The Word of God, Post #3)

"Today, the King of Spirits is the Gate and the entrance unto the path of the land of the living. The thousand year kingdom of Christ on earth. No one can come to Christ but through him." (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #47)

"Christ said, "I am the Door. No one comes to the Father but through Me."

The King of Spirits is the Gate of Zion which leads to the Door, which in turn leads to the Father......" (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #50)

What does fourvetta say is the Lord Jesus Christ`s "new name?"

"The Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits and God to the faithful. Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord. MGR Book 4 pov. 11: 12-24" (How Many Jumpers?, Post #6)

"The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull." (Fourvetta, Who Is Jesus Part II?, Post #5)

"The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull." (What Is A Molokan?, Post #51)

Again, according to fourvetta, who is the Gate and whom no one can come to Christ but through him?

"Today, the King of Spirits is the Gate and the entrance unto the path of the land of the living. The thousand year kingdom of Christ on earth. No one can come to Christ but through him." (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #47)

"Christ said, "I am the Door. No one comes to the Father but through Me."

The King of Spirits is the Gate of Zion which leads to the Door, which in turn leads to the Father......" (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #50)

Now who do you suppose fourvetta has in his heart/mind when he speaks of "The twilight lamb is Spirit, and the Intercessor between Christ and man?"

Well, who claimed to be:

---the true Spirit, descended from the heavens from God (mgr 1:30:1)

---1st Lord and King of the Spirit of truth (mgr 1:31:8)

---this Spirit who is in person God and the King of new Israel (mgr 8:15:2)

---this Spirit of truth named Gelgel Akhmet Ulia (mgr 8:22:7)

---this true Spirit personified as himself, the man, mgr (mgr 8:26:9)

---Akhmet Akhmetovitch, which is the Spirit of truth (mgr 8:29:3)

---the Spirit and the bride in the 3rd feature (mgr 9:22:7)

---the spirit of truth named Gelgel Akhmet Ulia (mgr 10:17:7)

---the new Spirit Ulia (mgr 12:9:0)

Remember who called himself Akhmet Youlia and one of his "job descriptions"?

"O my esteemed children! Am I not your father named Akhmet Youlia, who personally in the Spirit, continually prays of you directly to the God of the heavens and earth. [1 Cor. 4:15; 1 Thes. 2:11]" (mgr 8:2:1)

"For your sake, in this strong intercessional prayer to God Omnipotent, it will not be permitted for anyone to bypass me in any place to supplicate God; for I am the anointed pillar that stands permanently on the rock of Zion, and I am the stairway into the seven heavens; by which all the prayers of the holy ones forever ascend and descend!" (mgr 14:8:30-32)

Now ask yourselves, does JESUS need a mediator between HIMSELF and men, or, is JESUS HIMSELF THE MEDIATOR between GOD and men?

"The record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES shows:

"For there is one GOD, and there is one mediator between GOD and men, the man CHRIST JESUS, WHO gave HIMSELF as a ransom for all, which is the testimony given at the proper time." (1 Timothy 2:5-6)

Mediator: One that mediates, especially one that reconciles differences between disputants.

WHO is THE MEDIATOR of the new covenant of salvation and reconciliation?

"The record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES shows:

"But when CHRIST appeared as a high priest of the good things that have come, then through the greater and more perfect tent (not made with hands, that is, not of this creation) HE entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of HIS own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption. For if the sprinkling of defiled persons with the blood of goats and bulls and with the ashes of a heifer sanctifies for the purification of the flesh, how much more will the blood of CHRIST, WHO through the eternal SPIRIT offered HIMSELF without blemish to GOD, purify our conscience from dead works to serve the living GOD.

Therefore HE is THE MEDIATOR of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant. For where a will is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established. For a will takes effect only at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive. Therefore not even the first covenant was inaugurated without blood. For when every commandment of the law had been declared by Moses to all the people, he took the blood of calves and goats, with water and scarlet wool and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book itself and all the people, saying, ˜This is the blood of the covenant that GOD commanded for you.` And in the same way he sprinkled with the blood both the tent and all the vessels used in worship. Indeed, under the law almost everything is purified with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins." (Hebrews 9:11-22)

"But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living GOD, the Heavenly Jerusalem, and to innumerable angels in festal gathering, and to the assembly of the firstborn who are enrolled in Heaven, and to GOD, the judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, and to JESUS, THE MEDIATOR of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel." (Hebrews 12:22-24)

Remember Apostle Paul`s warning to the saints?

"For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. Also from among yourselves men will rise up, speaking perverse things, to draw away the disciples after themselves." (Acts 20:29-30)

Perverse: Directed away from what is right or good; perverted; obstinately persisting in an error or fault; wrongly self-willed or stubborn; marked by a disposition to oppose and contradict.

THINK again, and ask yourselves, do mgr`s claims and his protÃ©gÃ©, fourvetta`s statements draw JESUS` disciples to JESUS.......THE LAMB WHO was slain from the foundation of the world to WHOM belongs the book of life; to JESUS.......THE HUSBAND with the garment down to the foot; to JESUS.......THE ONE MEDIATOR between GOD and men [of the new covenant], or, do mgr`s claims and his protÃ©gÃ©, fourvetta`s statements draw JESUS` disciples away from JESUS and after themselves?

Let us witness something else this "student" of mgr`s said and did not too long ago.

It was fourvetta who said this:

....satan twists scripture to serve His purpose. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #39)

And did this:

Jesus Christ who in times past, spoke to us through the prophets, has now spoken to us through His Son, the King of Spirits. (Deception, Post #51)

Now, who claimed to be the King of Spirits?

ANSWER: The man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, per his own memoirs (mgr 2:3:9; 3:0:1; 3:17:1; 3:25:2; 4:2:3; 4:2:4; 4:2:22; 4:5:12; 4:11:22; 4:11:28; 4:14:15; 6:9:6; 7:4:1; 8:2:2; 8:4:7; 8:27:6; 9:15:7; 9:15:9; 13:7:2; 13:12:6; mgr 255 plan; mgr 261 plan).

Now, let us look at what "the record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES shows:

"Long ago, at many times and in many ways, GOD spoke to our fathers by the prophets, but in these last days HE has spoken to us by HIS SON, WHOM HE appointed the heir of all things, through WHOM also HE created the world." (Hebrews 1:1-2)

By WHOM, through WHOM, and for WHOM were all things, visible and invisible, created?

"The record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES shows:

"For by HIM all things were created, in Heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities---all things were created through HIM and for HIM. And HE is before all things, and in HIM all things hold together. And HE is THE HEAD of the body, the church." (Colossians 1:16-18a)

WHO is THE HEAD of the body, the church?

"The record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES shows:

"For the husband is the head of the wife even as CHRIST is THE HEAD of the church, HIS body, and is HIMSELF its SAVIOR." (Ephesians 5:23)

So, according to "the record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES, WHO is THE SON of Hebrews 1:1?

ANSWER: THE SAME SON of Isaiah 9:6, of Matthew 3:16-17, of Matthew 17:5, of John 3:16-18, of John 3:36, of Romans 1:3-4, THE SAME SON of HIS WORD WHO IS THE WORD WHO IS GOD WHO is "on record" as saying:

"Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of ME." (Psalm 40:7)

"Sacrifices and offerings YOU have not desired, but a body have you prepared for ME; in burnt offerings and sin offerings YOU have taken no pleasure. Then I said, ˜Behold, I have come to do YOUR will, O GOD, as it is written of ME in the scroll of the book.`" (Hebrews 10:5b-7)

And what does "the record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES show regarding THE [sACRIFICIAL, PASSOVER] LAMB?

"The next day he saw JESUS coming toward him, and said, ˜Behold, THE LAMB of GOD, WHO takes away the sin of the world!

This is HE of WHOM I said, ˜After me comes a man who ranks before me, because HE was before me.`" (John 1:29-30)

"The next day again John was standing with two of his disciples, and he looked at JESUS as HE walked by and said, ˜Behold, THE LAMB of GOD!`" (John 1:35-36)

Please NOTE that before JESUS came, a sacrificial system foreshadowing HIS coming was in place whereby an unblemished lamb was sacrificed for the sins of the people, once a year, which means that many lambs (and bulls and goats) throughout the years were sacrificed from the time the sacrificial system was implemented, until the once and for all [time] sacrificial death of JESUS, THE [PASSOVER] LAMB of GOD WHO takes away the sins of the world WHO completed any and all requirements for a sin sacrifice.

Plucking out of context SCRIPTURAL passages and weaving his own perverted tale in defense and support of his hero`s blasphemous claims is......."so fourvetta" whose own words indict him:

....satan twists scripture to serve His purpose. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #39)

What a lost soul. It is absolutely pitiful to see THE LORD GOD`S creatures whom HE created in HIS own image, being transformed into satan`s stooges by the creature who disguises himself as a servant of righteousness.

May our great GOD and SAVIOR, in HIS incomprehensible love for HIS creatures demonstrated through HIS sacrificial death for them, open the ears of those who incline to hear HIS voice, the voice of truth from HIMSELF WHO IS THE TRUTH through HIS personal testimony which is "on record" aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES.

And for those who don`t, talk about being "left behind....."

But then again, fourvetta and his brethren`s personal testimonies bear witness to the truth that they were never "on board" from the beginning.....

Poor, stubborn, spiritually blind and bankrupt s&lers.....

fourvetta · June 4, 2007

Christ said;

24 The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord.

25 It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?

Shall it be any different with the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus Christ who is Spirit? The twilight lamb who takes away the sins of the world?

Grace · June 4, 2007

Christ said;

24 The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord.

25 It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?

Shall it be any different with the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus Christ who is Spirit? The twilight lamb who takes away the sins of the world?

Fourvetta,

Rudometkin is not saying that "it is enough for the disciple that he be as his master". Rudometkin is saying that he IS the Master! As Anonymous clearly and thoroughly stated above, by his own words Rudometkin (and you) INDICT yourselves!

For the sake of your wife and children (and possibly grandchildren) ...... beg God to remove the scales from your eyes! Your twisted theology is not only sending you to Hell but all those who are perverted by you because you are teaching them heresy instead of truth.

I'm mourning for you and your loved ones....

Grace

anonymous · June 4, 2007

Shall it be any different with the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus Christ who is Spirit? The twilight lamb who takes away the sins of the world?

fourvetta,

So who is the lamb offered/sacrificed in the morning? (Exodus 29:39a)

fourvetta · June 4, 2007

Fourvetta,

Rudometkin is not saying that "it is enough for the disciple that he be as his master". Rudometkin is saying that he IS the Master! As Anonymous clearly and thoroughly stated above, by his own words Rudometkin (and you) INDICT yourselves!

For the sake of your wife and children (and possibly grandchildren) ...... beg God to remove the scales from your eyes! Your twisted theology is not only sending you to Hell but all those who are perverted by you because you are teaching them heresy instead of truth.

I'm mourning for you and your loved ones....

Grace

The veil is removed when one turns to the Lord, who is Spirit. The Spirit is our master and teacher of our instruction.

Do not weep for me. Weep for your children.

So who is the lamb offered/sacrificed in the morning? (Exodus 29:39a)

The morning lamb came upon the young colt. The twilight lamb came upon the white steed.

anonymous · June 5, 2007

QUOTE

The morning lamb came upon the young colt. The twilight lamb came upon the white steed.

THE ONE SACRIFICIAL PASSOVER LAMB is.......THE CHRIST/MESSIAH.......JESUS of Nazareth from Galilee.......THE LION of the tribe of Judah.......THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER.

But who is this "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ named maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin?

fourvetta · June 5, 2007

THE ONE SACRIFICIAL PASSOVER LAMB is.......THE CHRIST/MESSIAH.......JESUS of Nazareth from Galilee.......THE LION of the tribe of Judah.......THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER.

But who is this "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ named maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin?

The horse and its rider are one and the same.

1 I saw still another mighty angel coming down from heaven, clothed with a cloud. And a rainbow was on his head, his face was like the sun, and his feet like pillars of fire.

2 He had a little book open in his hand. And he set his right foot on the sea and his left foot on the land,

3 and cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roars. When he cried out, seven thunders uttered their voices.

Grace · June 5, 2007

THE ONE SACRIFICIAL PASSOVER LAMB is.......THE CHRIST/MESSIAH.......JESUS of Nazareth from Galilee.......THE LION of the tribe of Judah.......THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER.

But who is this "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ named maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin?

The horse and its rider are one and the same.

1 I saw still another mighty angel coming down from heaven, clothed with a cloud. And a rainbow was on his head, his face was like the sun, and his feet like pillars of fire.

2 He had a little book open in his hand. And he set his right foot on the sea and his left foot on the land,

3 and cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roars. When he cried out, seven thunders uttered their voices.

Anonymous,

I think that Fourvetta's answer is that Jesus Christ is Makcim Gavrilovitch Rudometkin in Jesus' second coming? That makes total sense when you read Makcim's spirit-inspired writings where he claims to be the incarnate Holy Spirit (as well as "the Christ") who came down from heaven in the 19th century.....I guess that would also make him "God the Father" since Rudometkin writes that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are "one".

So not only is Makcim Gavrilovitch Rudometkin the white horse that the conqueror rides on, he IS the conqueror! I wonder if that makes him a centaur? And THAT would nicely dovetail in with the spirit (no pun intended) that inspired Rudometkin--the same old serpent who inspired the pagan religions of the world, especially the "mystery religion--Babylon".

Isn't it interesting that Rudometkin's writings and drawings can all be connected and correlated with pagan religions but not the Bible? Probably because you cannot put the "square peg of pagan religion" into the "round hole of Christianity".....although Fourvetta has definitely been trying.

Meanwhile, all these "Molokans" sitting together on benches in church "worshipping" alongside pagans whose idol-worship is blasphemy to the living God.....and Molokans giving their children in marriage to these heretical Khlyst pagans!

Keep praying......only God can remove the scales!

Your sister in the "real" Christ Jesus (of Nazareth, not Nikitino--and no, Fourvetta, just because those two towns start with the letter "N" doesn't make it a "spiritual mystery" to be deciphered),

Grace

seeking_truth_1 · June 5, 2007

FV is doing a great job

He's advocating his faith in mgr to the letter

Why aren't the rest of the "faithful leapers and jumpers" doing just like FV?

It's what the book states to believe and to do anything less would make you a part of the "ecumenical 666 church"

What about the rest of the 2 bookers EGK, RO, somebody²nobody, ivanvasilich et al

Why aren't you as zealous as FV?

fourvetta · June 5, 2007

Anonymous,

I think that Fourvetta's answer is that Jesus Christ is Makcim Gavrilovitch Rudometkin in Jesus' second coming? That makes total sense when you read Makcim's spirit-inspired writings where he claims to be the incarnate Holy Spirit (as well as "the Christ") who came down from heaven in the 19th century.....I guess that would also make him "God the Father" since Rudometkin writes that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are "one".

So not only is Makcim Gavrilovitch Rudometkin the white horse that the conqueror rides on, he IS the conqueror!

Grace, you finally got it! I commend you.

But one can only enter by faith into the kingdom of Christ upon the earth for a thousand years through the Gates of Zion. The first Resurrection of the dead and the translation of all the living of the sanctified world.

9 Then he said to me, "Write: ˜Blessed are those who are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb!`" And he said to me, "These are the true sayings of God."

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war.

12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself.

13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses.

15 Now out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And He has on His robe and on His thigh a name written:

KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.

anonymous · June 5, 2007

Grace,

There is a slight "snag" in this scenario.

QUOTE

The horse and its rider are one and the same.

1 I saw still another mighty angel coming down from heaven, clothed with a cloud. And a rainbow was on his head, his face was like the sun, and his feet like pillars of fire.

2 He had a little book open in his hand. And he set his right foot on the sea and his left foot on the land,

3 and cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roars. When he cried out, seven thunders uttered their voices.

THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER is not a horse, neither is HE a donkey, and neither is HE an angel. THE RIDER is THE SON of Hebrews 1:1 which the misinterpreter of GOD`S WORD(S) aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES twisted for his own purposes and to his own destruction (Deception, Post #51).

Now if the misinterpreter hadn`t twisted GOD`S WORD(S) aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES, and read the entire text for context, he would have seen this revelation thus known THE TRUTH.

"Long ago, at many times and in many ways, GOD spoke to our fathers by the prophets, but in these last days HE has spoken to us by HIS SON, WHOM HE appointed the heir of all things, through WHOM also HE created the world. HE is the radiance of the glory of GOD and the exact imprint of HIS nature, and HE upholds the universe by the word of HIS power.

After making purification for sins, HE sat down at the right hand of THE MAJESTY ON HIGH, having become as much superior to angels as the name HE has inherited is more excellent than theirs.

For to which of the angels did GOD ever say, ˜YOU are MY SON, today I have begotten YOU`?

Or again, ˜I will be to HIM a father, and HE shall be to ME a son`?

And again, when HE brings the firstborn into the world, HE says, ˜Let all GOD`S angels worship HIM.`

Of the angels HE says, ˜HE makes HIS angels winds, and HIS ministers a flame of fire.`

But of THE SON HE says, ˜YOUR throne, O GOD, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of YOUR KINGDOM. YOU have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore GOD, your GOD, has anointed YOU with the oil of gladness beyond YOUR companions.`

And, ˜YOU, LORD, laid the foundation of the earth in the beginning, and the heavens are the work of YOUR hands; they will perish, but YOU remain; they will all wear out like a garment, like a robe YOU will roll them up, like a garment they will changed. But YOU are the same, and YOUR years will have no end.`

And to which of the angels has HE ever said, ˜Sit at MY right hand until I make YOUR enemies a footstool for YOUR feet`?" (Hebrews 1:1-13)

P.S. The pathetic piece is that fourvetta is dead (pun intended) serious.

fourvetta,

REPEAT:

THE ONE SACRIFICIAL LAMB is.......THE MESSIAH/CHRIST.......JESUS of Nazareth from Galilee.......THE LION from the tribe of Judah.......THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER.

But who is this "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ named maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin?

Grace · June 5, 2007

Anonymous,

I think that Fourvetta's answer is that Jesus Christ is Makcim Gavrilovitch Rudometkin in Jesus' second coming? That makes total sense when you read Makcim's spirit-inspired writings where he claims to be the incarnate Holy Spirit (as well as "the Christ") who came down from heaven in the 19th century.....I guess that would also make him "God the Father" since Rudometkin writes that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are "one".

So not only is Makcim Gavrilovitch Rudometkin the white horse that the conqueror rides on, he IS the conqueror!

Grace, you finally got it! I commend you.

But one can only enter by faith into the kingdom of Christ upon the earth for a thousand years through the Gates of Zion. The first Resurrection of the dead and the translation of all the living of the sanctified world.

9 Then he said to me, "Write: ˜Blessed are those who are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb!`" And he said to me, "These are the true sayings of God."

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war.

12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself.

13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses.

15 Now out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And He has on His robe and on His thigh a name written:

KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.

Fourvetta,

Thank you for your commendation but I still have a question. So if Makcim is "Jesus Christ come in the flesh from heaven to earth in the 19th century", why did Makcim have earthly parents? Or do you believe he was never birthed as a human--that he simply "arrived" from heaven?

Jesus of Nazareth was born of a human woman named Mary but his Father was God by the action of God the Holy Spirit. Mary did not have sexual relations before becoming pregnant.

Do you believe that Makcim was also "immaculately conceived" in his human mother--that he had no earthly father?

Your clarification on this will be appreciated.

Grace

fourvetta · June 6, 2007

Grace,

There is a slight "snag" in this scenario.

The horse and its rider are one and the same.

1 I saw still another mighty angel coming down from heaven, clothed with a cloud. And a rainbow was on his head, his face was like the sun, and his feet like pillars of fire.

2 He had a little book open in his hand. And he set his right foot on the sea and his left foot on the land,

3 and cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roars. When he cried out, seven thunders uttered their voices.

THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER is not a horse, neither is HE a donkey, and neither is HE an angel. THE RIDER is THE SON of Hebrews 1:1 which the misinterpreter of GOD`S WORD(S) aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES twisted for his own purposes and to his own destruction (Deception, Post #51).

Now if the misinterpreter hadn`t twisted GOD`S WORD(S) aka THE HOLY SCRIPTURES, and read the entire text for context, he would have seen this revelation thus known THE TRUTH.

"Long ago, at many times and in many ways, GOD spoke to our fathers by the prophets, but in these last days HE has spoken to us by HIS SON, WHOM HE appointed the heir of all things, through WHOM also HE created the world. HE is the radiance of the glory of GOD and the exact imprint of HIS nature, and HE upholds the universe by the word of HIS power.

After making purification for sins, HE sat down at the right hand of THE MAJESTY ON HIGH, having become as much superior to angels as the name HE has inherited is more excellent than theirs.

For to which of the angels did GOD ever say, ˜YOU are MY SON, today I have begotten YOU`?

Or again, ˜I will be to HIM a father, and HE shall be to ME a son`?

And again, when HE brings the firstborn into the world, HE says, ˜Let all GOD`S angels worship HIM.`

Of the angels HE says, ˜HE makes HIS angels winds, and HIS ministers a flame of fire.`

But of THE SON HE says, ˜YOUR throne, O GOD, is forever and ever, the scepter of uprightness is the scepter of YOUR KINGDOM. YOU have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore GOD, your GOD, has anointed YOU with the oil of gladness beyond YOUR companions.`

And, ˜YOU, LORD, laid the foundation of the earth in the beginning, and the heavens are the work of YOUR hands; they will perish, but YOU remain; they will all wear out like a garment, like a robe YOU will roll them up, like a garment they will changed. But YOU are the same, and YOUR years will have no end.`

And to which of the angels has HE ever said, ˜Sit at MY right hand until I make YOUR enemies a footstool for YOUR feet`?" (Hebrews 1:1-13)

P.S. The pathetic piece is that fourvetta is dead (pun intended) serious.

fourvetta,

REPEAT:

THE ONE SACRIFICIAL LAMB is.......THE MESSIAH/CHRIST.......JESUS of Nazareth from Galilee.......THE LION from the tribe of Judah.......THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER.

But who is this "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ named maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin?

To answer your last question, he is the true Son of God. MGR book 9 article 15

Christ said concerning him;

6 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts.

7 He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be My son.

In context, Christ the Alpha and the Omega, is speaking of someone other then Himself. The Conqueror or he who overcomes is His Son.

32 but Jesus said to them, "I have shown you many great miracles from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?"

33"We are not stoning you for any of these," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

34 Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are gods'?

35 If he called them 'gods,' to whom the word of God came”and the Scripture cannot be broken”

36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son'?

If you read the above scripture carefully, the Jews made themselves to be equals to God while Christ said, he is God's Son. And they accused Him of blasphemy?

Edited June 6, 2007 by fourvetta

fourvetta · June 6, 2007

Fourvetta,

Thank you for your commendation but I still have a question. So if Makcim is "Jesus Christ come in the flesh from heaven to earth in the 19th century", why did Makcim have earthly parents? Or do you believe he was never birthed as a human--that he simply "arrived" from heaven?

Jesus of Nazareth was born of a human woman named Mary but his Father was God by the action of God the Holy Spirit. Mary did not have sexual relations before becoming pregnant.

Do you believe that Makcim was also "immaculately conceived" in his human mother--that he had no earthly father?

Your clarification on this will be appreciated.

Grace

Heaven is spiritual understanding, while the earthly is literal.

Christ said, "I am from above, you are from beneath."

Mary had sexual relations after the birth of Christ, but the Catholics revere her as the virgin Mary. Christ did have brothers and sisters. To them it would be sacrilegious to say that she did.

But Maxim was born as any other man. His first birth was after the flesh of his fathers. Sinful with dishonor and corruption.

His second birth by which he was sanctified is the Lord from above.

The hope of us all.

Apostle Paul writes;

20 But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.

21 For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead.

22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive.

23 But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ`s at His coming.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption.

43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power.

44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, "The first man Adam became a living being." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual.

47 The first man was of the earth, made of dust; the second Man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As was the man of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as is the heavenly Man, so also are those who are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.

His Father was Christ and his mother, the woman clothed in the sun. Rev. 12

You could say that he was immaculately conceived without the act itself as was Christ.

As he said, "I am by faith, born to the Woman clothed in the sun."

Edited June 6, 2007 by fourvetta

anonymous · June 6, 2007

But who is this "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ named maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin?

To answer your last question, he is the true Son of God. MGR book 9 article 15

fourvetta,

Was the Apostle Matthew a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle Philip a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle Bartholomew a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle John a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle Paul a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle Peter a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle James (son of Zebedee) a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle Thomas a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle Simon (the Zealot) a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle James (son of Alphaeus) a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle Thaddaeus a true son of GOD?

Was the Apostle Andrew a true son of GOD?

Did they ever refer to themselves as "new" Judean/Jewish Messiahs/Christs?

Why not?

(They, of all people, certainly were qualified as they were Jews and anointed by THE LORD GOD for HIS service.)

steadfast · June 6, 2007

His (Maxim Rudometkin) second birth by which he was sanctified is the Lord from above.

In the light of the New Israel Gospels, prove with contextual Bible scripture that Maxim Rudometkin had the Holy Spirit.

stevepiv · February 14, 2010

Anonymous,

I think that Fourvetta's answer is that Jesus Christ is Makcim Gavrilovitch Rudometkin in Jesus' second coming? That makes total sense when you read Makcim's spirit-inspired writings where he claims to be the incarnate Holy Spirit (as well as "the Christ") who came down from heaven in the 19th century.....I guess that would also make him "God the Father" since Rudometkin writes that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are "one".

So not only is Makcim Gavrilovitch Rudometkin the white horse that the conqueror rides on, he IS the conqueror!

Grace, you finally got it! I commend you.

But one can only enter by faith into the kingdom of Christ upon the earth for a thousand years through the Gates of Zion. The first Resurrection of the dead and the translation of all the living of the sanctified world.

9 Then he said to me, "Write: ˜Blessed are those who are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb!`" And he said to me, "These are the true sayings of God."

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war.

12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself.

13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses.

15 Now out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And He has on His robe and on His thigh a name written:

KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.

To the top...

seeking_truth_1 · February 15, 2010

Sure would be nice if fv would answer some of these questions instead of disappearing like usual

GoodDay · February 15, 2010

Sure would be nice if fv would answer some of these questions instead of disappearing like usual

Satan must go "to and fro."

He'll be back.

seeking_truth_1 · February 15, 2010

fv is calling mgr "Christ" and this is EXACTLY what the extra book teaches

THE ONE SACRIFICIAL PASSOVER LAMB is.......THE CHRIST/MESSIAH.......JESUS of Nazareth from Galilee.......THE LION of the tribe of Judah.......THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER.

But who is this "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ named maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin?

The horse and its rider are one and the same.

1 I saw still another mighty angel coming down from heaven, clothed with a cloud. And a rainbow was on his head, his face was like the sun, and his feet like pillars of fire.

2 He had a little book open in his hand. And he set his right foot on the sea and his left foot on the land,

3 and cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roars. When he cried out, seven thunders uttered their voices.

GoodDay · February 15, 2010

fv is calling mgr "Christ" and this is EXACTLY what the extra book teaches

THE ONE SACRIFICIAL PASSOVER LAMB is.......THE CHRIST/MESSIAH.......JESUS of Nazareth from Galilee.......THE LION of the tribe of Judah.......THE TRIUMPHANT AND VICTORIOUS RIDER.

But who is this "new" Judean/Jewish Messiah/Christ named maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin?

The horse and its rider are one and the same.

1 I saw still another mighty angel coming down from heaven, clothed with a cloud. And a rainbow was on his head, his face was like the sun, and his feet like pillars of fire.

2 He had a little book open in his hand. And he set his right foot on the sea and his left foot on the land,

3 and cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roars. When he cried out, seven thunders uttered their voices.

It's the evil spirit in forvetta that he has allowed to take over his life we see. It has to be as he has a connection with spirit and life and one does not work with out the other. when I think of the spirit and life I think of fourvetta before I think of maxcim. When I think of maxcim I think of fourvetta. When I think of fourvetta I think of both the spirit and life and maxcim. I think of all of these things as equally evil and not one thought of The Truth can dwell in any of it or them.

stevepiv · October 23, 2010

To the top again....

seeking_truth_1 · December 19, 2010

Seeing as Christs birthday is coming up, this would be a good topic to bump

lastinline · March 13, 2011

four(NO)vetta, to the rescue with Beelzebub mentality.

lastinline (& steeped in reality)

Christ said;

24 The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord.

25 It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?

Shall it be any different with the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus Christ who is Spirit? The twilight lamb who takes away the sins of the world?

seeking_truth_1 · May 30, 2011

This certainly needs to be re-read for all those who still do not understand the gravity of actively participating in the cult of molokanism

This certainly is not a battle of wills, words or ideologies, but one the that is Spiritual and the weapons need to be of a similar type

seeking_truth_1 · May 30, 2011

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. (1 Timothy 3:16 AV)

stevepiv · May 31, 2011

fourvetta, shame on you! You completly changed my quote and my take and/or understanding of Christ's words.

Please do not do that, here is my corrected quote.

Absolutely right and just as my precious Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ of Nazareth predicted and warned of just such a person:

Matthew 24:23 "Then if anyone tells you, `Look, here is the Messiah,' (in the S.&L. aka Book of the SUN) or `There he is,' don't pay any attention.

Mat 24:24 For false messiahs (M.G.R.) and false prophets (M.G.R.) will rise up and perform great miraculous signs and wonders so as to deceive, if possible, even God's chosen ones.

Mat 24:25 See, I have warned you.

Mat 24:26 "So if someone tells you, `Look, the Messiah (M.G.R.) is out in the desert,' don't bother to go and look. Or, `Look, he is hiding here,' don't believe it! NLT

Isn't it great to know that MY LORD warned, all of us Christian Molokan Believers of the deceitful charlatan Maxim G. Rudometkin, himself. What a beautiful message from over two thousand years ago.

lastinline

I still haven't read the verse that says to continue attending there, paying Church dues and submitting to heretical teachers and corrupt elders.

At least 1 song is sung from the S&L at every Molokan church service, or 1 speech, or a song that derives from the S&L....You seem to have a disdain for MGR, yet YOU KEEP GOING BACK!!!

Your mouth says one thing, but your feet say another.

So Jesus Christ Has Come "in The Flesh"

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