Deception

[anonymous 0]

 

Unmistakably it was the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed the title King of Spirits per his own memoirs (mgr 2:3:9; 3:0:1; 3:17:1; 3:25:2; 4:2:3; 4:2:4; 4:2:22; 4:5:12; 4:11:22; 4:11:28; 4:14:15; 6:9:6; 7:4:1; 8:2:2; 8:4:7; 8:27:6; 9:15:7; 9:15:9; 13:7:2; 13:12:6; mgr 255 plan; mgr 261 plan).

 

On September 4, 2004 fourvetta stated:

 

The Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits and God to the faithful. Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord. MGR Book 4 pov. 11: 12-24 (How Many Jumpers?, Post #6)

 

On September 11, 2004 fourvetta stated:

 

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (Fourvetta, Who Is Jesus Part II?, Post #5)

 

On January 22, 2006 fourvetta stated:

 

Maxim says,"I am the Gate of Zion and the entrance to the land of the living."

 

The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (What Is A Molokan?, Post #51)

 

On June 11, 2006 fourvetta stated:

 

So yes. The kingdom of God came to us in the 19th century......" (The Word of God, Post #3)

 

On August 15, 2006 fourvetta stated:

 

Today, the King of Spirits is the Gate and the entrance unto the path of the land of the living. The thousand year kingdom of Christ on earth. No one can come to Christ but through him. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #47)

 

On the same day, August 15, 2006, fourvetta stated:

 

Christ said, "I am the Door. No one comes to the Father but through Me."

 

The King of Spirits is the Gate of Zion which leads to the Door, which in turn leads to the Father...... (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #50)

 

Let us review the above.

 

1) mgr claims he is King of Spirits (see above mgr references)......

2) fourvetta claims the Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits, who is mgr......

3) fourvetta claims the new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits, who is mgr......

4) Maxim says,"I am the Gate of Zion and the entrance to the land of the living."

5) fourvetta claims the Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits, who is mgr......

6) mgr and fourvetta claim the kingdom of God came in the 19th century......

7) fourvetta claims that today, the King of Spirits, mgr, is the Gate and the entrance unto the path of the land of the living. The thousand year kingdom of Christ on earth. No one can come to Christ but through him, the King of Spirits, mgr......

8) fourvetta claims the King of Spirits, mgr, is the Lord Jesus Christ and the Gate of Zion which leads to the Door, who is the Lord Jesus Christ, which in turn leads to the Father......

 

REMINDER: It was stubborn pride that transformed a beautiful, talented angel into a deceiver, the father of lies/the son of perdition aka the devil/satan.

 

 

[fourvetta 0]

Then surely the anti christ has come, under the name of ignorance. People having eyes but do not see. Having ears but do not hear. Which is like unto Idolatry.

 

"Does the LORD delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices as much as in obeying the voice of the LORD ? To obey is better than sacrifice, and to heed is better than the fat of rams.

 

For rebellion is like the sin of divination, and arrogance like the evil of idolatry."

 

Hebrews 3 tells us,

 

7.So, as the Holy Spirit says: "Today, if you hear his voice,

8.do not harden your hearts as you did in the rebellion, during the time of testing in the desert,

9.where your fathers tested and tried me and for forty years saw what I did.

10.That is why I was angry with that generation, and I said, 'Their hearts are always going astray, and they have not known my ways.'

11.So I declared on oath in my anger, 'They shall never enter my rest.'

 

By this we can know the Lord declared that such people shall not enter into the thousand year kingdom of Christ upon the earth. The King of Spirits is the Gate into His kingdom by which one MUST enter.

 

Shall we all be ignorant of God's Word as the fallen jew or the misguided gentile?

 

Read all the passages that anonymous posted. It is not my opinion, but it is indeed written as he said.

 

So now one can be ignorant or one can enter into God's rest that were ready from the foundation of the world for all of His believers.

 

God's Rest is His Sabbath. God's commandment tell us to honor it. It is a holy day unto the Lord.

 

8 "Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy.

9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work,

10 but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your manservant or maidservant, nor your animals, nor the alien within your gates.

11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

 

God Himself entered into His Rest after He had created eveything in heaven and on earth.

 

The Word of God IS His creation and by His Word all things were created.

 

So the question remains, Does one consider the writtings of the King of Spirits the Word of God? Or do we consider it to be deception?

 

Did one enter into God's rest as God did on the seventh day? Is the Sabbath day also the day of the Resurrection or is it the first day?

 

If we did then why do we still go to church on sunday to seek it? Would we have not ceased from our labors to enter into it?

 

Even Apostle Paul recognized that even after Christ died that there was another rest for the people of God to enter.

 

There is a Sabbath for every generation from the beginning. My Sabbath's you shall keep. (plural)

 

Hebrews 4

 

1.Therefore, since the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us be careful that none of you be found to have fallen short of it.

2.For we also have had the gospel preached to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because those who heard did not combine it with faith.

3.Now we who have believed enter that rest, just as God has said,

"So I declared on oath in my anger, 'They shall never enter my rest.' "And yet his work has been finished since the creation of the world.

4.For somewhere he has spoken about the seventh day in these words: "And on the seventh day God rested from all his work."

5.And again in the passage above he says, "They shall never enter my rest."

6It still remains that some will enter that rest, and those who formerly had the gospel preached to them did not go in, because of their disobedience. 7.Therefore God again set a certain day, calling it Today, when a long time later he spoke through David, as was said before: "Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts."

8.For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken later about another day.

9.There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God;

10.for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his.

11.Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following their example of disobedience.

 

We see that the believer in the King of Spirits then in context has entered into the thousand year kingdom of God on earth.

 

Or we can be outside of His Kingdom with Gog and Magog and crawl around on all fours. Completely mad by the teachings of the anti christ, eating things that animals eat, until we grow feathers and claws like Nebuchadennezar.

 

The devil and satan are chained and thown into the darkest dungeon, which is the dark heart of the unbeliever. To be there also for a thousand years.

 

Until the judgements of God upon him are complete.

 

All these things are an example to us, not to be as a unbeliever, but as a believer.

 

Does not the scripture say, "Furthermore, we have had human fathers who corrected us, and we paid them respect. Shall we not much more readily be in subjection to the Father of spirits and live?

 

Does not the whole world wait for the appearance of the second coming, which according to Christ does not come by observation but is within you? Are not all things created by the Word of God Almighty? Did Christ say that the Word of God shall come again with a new name?

 

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war.

12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself.

13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

 

Did Apostle Paul not say that Moses who spoke on the earth and the people were afraid. Shall we not be afraid of the one who speaks to us from heaven?

 

Did not His Word from heaven come to us in the 19th century?

 

25 See that you do not refuse Him who speaks. For if they did not escape who refused Him who spoke on earth, much more shall we not escape if we turn away from Him who speaks from heaven,

26 whose voice then shook the earth; but now He has promised, saying, "Yet once more I shake[h] not only the earth, but also heaven."

27 Now this, "Yet once more," indicates the removal of those things that are being shaken, as of things that are made, that the things which cannot be shaken may remain.

28 Therefore, since we are receiving a kingdom which cannot be shaken, let us have grace, by which we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear.

29 For our God is a consuming fire.

 

The unbeliever scoffs at the second coming of the Lord.

 

3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts,

4 and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation."

5 For this they willfully forget: that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of water and in the water,

6 by which the world that then existed perished, being flooded with water.

7 But the heavens and the earth which are now preserved by the same word, are reserved for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

 

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night

 

To the unbeliever Christ comes to as a thief in the night. But Christ said that He comes to those who wait for Him in daylight.

[coffee 0]

.

 

So then, according to fourvetta, the Rudometkinites believe that their beloved hero, mgr, is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, who has come to earth a second time, but this time with His "new name", which is supposedly "king of spirits"....

 

and that Rudometkin, as Christ with His new name of king of spirits, is the alleged Gate of Zion....

 

which leads to the Door....

 

who is identified in the Scriptures as the Lord Jesus Christ....

 

which in turn leads to God the Father....

 

and that Rudometkin coronated himself to be "king" over the Kingdom of God, which supposedly came to earth during the 1800s....

 

and that Rudometkin is the Gate through which one MUST enter, before access to Christ's kingdom is allowed.

 

 

The question from fourvetta:

 

So the question remains, Does one consider the writtings of the King of Spirits the Word of God? Or do we consider it to be deception?

 

The Rudometkinites will continue to dabble in "the spirit" that inspired what is written in the Spirit and Life book, as their sacred source of "spirituality", giving honor, glory and praise to Rudometkin as their beloved "king of spirits"....

 

and the Bible based Molokan Christians who are led by the Holy Spirit that was promised in the Scriptures, will remain steadfast in exalting the Lord Jesus Christ, by exposing the writings of Rudometkin in the Spirit and Life book as extra-Biblical heresy, which has deceived many, and continues to do so.

 

.

[fourvetta 0]

So then, according to fourvetta, the Rudometkinites believe that their beloved hero, mgr, is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, who has come to earth a second time, but this time with His "new name", which is supposedly "king of spirits"....

 

and that Rudometkin, as Christ with His new name of king of spirits, is the alleged Gate of Zion....

 

which leads to the Door....

 

who is identified in the Scriptures as the Lord Jesus Christ....

 

which in turn leads to God the Father....

 

and that Rudometkin coronated himself to be "king" over the Kingdom of God, which supposedly came to earth during the 1800s....

 

and that Rudometkin is the Gate through which one MUST enter, before access to Christ's kingdom is allowed.

 

Amen. Now that I presented this to you and you fully comprehend it, now do you believe it? Can you enter into the kingdom of God, by faith?

 

But I suppose not. Apostle Paul in Acts 11 tells us this, that only those who believe are justified by faith.

 

38."Therefore, my brothers, I want you to know that through Jesus the forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you.

39.Through him everyone who believes is justified from everything you could not be justified from by the law of Moses.

40.Take care that what the prophets have said does not happen to you:

41" 'Look, you scoffers, wonder and perish, for I am going to do something in your days that you would never believe, even if someone told you.'"

 

But one will say, "The scritpure says only through Christ is the forgiveness of sin."

 

The Spirit of Prophesy is the testimony of Jesus Christ and the sign to the believer. Christ is the author and finisher of our faith. He ordained all this. The man who denies this does not believe in Christ and neither can he be justified by faith. Neither are his sins forgiven.

 

 

 

The Rudometkinites will continue to dabble in "the spirit" that inspired what is written in the Spirit and Life book, as their sacred source of "spirituality", giving honor, glory and praise to Rudometkin as their beloved "king of spirits"....

 

and the Bible based Molokan Christians who are led by the Holy Spirit that was promised in the Scriptures, will remain steadfast in exalting the Lord Jesus Christ, by exposing the writings of Rudometkin in the Spirit and Life book as extra-Biblical heresy, which has deceived many, and continues to do so.

 

The scripture tells that the Spirit of Prophesy is a more sure Word which is like a lamp unto our feet.

 

19 And so we have the prophetic word confirmed, which you do well to heed as a light

19 And so we have the prophetic word confirmed,[a] which you do well to heed as a light that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts; 20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, 21 for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God[c] spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit.

that shines in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts;

20 knowing this first, that no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation,

21 for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit.

 

Or.... one can continue to dabble in the letter and be swallowed up it. To be servents of the anti christ and the killers of the prophets.

 

Remember this, that satan tempted Christ using scripture. And that Christ died according to the scripture, but was Resurrected by the Spirit.

 

The final anti christ is the most eloquent interpreter of the scripture. Able to decieve the most elect, again of course, by using scripture.

 

You underestimate the adversary. If he tempted Adam and Eve in the garden while God was walking with them and if he tried to tempt even Christ, there is nobody else that he won't try to decieve.

 

Even Christ said, "Man does not live by bread alone, but by EVERY word that proceeds from the mouth of God."

 

The mouth of God are His Prophets.

 

The bible based so called christian, Molokan or otherwise, will be swallowed by the final anti christ, because they did not believe the Holy Spirit, personified in His Prophets.

 

They will instead be, "left behind."

[sadichka 0]

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta`s "newest" revelation:

 

So all together we have Christ being the Cornerstone or Capstone, the Twelve Apostles being the Foundation Stones. The Pillar of the Church is the King of Spirits. The Twelve King Priests, which have not yet come, being the Twelve Gates by which one must enter into the Holy City. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #74)

 

Let us review everything fourvetta has stated thus far:

 

We know mgr claimed to be King of Spirits from his own memoirs (mgr 2:3:9; 3:0:1; 3:17:1; 3:25:2; 4:2:3; 4:2:4; 4:2:22; 4:5:12; 4:11:22; 4:11:28; 4:14:15; 6:9:6; 7:4:1; 8:2:2; 8:4:7; 8:27:6; 9:15:7; 9:15:9; 13:7:2; 13:12:6; mgr 255 plan; mgr 261 plan)....

 

1) fourvetta claims that the Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits, who is mgr....

 

2) fourvetta claims that the new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits, who is mgr....

 

3) mgr and fourvetta claim that the kingdom of God came in the 19th century....

 

4) fourvetta claims the Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits, who is mgr....

 

5) Maxim says, "I am the Gate of Zion and the entrance to the land of the living."

 

6) fourvetta claims that today, the King of Spirits is the Gate (one of the Twelve which have not yet come according to fourvetta's quote above) and the entrance unto the path of the land of the living. The thousand year kingdom of Christ on earth. No one can come to Christ but through him, mgr....

 

7) fourvetta claims the King of Spirits, mgr, who is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, is the Gate of Zion which leads to the Door, who is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, which in turn leads to the Father....

 

And,

 

fourvetta`s latest revelation:

 

1) Christ being the Cornerstone or Capstone

2) The twelve apostles being the Foundation Stones

3) The Pillar of the Church is the King of Spirits

4) The Twelve King Priests, which have not yet come, being the Twelve Gates (of which one is mgr according to himself and confirmed by fourvetta) by which one must enter into the Holy City.

 

Oh, and we mustn`t forget that according to mgr, he is also:

 

----the book of life

----the book of the sun

----the bounded enclosures

----the chief conqueror

----the commander of all the universe

----the entrustor of faithful souls

----the eternal heir of christ's kingdom on earth

----the forefather of all the new Israel

----the god of the believers

----the heir to the complete universe

----the husband clothed with a garment down to the foot

----the king and prophet for the thousand years

----the king of new Israel

----life eternal

----the lord's divine messenger

----the man-child of the woman clothed in the sun

----the memory of god almighty

----the new heir of the world

----the new present day Moses

----the only leader

----the residuary of the universe

----the seal of the living god

----the second Job

----the seven-leveled stairway to the heavens

----Solomon's new heir and successor

----the spirit and bride in the third face

----the symbol of restoration

----the third face

----the two-winged serene falcon

----the white horse

 

REMINDER: A person who desires to believe a lie receives its reward --- DECEPTION.

 

 

 

[fourvetta 0]

God is devious to those who are devious.

 

It also pleases God, that by the foolishness of the message preached, should save those who believe it.

 

The Second Coming of the Lord Jesus Christ shall be as the day of Noah and Lot.

 

Those who heard the message preached by them, were not saved because they did not recieve the message by faith.

 

Even though Noah preached for 100 years, they disregarded his message. The message that he preached was evident by the ark that he built in the middle of the desert. People could see it for miles around. They only laughed at him as he built the ark.

 

They did not laugh as they drowned.

 

Neither did the inhabitants of Sodom and Gomorah laugh when fire and brimestone consumed them.

[steadfast 0]

Notable Fourvetta quotes;

 

#66 A false teacher is easy to recognize. They despise God's authority and continually speak evil.

#25 The scriptures can now mean anything one wants it to.

#73 God is devious to those who are devious.

#73 Another instance of fornication sanctified by God.

#25 This is what I mean that one MUST come out of the book to be led by the Spirit.

#25 The letter kills, but it is the Spirit which gives life.

# 60 Ignorance of the Word of God is NOT an excuse.

#2 The soul is Adam and the flesh is Eve. They are no longer two, but one. And the Spirit, who is God walks between the two.

#5 From the time that God made up His mind¦..

#3 Jesus was being crucified on the cross, He also needed a Savior.

#52 The one who does not keep My Word is the one who hates Me. Such a person becomes a throne for the spirit of the abyss, the devil himself incarnate in the flesh.

 

Fourvetta, This is your brain on S&L.

[fourvetta 0]

Notable Fourvetta quotes;

 

#66 A false teacher is easy to recognize. They despise God's authority and continually speak evil.

#25 The scriptures can now mean anything one wants it to.

#73 God is devious to those who are devious.

#73 Another instance of fornication sanctified by God.

#25 This is what I mean that one MUST come out of the book to be led by the Spirit.

#25 The letter kills, but it is the Spirit which gives life.

# 60 Ignorance of the Word of God is NOT an excuse.

#2 The soul is Adam and the flesh is Eve. They are no longer two, but one. And the Spirit, who is God walks between the two.

#5 From the time that God made up His mind¦..

#3 Jesus was being crucified on the cross, He also needed a Savior.

#52 The one who does not keep My Word is the one who hates Me. Such a person becomes a throne for the spirit of the abyss, the devil himself incarnate in the flesh.

 

Fourvetta, This is your brain on S&L.

 

You forgot, "A sceptic cannot be saved by faith."

[steadfast 0]

The statements I posted demonstrate a double mindedness imposed by an unholy spirit. You contradict and/or expose with these statements.

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta,

 

And who made the following statement?

 

By faith it is impossible to be saved. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #29)

 

 

[fourvetta 0]

fourvetta,

 

And who made the following statement?

 

By faith it is impossible to be saved. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #29)

 

Opps. Typo. My mistake. I meant "without faith it is impossible to be saved".

 

Thanks for pointing that out.

[steadfast 0]

fourvetta,

 

And who made the following statement?

 

By faith it is impossible to be saved. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #29)

 

Opps. Typo. My mistake. I meant "without faith it is impossible to be saved".

Thanks for pointing that out.

MGR, Fourvetta's spiritual hero does teach salvation through works yet the Bible teaches salvation through faith, so fourvetta can play a safety here by claiming either, depending on the crowd, wind direction and tide. You never know which way Fourvetta's mop will flop.

 

Fourvetta, since you believe Salvation comes through faith then MGR's teaching of salvation through works could not be God inspired. What say you!

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta,

 

Do you believe you are JESUS?

 

 

[fourvetta 0]

The statements I posted demonstrate a double mindedness imposed by an unholy spirit. You contradict and/or expose with these statements.

 

What I say does not matter, but it is the New Covenant of Christ. His teachings and not mine.

 

15"If you love me, you will obey what I command.

16.And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever”

17.the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you.

 

23.Jesus replied, "If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.

24.He who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.

25"All this I have spoken while still with you.

26.But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

 

anonymous. To your comment in post #13.

 

Christ said in Luke 6

 

40.A student is not above his teacher, but everyone who is fully trained will be like his teacher.

 

45.The good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and the evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For out of the overflow of his heart his mouth speaks.

Edited August 27, 2006 by fourvetta

[steadfast 0]

What I say does not matter, but it is the New Covenant of Christ. His teachings and not mine.

Wrong again buck-o..... More un scriptural teachings from FV.

 

It's my understanding that you are NOT in agreement with these verses.

Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. 2 Cor 13:5 NIV

And God has given us the task of reconciling people to him. (2 Corinthains 5:17-18 NLT)

Take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God which he obtained with the blood of his own Son. (Acts 20.28 RSV)

Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt. NIV Lev 19:17

[anonymous 0]

 

In truth, it was Post #14, and you still didn't answer the question.

 

Do you believe you are THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

 

 

[fourvetta 0]

fourvetta,

 

And who made the following statement?

 

By faith it is impossible to be saved. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #29)

 

Opps. Typo. My mistake. I meant "without faith it is impossible to be saved".

Thanks for pointing that out.

MGR, Fourvetta's spiritual hero does teach salvation through works yet the Bible teaches salvation through faith, so fourvetta can play a safety here by claiming either, depending on the crowd, wind direction and tide. You never know which way Fourvetta's mop will flop.

 

Fourvetta, since you believe Salvation comes through faith then MGR's teaching of salvation through works could not be God inspired. What say you!

 

As you said, "Let us examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith.

 

You say that salvation of works in not Godly inspired. Do you believe that the Law that God gave to Moses was Godly inspired? Remember the first words , "I am the Lord your God that brought you out of Egypt."

 

There are two righteousness. Both are Godly inspired. One of works and one of faith.

 

Both the Old testament and the New testament are Godly inspired. If it was up to God then righteousness would be according to Law. But since He knew that no man could fulfill it then He made the promise that righteousness could be obtained by faith.

 

This is Apostle Paul's mission in a nutshell. He had to be as one under the law to understand that one cannot obtain righteousness by it.

 

God showed us His plan of salvation throughout the scripture. As in Cain and Abel, Ishmael and Isaac, Esau and Jacob.

 

So the one to whom the law speaks, it speaks to those who are under it.

 

Righteousness according to faith is the one who believes in the Gospel or message of Christ. And not only to that, but to the one to who believes in every Word that proceeds from the mouth of God.

 

So there are those who are righteous according to the law or the book, but one cannot be justified before God by it.

 

But the one who hears and believes is justified by faith before God.

 

From what I see, not many hear and believe the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ. How can one be justified before God by faith?

 

The one who has remained in the elementary docrines of Christ cannot be justified by faith before God. But his end is to be cursed.

 

Shame on you for calling the righteousness of God according to the law as demon inspired.

 

Hebrews 6

 

1.Therefore let us leave the elementary teachings about Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of faith in God,

2.instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment.

3.And God permitting, we will do so.

4.It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit,

5.who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age,

6.if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.

 

If they fall away in verse 6 means if they go back to the elementary doctrines. Basically he is making a mockery of Christ.

 

Christ said,

 

5."I am the vine; you are the branches. If a man remains in me and I in him, he will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing.

6.If anyone does not remain in me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned.

7.If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you.

8.This is to my Father's glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.

 

 

 

In truth, it was Post #14, and you still didn't answer the question.

 

Do you believe you are THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

 

THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF sat upon the white steed and is personified as the King of Spirits and God to the Faithfull. Read S&L page 286

 

Better said, as the second coming of the Word of God.

 

I am simply a student of the King of Spirits.

 

Christ also said, "If you continue in My Word you shall be My disciples."

 

The continuence of God's Word today is by the Spirit of Truth.

Edited August 27, 2006 by fourvetta

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta,

 

To dispel all ambiguity and erase any doubts anyone may have insofar as your belief regarding the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin --- he was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF. Is this correct? Is this what you truly believe? That maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

[fourvetta 0]

To dispel all ambiguity and erase any doubts anyone may have insofar as your belief regarding the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, he is THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF. Is this correct? Is this what you truly believe? That maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

 

You do believe in the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ do you? Christ Himself warns of the unbeliever, that they shall be as in the days of Noah and Lot. Not understanding until it was to late.

 

Matthew 24

 

37.As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38.For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark;

39.and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man.

 

Read book 4 article 11 verses 12 -23. Or book 8 article 15 verses 1- 3 How about book 11 article 16 or book 12 article 10.

 

Come on Steadfast. You did good in gathering the evidence.

 

What does it say?

 

To those who cannot hear the voice of the Lord, they are deaf like the serpent or like the jews of old, never to be led to the bossom of their master. Although the Lord loved every one of them for the sake of their fathers.

 

Never to grow in the knowledge of the Lord, up to the meassure of His stature.

 

Simply to be cut off the vine and wither away. One must remain on the vine to produce fruit.

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta,

 

You haven't answered the question.

 

Do you truly believe that the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

[fourvetta 0]

fourvetta,

 

You haven't answered the question.

 

Do you truly believe that the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

 

His first birth is of sinfull born after the flesh of his forefathers, but his second birth is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself from above. By his second birth He has become in the image of the heavenly man, after the manner of Jesus Christ.

 

We also must be born again from above. Also made in the image of the heavenly man Jesus Christ.

 

His angels also followed Him also upon white steeds.

 

Apostle Paul speaks of the resurrection or translation of the body and how it will occur. Have you not read in the scriptures?

 

46. However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual.

47. The first man was of the earth, made of dust; the second Man is the Lord from heaven.

48. As was the man of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as is the heavenly Man, so also are those who are heavenly.

49. And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly Man.

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta,

 

You still haven't answered the question.

 

Do you, fourvetta, truly believe that the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

 

Yes or no?

[fourvetta 0]

fourvetta,

 

You still haven't answered the question.

 

Do you, fourvetta, truly believe that the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

 

Yes or no?

 

Yes, I believe that Christ is personified in His Prophets. From the beginning of time to now. The Word of God made manifest in the flesh.

 

Hebrews 1 says this,

 

1 God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son,

 

Christ said,

 

40."He who receives you receives me, and he who receives me receives the one who sent me.

41.Anyone who receives a prophet because he is a prophet will receive a prophet's reward, and anyone who receives a righteous man because he is a righteous man will receive a righteous man's reward.

42.And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones because he is my disciple, I tell you the truth, he will certainly not lose his reward."

 

The Jews did not believe that Moses spoke with God or that Moses was the Word of God manifest in the flesh.

 

Neither did they believe that Jesus Christ spoke with God. Even going so far as to say that Christ blasphemed against God.

 

No difference today.

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta,

 

You are avoiding giving a simple, honest, truthful, as in full of truth, answer.

 

It was the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed the title King of Spirits (mgr 2:3:9; 3:0:1; 3:17:1; 3:25:2; 4:2:3; 4:2:4; 4:2:22; 4:5:12; 4:11:22; 4:11:28; 4:14:15; 6:9:6; 7:4:1; 8:2:2; 8:4:7; 8:27:6; 9:15:7; 9:15:9; 13:7:2; 13:12:6; mgr 255 plan; mgr 261 plan).

 

On September 4, 2004 you stated:

 

The Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits and God to the faithful. Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord. MGR Book 4 pov. 11: 12-24 (How Many Jumpers?, Post #6)

 

On September 11, 2004 you stated:

 

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (Fourvetta, Who Is Jesus Part II?, Post #5)

 

On January 22, 2006 you stated:

 

The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (What Is A Molokan?, Post #51)

 

On June 11, 2006 you stated:

 

So yes. The kingdom of God came to us in the 19th century......" (The Word of God, Post #3)

 

Now, in light of your above statements, do you, the person behind the code name fourvetta, believe what you stated, that the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF WHO came to the village of Nikitino in Russia in the 19th century?

 

Yes or no?

 

 

[coffee 0]

.

 

From fourvetta:

 

The Spirit of Prophesy is the testimony of Jesus Christ and the sign to the believer.

 

The scripture [referring to 2 Peter 1:19-21, from the Bible] tells that the Spirit of Prophesy is a more sure Word which is like a lamp unto our feet.

 

(fourvetta, Post # 4, Aug 19 2006, 03:45 PM)

 

 

This is another example of the Scripture twisting that is done by fourvetta and the Rudometkinites. In this instance, the most obvious discrepancy between what the Rudometkinites believe, versus the true Biblical text, is the transposition of the very definition that is given in this Scripture.

 

From the Bible:

 

And the angel said to me, "Write this: Blessed are those who are invited to the marriage supper of the Lamb." And he said to me, "These are the true words of God."

 

Then I fell down at his feet to worship him, but he said to me, "You must not do that! I am a fellow servant with you and your brothers who hold to the testimony of Jesus. Worship God." For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. (Revelation 19:9-10)

 

 

 

According to the Word that was spoken by God in this revelation to the Apostle John, who then transcribed it into written form, the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy, not the other way around.

 

In other words, the emphasis is on the testimony of the Lord Jesus Christ, not on the spirit of prophecy. This is verified in the preceding sentence, when the angel stated that he is a fellow servant together with John, and those who hold to the testimony of Jesus.

 

The emphasis is not on the "spirit of prophecy". Otherwise the angel would have told John that he is a fellow servant together with those who hold to "the spirit of prophecy".

 

From fourvetta:

 

The scripture [referring to 2 Peter 1:19-21, from the Bible] tells that the Spirit of Prophesy is a more sure Word which is like a lamp unto our feet.

 

According to the Biblical text of 2 Peter 1:19-21:

 

And we have something more sure, the prophetic word [of the Scriptures], to which you will do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts,

 

knowing this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture comes from someone's own interpretation.

 

For no prophecy [of Scripture] was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit. (2 Peter 1:19-21)

 

 

When the Apostle Peter mentioned the "prophetic word" in Verse 19 above, the context is the "prophetic" word of the Holy Scriptures, which is the testimony of the "prophecy of Scripture", as is stated in Verse 20.

 

To be more precise, the Apostle John is referring to the very written Word of God in the Bible, not about the activity of "day-stvi-yah" that is practiced by the Rudometkinites.

 

The Rudometkinite belief system teaches that what Rudometkin refers to in the Spirit and Life book as the "activity of the spirit", is supposedly the equivalent to the "spirit of prophecy" that is mentioned in the above referenced Scripture.

 

Among the Rudometkinites, the "day-stvi-yah" that is commonplace during their church services is considered to be the very "spirit of prophecy" that is mentioned in the above referenced Scripture, which fourvetta and the Rudometkinites continue to misquote.

 

Following their thought process then, the Rudometkinites teach that in addition to the manifestation of "jumping" that takes place, since the spiritual manifestation of "day-stvi-yah" also occurs during their church services, this serves as "verification" for them that they must then have "the testimony of Jesus".

 

The "testimony of Jesus" is Christ's own personal testimony about Himself as The Lord, as the Word of God Who became flesh, as God in the flesh, Who came down out of heaven to save the world from sin. This "testimony" has been preserved for all mankind, in the writings of the Holy Scriptures.

 

Those who are followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, who proclaim this Biblical truth, are the "prophets" of the Christian Church. This "testimony" is addressed in what the Apostle John wrote in the introduction to what we now refer to as the Book of Revelation, in the Scriptures:

 

The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place.

 

He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John,

 

who bore witness to the word of God and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, even to all that he saw. (Revelation 1:1-2)

 

 

I, John, your brother and partner in the tribulation and the kingdom and the patient endurance that are in Jesus, was on the island called Patmos on account of the word of God and the testimony of Jesus. (Revelation 1:9)

 

 

When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. (Revelation 6:9)

 

 

The issue at hand between those Molokans who are Bible based Christians, versus the Rudometkinites who are followers of the writings in the Spirit and Life book, has to do with the true context of what is written in the Bible, that the testimony of the Lord Jesus Christ is the Spirit of Prophecy.

 

The point being, that what is written in the Spirit and Life book is admittedly the testimony of Makcim Ghavrilovitch Rudometkin, and from the witness of those who are loyal Rudometkinites, the testimony of Rudometkin is ultimately all about Rudometkin, as fourvetta has been so kind to admit, and to illustrate for us.

 

A good example of this is that in the Book of Revelation, the angel that was sent by God to the Apostle John, would not allow the Apostle John to bow down and worship him.

 

Then I fell down at his feet to worship him, but he said to me, "You must not do that! I am a fellow servant with you and your brothers who hold to the testimony of Jesus. Worship God." For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. (Revelation 19:10)

 

 

The context here is that we are to worship God, and Him only.

 

Contrary to the above Biblical pattern, which demonstrates the behavior of those who hold to the testimony of Jesus, those who hold to the very spirit of prophecy, here is what Rudometkin required from his followers:

 

For the time has come to....[worship] give glory to God in heaven, and to me [Rudometkin] His anointed, Fetmaghel, the king and prophet of the new Russian people! (Spirit and Life book, Page 559, Book 12, Article 4, Verse 2)

 

 

According to what is described in the Bible, the testimony of Rudometkin is not the "spirit of prophecy". The testimony of Rudometkin is the spirit of deception, the spirit of delusion, which is prophesied about in the Scriptures:

 

The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders,

 

and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.

 

Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false,

 

in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (2 Thessalonians 2:9-12)

 

 

Who is the deceiver but the very one who twists the truth of the Scriptures out of context, to testify about someone in addition to, and other than, the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

What is the spirit of delusion except that which leads its followers to misquote what is written in the Bible, in order to lead others to follow the heresy of false teachings, which their own deceived ancestors took with them to their very graves.

 

From fourvetta:

 

I am simply a student of [Rudometkin, who is] the King of Spirits.

 

 

From the Bible:

 

For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. (Revelation 19:10)

 

.

[anonymous 0]

fourvetta:

 

THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF sat upon the white steed and is personified as the King of Spirits and God to the Faithfull. Read S&L page 286. (Deception, Post #18)

 

Personification: to be the embodiment or perfect example of.

 

So fourvetta believes THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF is the embodiment or perfect example of the King of Spirits, who is mgr.

 

The problem with this scenario is that it was the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed to be King of Spirits.

 

It was also the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed he was the white steed upon which THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF sits.

 

It was also the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed he was:

 

----the book of life

----the book of the sun

----the bounded enclosures

----the chief conqueror

----the commander of all the universe

----the entrustor of faithful souls

----the eternal heir of christ's kingdom on earth

----the forefather of all the new Israel

----the god of the believers

----the heir to the complete universe

----the husband clothed with a garment down to the foot

----the king and prophet for the thousand years

----the king of new Israel

----life eternal

----the lord's divine messenger

----the man-child of the woman clothed in the sun

----the memory of god almighty

----the new heir of the world

----the new present day Moses

----the only leader

----the residuary of the universe

----the seal of the living god

----the second Job

----the seven-leveled stairway to the heavens

----Solomon's new heir and successor

----the symbol of restoration

----the third face

----the two-winged serene falcon

 

It was also the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed he was:

 

---the true Spirit, descended from the heavens from God (mgr 1:30:1)

---1st Lord and King of the Spirit of truth (mgr 1:31:8)

---this Spirit who is in person God and the King of new Israel (mgr 8:15:2)

---this Spirit of truth named Gelgel Akhmet Ulia (mgr 8:22:7)

---this true Spirit personified as himself, the man, mgr (mgr 8:26:9)

---Akhmet Akhmetovitch, which is the Spirit of truth (mgr 8:29:3)

---the new Ulia (mgr 9:16:10)

---the Spirit and the bride in the 3rd feature (mgr 9:22:7)

---the spirit of truth named Gelgel Akhmet Ulia (mgr 10:17:7)

---the new Spirit Ulia (mgr 12:9:0)

 

 

 

[fourvetta 0]

fourvetta:

 

THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF sat upon the white steed and is personified as the King of Spirits and God to the Faithfull. Read S&L page 286. (Deception, Post #18)

 

Personification: to be the embodiment or perfect example of.

 

So fourvetta believes THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF is the embodiment or perfect example of the King of Spirits, who is mgr.

 

The problem with this scenario is that it was the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed to be King of Spirits.

 

It was also the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed he was the white steed upon which THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF sits.

 

It was also the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed he was:

 

----the book of life

----the book of the sun

----the bounded enclosures

----the chief conqueror

----the commander of all the universe

----the entrustor of faithful souls

----the eternal heir of christ's kingdom on earth

----the forefather of all the new Israel

----the god of the believers

----the heir to the complete universe

----the husband clothed with a garment down to the foot

----the king and prophet for the thousand years

----the king of new Israel

----life eternal

----the lord's divine messenger

----the man-child of the woman clothed in the sun

----the memory of god almighty

----the new heir of the world

----the new present day Moses

----the only leader

----the residuary of the universe

----the seal of the living god

----the second Job

----the seven-leveled stairway to the heavens

----Solomon's new heir and successor

----the symbol of restoration

----the third face

----the two-winged serene falcon

 

It was also the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed he was:

 

---the true Spirit, descended from the heavens from God (mgr 1:30:1)

---1st Lord and King of the Spirit of truth (mgr 1:31:8)

---this Spirit who is in person God and the King of new Israel (mgr 8:15:2)

---this Spirit of truth named Gelgel Akhmet Ulia (mgr 8:22:7)

---this true Spirit personified as himself, the man, mgr (mgr 8:26:9)

---Akhmet Akhmetovitch, which is the Spirit of truth (mgr 8:29:3)

---the new Ulia (mgr 9:16:10)

---the Spirit and the bride in the 3rd feature (mgr 9:22:7)

---the spirit of truth named Gelgel Akhmet Ulia (mgr 10:17:7)

---the new Spirit Ulia (mgr 12:9:0)

 

Amen to all the above.

 

Only those who at the same hour that they hear the Lord Jesus Christ knock on the door of their heart and OPEN it will be saved. Otherwise He moves on.

 

And the angel said to me, "Write this: Blessed are those who are invited to the marriage supper of the Lamb." And he said to me, "These are the true words of God."

 

If He comes at the second watch or the third and finds them diligent, He will sit them down and He will serve them. Blessed are those who are invited to the marriage supper of the Lamb of God who is Spirit.

 

The Lord is Spirit and He seeks those who worship Him in Spirit and in truth.

 

To be more precise, the Apostle John is referring to the very written Word of God in the Bible, not about the activity of "day-stvi-yah" that is practiced by the Rudometkinites.

 

The Rudometkinite belief system teaches that what Rudometkin refers to in the Spirit and Life book as the "activity of the spirit", is supposedly the equivalent to the "spirit of prophecy" that is mentioned in the above referenced Scripture.

 

Among the Rudometkinites, the "day-stvi-yah" that is commonplace during their church services is considered to be the very "spirit of prophecy" that is mentioned in the above referenced Scripture, which fourvetta and the Rudometkinites continue to misquote.

 

Following their thought process then, the Rudometkinites teach that in addition to the manifestation of "jumping" that takes place, since the spiritual manifestation of "day-stvi-yah" also occurs during their church services, this serves as "verification" for them that they must then have "the testimony of Jesus".

 

Sorry. There is a difference between Deystva and the Spirit of Prophesy. The molokan people now has deystvaniki and not prophets. The last prophet we had was a 12 year old boy.

 

Because someone wears a russian shirt and has a beard does not make him as you call them a Rudometkinite or a maximist.

 

I would call them, true worshipers of God in Spirit or the Third face of God on the earth. Also better said, as the camp of the saints of the thousand year millinium of Christ on the earth.

 

The Spirit of Prophesy which is called the Testimony of Jesus Christ is the Cornerstone, that the true church of God is built upon. Any other house is built on sand and will soon fall.

 

According to the Biblical text of 2 Peter 1:19-21:

 

And we have something more sure, the prophetic word [of the Scriptures], to which you will do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts,

 

knowing this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture comes from someone's own interpretation.

 

For no prophecy [of Scripture] was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit. (2 Peter 1:19-21)

 

Beautiful scripture!

 

More evidence of the King of Spirits. The one who with gladness follows the Spirit of Prophesy will soon arrive in Zion through the Gate for a thousand years.

 

Christ who is in charge of the Spirit of Prophesy, said of the principle victor,

 

28 and I will give him the morning star.

29 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches."`

 

Meaning as anonymous brought up that the King of Spirits is the inheritor of the new world, wherein dwells only righteousness. From one righteous man God will populate the whole earth.

 

For the perverts out there, I speak spiritually and not physically.

 

 

What Peter was talking about of something that was forbidden by Christ Himself until after His resurrection.

 

The "more sure word" Peter was talking about, is they heard the voice of God from heaven on the Mount of Transfiguration. They did not need confirmation.

 

1.After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves.

2.There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light.

3.Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus.

4.Peter said to Jesus, "Lord, it is good for us to be here. If you wish, I will put up three shelters”one for you, one for Moses and one for Elijah."

5.While he was still speaking, a bright cloud enveloped them, and a voice from the cloud said, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased. Listen to him!"

6.When the disciples heard this, they fell facedown to the ground, terrified. 7.But Jesus came and touched them. "Get up," he said. "Don't be afraid."

8.When they looked up, they saw no one except Jesus.

9.As they were coming down the mountain, Jesus instructed them, "Don't tell anyone what you have seen, until the Son of Man has been raised from the dead."

 

He who receives Christ personified as a Prophet will receive that Prophets reward. Which in this case is an immortal body which will eternally not die, and to live in God's paradice for a thousand years.

 

The rest have the Pope as their Prophet and false christ, to be led into Armageddon to battle against the Lamb, who is Spirit. To be thrown into the lake of fire with them.

 

Because they did not believe the Spirit of Prophesy which is the Testimony of Jesus Christ.

 

QUOTE(anonymous #### Aug 28 2006, 12:33 AM

The problem with this scenario is that it was the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed to be King of Spirits.

 

It was also the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed he was the white steed upon which THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF sits.

 

Have you not read the scriptures?

 

17 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes I will give some of the hidden manna to eat. And I will give him a white stone, and on the stone a new name written which no one knows except him who receives it."`

Edited August 29, 2006 by fourvetta

[steadfast 0]

fourvetta,

 

You are avoiding giving a simple, honest, truthful, as in full of truth, answer.

 

It was the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed the title King of Spirits (mgr 2:3:9; 3:0:1; 3:17:1; 3:25:2; 4:2:3; 4:2:4; 4:2:22; 4:5:12; 4:11:22; 4:11:28; 4:14:15; 6:9:6; 7:4:1; 8:2:2; 8:4:7; 8:27:6; 9:15:7; 9:15:9; 13:7:2; 13:12:6; mgr 255 plan; mgr 261 plan).

 

On September 4, 2004 you stated:

 

The Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits and God to the faithful. Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord. MGR Book 4 pov. 11: 12-24 (How Many Jumpers?, Post #6)

 

On September 11, 2004 you stated:

 

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (Fourvetta, Who Is Jesus Part II?, Post #5)

 

On January 22, 2006 you stated:

 

The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (What Is A Molokan?, Post #51)

 

On June 11, 2006 you stated:

 

So yes. The kingdom of God came to us in the 19th century......" (The Word of God, Post #3)

 

Now, in light of your above statements, do you, the person behind the code name fourvetta, believe what you stated, that the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, was THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF WHO came to the village of Nikitino in Russia in the 19th century?

 

Yes or no?

Fourvetta, In every Molokan church Jesus of Nazareth has been replaced by Jesus of Nikitino. This is affirmed by what is on our alter, it won't become a problem for the congregants at a later time will it?

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta,

 

You were asked the question:

 

Do you believe you are THE LORD JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF?

 

You responded with "I am simply a student of the King of Spirits."

 

Was the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, like you, simply a student of the King of Spirits?

 

 

 

[steadfast 0]

Fourvetta, The Bible was not written for Maxim`s New Israelites. Where is your contextual Biblical proof that it was?

[fourvetta 0]

Fourvetta, The Bible was not written for Maxim`s New Israelites. Where is your contextual Biblical proof that it was?

 

Christ said, "My kingdom is not of this earth."

 

New Israelites dwell in heaven with the Lord who is Spirit. Not in the earth where the devil and satan has been cast down to.

 

12.We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.

13.This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.

14.The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.

15.The spiritual man makes judgments about all things, but he himself is not subject to any man's judgment:

[steadfast 0]

Fourvetta, The Bible was not written for Maxim`s New Israelites. Where is your contextual Biblical proof that it was?

 

Christ said, "My kingdom is not of this earth."

 

New Israelites dwell in heaven with the Lord who is Spirit. Not in the earth where the devil and satan has been cast down to.

 

12.We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.

13.This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.

14.The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.

15.The spiritual man makes judgments about all things, but he himself is not subject to any man's judgment:

You have difficulty staying on subject. "New Israelites dwell in heaven with the Lord" Where is this in the Bible?.... I did find the exact opposite in Gal. 3.28 "You are all one in Christ Jesus". You were asked for contextual Biblical proof, the subject here is the new israelite, and that would include while in the flesh. You can pour on all the ketchup of scripture you want, but beneath your theology is still a pork chop. Pork is pork no matter what you put on it. I know Maxim talks it, but doesn't walk it, afterall MGR did lead you you say "Jesus needed a savior".

[Nick Shubin 0]

Fourvetta, would you please give chapter and verse when qouting pasages from scripture? It sure would help those of us of lessor knowledge follow along with you, thanks!

[seeking_truth_1 0]

Bringing It To The Top

[seeking_truth_1 0]

(bump)

[anonymous 0]

 

fourvetta is fond of quoting the following passage:

 

"Now when HE was asked by the Pharisees when THE KINGDOM OF GOD would come, HE answered them and said, ˜THE KINGDOM OF GOD does not come with observation; nor will they say, ˜See here!` or ˜See there!` For indeed, THE KINGDOM OF GOD is within you.`" (Luke 17:20-21)

 

Based on his assertions regarding his hero, however, it is evident fourvetta does not truly believe JESUS` words.

 

Why?

 

Because we know from his own memoirs that it was the physical, visible man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, who claimed the title king of spirits (mgr 2:3:9; 3:0:1; 3:17:1; 3:25:2; 4:2:3; 4:2:4; 4:2:22; 4:5:12; 4:11:22; 4:11:28; 4:14:15; 6:9:6; 7:4:1; 8:2:2; 8:4:7; 8:27:6; 9:15:7; 9:15:9; 13:7:2; 13:12:6; mgr 255 plan; mgr 261 plan) whom fourvetta believes and asserts is the Lord Jesus Christ`s new name, and the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the kingdom of God which came in the 19th century, per his quotes below.

 

The Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits and God to the faithful. Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord. MGR Book 4 pov. 11: 12-24 (How Many Jumpers?, Post #6)

 

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (Fourvetta, Who Is Jesus Part II?, Post #5)

 

The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (What Is A Molokan?, Post #51)

 

So yes. The kingdom of God came to us in the 19th century¦¦" (The Word of God, Post #3)

 

When fourvetta stated:

 

Today, the King of Spirits is the Gate and the entrance unto the path of the land of the living. The thousand year kingdom of Christ on earth. No one can come to Christ but through him. (Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #47)

 

---and was confronted with THE TRUTH.......JESUS.......THE DOOR/GATE, the deceived, confused fourvetta did what the deceived, confused fourvetta does when he is confronted with THE TRUTH.......JESUS, he compounded a fallacy by fabricating another one:

 

Christ said, "I am the Door. No one comes to the Father but through Me."

 

The King of Spirits is the Gate of Zion which leads to the Door, which in turn leads to the Father¦..(Spiritual Marriage Discussion, Post #50)

 

But it was fourvetta who stated that the king of spirits is:

 

The Lord Jesus Christ Himself comes with a new name, King of Spirits and God to the faithful. Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord. MGR Book 4 pov. 11: 12-24 (How Many Jumpers?, Post #6)

 

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (Fourvetta, Who Is Jesus Part II?, Post #5)

 

The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (What Is A Molokan?, Post #51)

 

So, why did the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, claim to be the king of spirits if the king of spirits, according to fourvetta, is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself?

 

ANSWER: Lies beget deception and deception begets confusion, and mgr and his "students" are prime examples.

 

THE LORD.......GOD.......WHO IS SPIRIT.......THE HOLY SPIRIT.......THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH.......is not the author of lies, deception, and confusion.

 

 

[fourvetta 0]

fourvetta is fond of quoting the following passage:

 

"Now when HE was asked by the Pharisees when THE KINGDOM OF GOD would come, HE answered them and said, ˜THE KINGDOM OF GOD does not come with observation; nor will they say, ˜See here!` or ˜See there!` For indeed, THE KINGDOM OF GOD is within you.`" (Luke 17:20-21)

 

Based on his assertions regarding his hero, however, it is evident fourvetta does not truly believe JESUS` words.

 

So, why did the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, claim to be the king of spirits if the king of spirits, according to fourvetta, is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself?

 

I have heard some people use that to describe their interpretation of the King of Spirits.

 

I however, do not hold that view.

 

If thats true that Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits, then Jesus Christ was imprisoned in the Suzdalski Monastery. MGR book 4 article: 28

 

Jesus Christ holds the title of King of Kings and Lord of Lords. Just as God the Father holds the title of God of Gods.

 

But the King of Spirits is the new name that Jesus Christ Himself gave to the principle victor over the seven headed beast who sits upon the harlot that rules the whole world in order to test those who dwell in the earth.

 

Jesus Christ Himself is the rider upon the White Steed personified as the King of Spirits. Riding at full gallop into the battlefield of Armageddon. The two edged sword proceeds from His Mouth which is the Spoken Words of God. The Word of God made manifest in man.

 

Not the literal teachings of the scriptures but the spiritual teachings of the Holy Spirit. By the letter of the scriptures all the prophets were killed, including Jesus Christ.

 

This is talking to those who know the scriptures in detail. Just as the scribes and Pharisees. The most eloquent anti-christ is the one who is taught by the book. The two horned lamb who came up out of the earth. The seventh from the eight.

 

Also called by Christ, "the False Teacher" that is among you.

 

Matvei S. Dalmatov was our first hero to expose the false teacher and was killed on the wheel because of it. MGR book 9 article 6

 

This, by supposed christians.

 

Christ said, "The days are coming, when those who kill you think they do God's service." The two witnesses also will die by the letter of the law.

 

The false teacher compels every one under the decree of death to worship the beast.

 

By the beatings of slanderous words.

 

Under the banner of the king of Spirits we have protection from the Lord. The wings of the Spirit is our covering. The Lord is Spirit and upon whom the Spirit of the Lord is upon, there is freedom to those who believe in him.

 

Our place of refuge is called Surmagdan, given by the King of Spirits and only to those who believe in him. MGR book 2 articles 19 & 20

 

17 Because you say, ˜I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing`”and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked”

18 I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see.

19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent.

 

One must repent in order to be baptized into the name of the King of Spirits. All those who believe and are baptized will be saved.

[coffee 0]

.

 

So then, according to fourvetta, the Rudometkinites believe that their beloved hero, mgr, is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, who has come to earth a second time, but this time with His "new name", which is supposedly "king of spirits"....

 

and that Rudometkin, as Christ with His new name of king of spirits, is the alleged Gate of Zion....

 

which leads to the Door....

 

who is identified in the Scriptures as the Lord Jesus Christ....

 

which in turn leads to God the Father....

 

and that Rudometkin coronated himself to be "king" over the Kingdom of God, which supposedly came to earth during the 1800s....

 

and that Rudometkin is the Gate through which one MUST enter, before access to Christ's kingdom is allowed.

 

 

 

Amen. Now that I presented this to you and you fully comprehend it, now do you believe it?

 

 

In order to understand completely that which fourvetta has agreed to above, fourvetta has gone on record as stating that he believes the following:

 

1) Rudometkin is the physical person of the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, Who has already come back to earth a second time, in the physical body of Rudometkin.

 

2) As the physical person of the Lord Jesus Christ Who has come back to earth a second time, Rudometkin's new name, which is really Christ's new name, since Rudometkin and Jesus are now the same person, is the "King of Spirits".

 

3) As the physical person of the Lord Jesus Christ Who has come back to earth a second time, with His new name of "King of Spirits", this Rudometkin / Jesus person is the "gate" through which one must enter before one enters "The Door".

 

4) The Door is identified in the Scriptures to describe the Lord Jesus Christ, while Christ walked the earth, before He was crucified and before He was resurrected into heaven, as "The Way" to God the Father.

 

5) In order to enter Jesus Christ The Door, one must enter through "The Gate", who is this Rudometkin / Jesus person, with his "new name" of "King of Spirits" .

 

 

And to all of this, fourvetta says, "Amen", and then taunts the Bible-based Christians with his arrogant words:

 

Now that I presented this to you and you fully comprehend it, now do you believe it?

 

 

Now all of a sudden, fourvetta makes an apparent "about face" as he tells Anonymous:

 

I have heard some people use that to describe their interpretation of the King of Spirits.

 

I however, do not hold that view.

 

 

Just as Rudometkin himself was so confused and deceived about what he wrote to his followers, we see that same deception is evident and manifest among the Rudometkinites of today.

 

And as Rudometkin's "new spirit" continues to reveal more to fourvetta and the other Rudometkinites, if the past is any indication of the future, we will continue to see more examples of how confused Rudometkin's New Israel Jumpers and Leapers truly are, all because they have chosen to follow Rudometkin's "new spirit" and the writings in the Spirit and Life book, instead of listening to and following the "OLD" Holy Spirit, Who leads believers to the "REAL" Jesus, Who has revealed Himself in the Holy Scriptures.

 

.

[fourvetta 0]

Just as Rudometkin himself was so confused and deceived about what he wrote to his followers, we see that same deception is evident and manifest among the Rudometkinites of today.

 

 

 

Much like the misunderstanding and confusion that brought forth the ecumenical councils. When Christ said, "If you have seen Me, you have seen the Father." And Christ being the physical form of the Father on earth. The half God and half man theory of not understanding the nature of God who is invisible.

 

But what Christ was referring to was His Oneness with the Father. Being equal to Him in Spirit. Having the Name of the Father upon Himself. Referring to the Word Of God, also known as the Name of the Father.

 

6"I have manifested your name to the people whom you gave me out of the world. Yours they were, and you gave them to me, and they have kept your word.

7 Now they know that everything that you have given me is from you.

8 For I have given them the words that you gave me, and they have received them and have come to know in truth that I came from you; Holy Father, keep them in your name, which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are one.

12 While I was with them, I kept them in your name, which you have given me.

 

Now we know that no man has seen the Father except for the Son. And to whom the Son will reveal Him.

 

The believer is also One with the Father and the Son in John 17: 8.

 

45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.

65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

 

No man can come unto the King of Spirits unless it is given to Him by the Father and the Son. If one has seen the King of Spirits, He has seen the Father and the Son, also being One with Them. MGR book 12 article 10

 

His Name shall be called, "The Word of God." Revelation 19: 13

 

Or receive another Spirit.

 

Christ said, "I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive."

 

Namely Abaddon.

Edited January 7, 2007 by fourvetta

[coffee 0]

.

 

As was Rudometkin confused by his "new spirit", which ultimately led him to follow his "new pathway" to God, so is fourvetta equally confused, as are the rest of the Rudometkinites.

 

From fourvetta:

 

Much like the misunderstanding and confusion that brought forth the ecumenical councils. When Christ said, "If you have seen Me, you have seen the Father." And Christ being the physical form of the Father on earth. The half God and half man theory of not understanding the nature of God who is invisible.

 

In this case, the only individuals who are confused about any so-called "half God and half man" theory are those like fourvetta, who follow the "inspiration" of Rudometkin's un-Biblical "new spirit", and the "spiritual revelations" of Rudometkin's extra-Biblical "new pathway" to God.

 

From the days of the first century Christian church, the believers who stand on the foundation of the truth, those who are the followers of the Lord Jesus Christ according to that which is recorded in the Holy Scriptures, have long known the truth, that Jesus Christ is fully God, therefore "ONE" with God the Father, and fully man.

 

Following the same pattern as his hero Rudometkin, who never gave answer, or was ever held accountable for the many contradictions and discrepancies in his writings, fourvetta likewise ignores the fact that he has contradicted himself in a major way, embarrassing himself in the process, about what he actually believes, as it pertains to Rudometkin being the alleged fulfillment of the "second coming" of the Lord Jesus Christ, supposedly with Christ's "new name", the so-called title of "King of Spirits".

 

Regarding fourvetta's statement:

 

The believer is also One with the Father and the Son in John 17: 8.

 

Just like with Danny *****************'s so-called "Scriptural cross references" that he has inserted at the bottom of his English translations, so it is with the so-called "Biblical references" that fourvetta sometimes gives, whenever he supposedly "quotes" from the Scriptures.

 

In either case, it is good to follow through and actually "read" these so-called "references", because ultimately, it exposes just how common it is for the Rudometkinites to twist out of context the written Word of God, as it is recorded in the Bible, in order to promote Rudometkin's heresies that are written in the Spirit and Life book.

 

The words of the Lord Jesus Christ, as referenced by fourvetta above:

 

For I have given them the words that you gave me, and they have received them and have come to know in truth that I came from you; and they have believed that you sent me. (John 17:8)

 

 

THINK about this:

 

The Lord Jesus Christ, the ONE Who, according to what is written in the Scriptures, in Colossians 1:15-23, is the Creator of all that exists, Who, according to what is written in Job 26:7, created everything that exists out of nothing, came to earth in the form of a man, to give Himself as a sacrifice, in order to take away all the sins of mankind.

 

And now, Rudometkin and His followers would have us believe that after all that Christ went through, willingly giving Himself to be beaten to a pulp and then die a cruel and painful death, in order to provide salvation and eternal life to the very creation that He created in His own image, and who He loves so much that He literally came down from heaven to die for....

 

Jesus is going to then turn over His Kingdom to some arrogant and Biblically illiterate pedophile who was so confused in his deception that one day he thought he was Admeyil the man, and the next day he thought that he was Admeyil the spirit....

 

....who one day thought he was God in the flesh, the next day he thought that he was the person of Jesus Christ, and the next day he believed that he was the physical incarnation of the Spirit of Truth?

 

The Lord Jesus Christ is unique in that He is the ONLY one-of-a-kind incarnation, Who is God in the flesh, truly God and truly man. When Jesus ascended into heaven, following is the eyewitness account according to what is recorded in the Bible:

 

And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight.

 

And while they were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes,

 

and said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven."

 

(Acts 1:9-11)

 

 

In other words, the Lord Jesus Christ, Himself, will return in His same glorified body which He ascended into heaven with, and because He is God in the flesh, when He returns, He does not need any "help" to rule His Kingdom.

 

 

Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him. Even so. Amen. (Revelation 1:7)

 

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.

 

(Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven.

 

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

 

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

 

in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.

 

(1 Corinthians 15:49-52)

 

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

 

Needless to say, the last trumpet has not yet sounded, and the Lord Jesus Christ has not yet returned, because that "time" has not yet come. Therefore, the "white steed" is still in heaven, waiting until the moment when God the Father decides that it is time for the glorious return to earth of the Lamb of God, the Lord our Savior, Who is our only Master, our only King.

 

.

[fourvetta 0]

The Lord Jesus Christ is unique in that He is the ONLY one-of-a-kind incarnation, Who is God in the flesh, truly God and truly man. When Jesus ascended into heaven, following is the eyewitness account according to what is recorded in the Bible:

 

And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight.

 

And while they were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes,

 

and said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven."

 

(Acts 1:9-11)

 

 

In other words, the Lord Jesus Christ, Himself, will return in His same glorified body which He ascended into heaven with, and because He is God in the flesh, when He returns, He does not need any "help" to rule His Kingdom.

 

 

Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him. Even so. Amen. (Revelation 1:7)

 

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.

 

(Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven.

 

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

 

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

 

in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.

 

(1 Corinthians 15:49-52)

 

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

 

Needless to say, the last trumpet has not yet sounded, and the Lord Jesus Christ has not yet returned, because that "time" has not yet come. Therefore, the "white steed" is still in heaven, waiting until the moment when God the Father decides that it is time for the glorious return to earth of the Lamb of God, the Lord our Savior, Who is our only Master, our only King.

 

.

 

The emphasis of Jesus Christ coming down in the same manner that He was taken up, is that He will return on the Cloud. Which is the gathering of the saints, also known as New Israel.

 

The same Glorified body that He had we will also have. Without sin and in the same flesh that we have today. We are the flesh and the body of Christ, His glorified Body. If any man says that Christ did not come in the flesh, the same is a anti-christ.

 

God said in the beginning, "Let US make man in OUR image and OUR likeness."

 

The image of God is not a sinful man, nor is it a man with a beard and a russian shirt.

 

The light and the way to the father?

 

5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge,

6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness,

7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love.

8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.

10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble;

11 for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

 

Notice Love is the last one obtained. Where love is there is God also. One must first begin with faith. But in order for there to be a true faith in God, there must first be a true God. God is Spirit.

 

4 Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.

5 It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs.

6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.

7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

8 Love never fails.

 

The very image of God the Father and His Son Jesus Christ.

 

We know that we shall be just like Them.

 

As the scripture says, "Behold the Tabernacle of God is with men."

[coffee 0]

.

 

I think this discussion is getting away from what Anonymous intended in this thread, to illustrate and to demonstrate, based on the deception under which they exist, how confused fourvetta and the other Rudometkinites are about what they think they believe.

 

Sorry Anonymous if my interjections have contributed to this thread going in a different direction.

 

Basically, to review once again, I believe Anonymous wanted to point out the extreme of how confused fourvetta is about what he believes, in that he begins with his adamant affirmation that Rudometkin is the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, who is the so-called fulfillment of Christ's second coming, and that with His second coming, which supposedly took place sometime during the 1800s, in the person of Rudometkin, Jesus came with His alleged "new name", the title which Rudometkin's followers jump extra enthusiastically to, whenever they worship Rudometkin as their hero, as their "King of Spirits".

 

Then, after Anonymous demonstrated for the readers just how confused fourvetta is, fourvetta takes off in another direction, without giving accountability for any of his previous statements, and with typical arrogant Rudometkinite aplomb, he lies outright and denies that which he has previously stated.

 

That was my purpose for Post # 39, to illustrate fourvetta's dishonesty, as well as to highlight the deception under which he exists.

 

As long as fourvetta continues to cooperate in the future, there should be plenty of opportunity to unpack the rest of fourvetta's confusion, deception and lack of Scriptural understanding, in other threads.

 

For the time being, this is another great example of the lengths that Rudometkinites will go to, as they attempt to defend and protect the heresy which is written in the Spirit and Life book, and just like Danny ***************** before him, rather than admit the truth, it is an example of how fourvetta would rather lie, and then attempt to divert attention away from that which is already obvious to everyone else anyway.

 

.

[anonymous 0]

 

No man can come unto the King of Spirits unless it is given to Him by the Father and the Son. If one has seen the King of Spirits, He has seen the Father and the Son, also being One with Them. MGR book 12 article 10

Why would a believer and follower of THE LORD.......GOD HIMSELF "come unto" a counterfeit, a fraud, an imposter when a believer and follower of THE LORD.......GOD HIMSELF has already "come unto" THE WAY, THE TRUTH, AND THE LIFE.......GOD HIMSELF?

 

Once again, another misquote from THE HOLY SCRIPTURES by the "misinterpreter" of GOD`S WORD(S)/THE HOLY SCRIPTURES:

 

His Name shall be called, "The Word of God." Revelation 19: 13

It is written in THE HOLY SCRIPTURES:

 

"HE was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and HIS NAME is called THE WORD OF GOD." (Revelation 19:13)

 

Not "His Name shall be called" in the future tense as fourvetta states in his attempt to relate this passage to his beloved heretical hero, mgr.

 

The text reads: "HIS NAME is (present tense) called THE WORD OF GOD."

 

And WHO IS THE WORD OF GOD?

 

It is written in THE HOLY SCRIPTURES:

 

"In the beginning was THE WORD, and THE WORD was with GOD, and THE WORD WAS GOD. HE was in the beginning with GOD. All things were made through HIM, and without HIM nothing was made that was made. In HIM was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

 

There was a man sent from GOD, whose name was John. This man came for a witness, to bear witness of THE LIGHT, that all through him might believe. He was not THAT LIGHT, but was sent to bear witness of THAT LIGHT.

 

THAT was THE TRUE LIGHT which gives light to every man coming into the world. HE was in the world, and the world was made through HIM, and the world did not know HIM. HE came to HIS own and HIS own did not receive HIM.

 

But as many as received HIM, to them HE gave the right to become children of GOD, to those who believe in HIS NAME: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of GOD.

 

And THE WORD became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld HIS glory, the glory as of the only begotten of THE FATHER, full of grace and truth.

 

John bore witness of HIM and cried out saying, ˜This was HE of WHOM I said, ˜HE WHO comes after me is preferring before me, for HE was before me.`

 

And of HIS fullness we have all received, and grace for grace. For the law as given through Moses, but grace and truth came through JESUS CHRIST." (John 1:1-17)

 

From the book of Revelation:

 

"Now I saw Heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And HE WHO sat on him was called FAITHFUL AND TRUE, and in righteousness HE judges and makes war. HIS eyes were like a flame of fire, and on HIS head were many crowns. HE had a name written that no one knew except HIMSELF. HE was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and HIS NAME is called THE WORD OF GOD. And the armies in Heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed HIM on white horses. Now out of HIS mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it HE should strike the nations. And HE HIMSELF treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of ALMIGHTY GOD. And HE has on HIS robe and on HIS thigh a name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS." (Revelation 19:11-16)

 

Again, WHO IS THE WORD OF GOD?

 

It is written in THE HOLY SCRIPTURES:

 

"In the beginning was THE WORD, and THE WORD was with GOD, and THE WORD WAS GOD. HE was in the beginning with GOD. All things were made through HIM, and without HIM nothing was made that was made. In HIM was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

 

There was a man sent from GOD, whose name was John. This man came for a witness, to bear witness of THE LIGHT, that all through him might believe. He was not THAT LIGHT, but was sent to bear witness of THAT LIGHT.

 

THAT was THE TRUE LIGHT which gives light to every man coming into the world. HE was in the world, and the world was made through HIM, and the world did not know HIM. HE came to HIS own and HIS own did not receive HIM.

 

But as many as received HIM, to them HE gave the right to become children of GOD, to those who believe in HIS NAME: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of GOD.

 

And THE WORD became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld HIS glory, the glory as of the only begotten of THE FATHER, full of grace and truth.

 

John bore witness of HIM and cried out saying, ˜This was HE of WHOM I said, ˜HE WHO comes after me is preferring before me, for HE was before me.`

 

And of HIS fullness we have all received, and grace for grace. For the law as given through Moses, but grace and truth came through JESUS CHRIST." (John 1:1-17)

 

Revelation 19:13 is speaking of.......JESUS.......THE WORD OF GOD WHO IS GOD.

 

This is as plain as the nose on fourvetta`s face yet he refuses to accept and come unto THE TRUTH.......JESUS.

 

Or receive another Spirit.

mgr and his followers have --- received "another" spirit --- a "lying" spirit, a spirit of "deception," a spirit of "falsivity."

 

Christ said, "I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive."

As demonstrated by fourvetta's own confessions, mgr`s faithful ones have not received JESUS nor HIS FATHER; they have received one who came in his own name(s):

 

admeil

akhmet akhmetovich

akhmet gelgel enfail savakhan youlia

[in the flesh] admeil-ekhvi

[in the spirit] alpheil

angel of the flesh

book of life

book of the sun

bounded enclosures

chief conqueror

commander of all the universe

enfail [god of strength]

entrustor of faithful souls

eternal heir of christ's kingdom on earth

fail

felheila

fetmagel youliasaara tsar yures

forefather of all the new Israel

fulfiller of the will of the one who sent me for the thousand years

gateway to Zion

god of the believers

halveect roosameldan

heir to the complete universe

hosanna narahftan

husband clothed with a garment down to the foot

king and prophet

king and prophet for the thousand years

king of new Israel

king of spirits

king yures

life eternal

lord's divine messenger

man-child of the woman clothed in the sun

memory of god almighty

new heir of the world

new Israelite leader

new Judean Messiah

new Moses

new spirit youlia

new youlia(saar)

only leader

palmed pillar

present day Moses

residuary of the universe

savakhan [king of promise]

seal of the living god

second Job

seven-levelled stairway to the heavens

Solomons's new heir and successor

spirit and bride in the third face

symbol of restoration

third face

two-winged serene falcon

way of entrance to the village of the living

white horse

youliasaara akhmeta youlia

youlia-yar [prince of the father's world in the approaching age]

 

---aka the deceived, confused man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin.

 

 

[fourvetta 0]

Not "His Name shall be called¦

 

"¦HIS NAME is called THE WORD OF GOD."

 

And WHO IS THE WORD OF GOD?

 

It is written in THE HOLY SCRIPTURES:

 

"In the beginning was THE WORD, and THE WORD was with GOD, and THE WORD WAS GOD. HE was in the beginning with GOD. All things were made through HIM, and without HIM nothing was made that was made. In HIM was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

 

 

So you are acknowledging that the second coming is IN the present tense?

 

Or would you say that the second coming is not yet here? In other the words the Word of God IS not yet present?

 

You are waiting for the Word of God to come again, are you not?

 

The Spoken Word was before the Written Word. As John says, "He who comes after Me is greater then Me, for He was before Me."

 

The Spoken Word is the light unto men, as John also says, "I was not that light."

 

Never the less, the water must come before the blood.

 

34 Yet I do not receive testimony from man, but I say these things that you may be saved.

35 He was the burning and shining lamp, and you were willing for a time to rejoice in his light.

 

So for a time we were willing to rejoice in the light of the written Word. But not willing to leave the books to come to the True Light of the Word of God made flesh.

 

Christ continues;

 

38 But you do not have His word abiding in you, because whom He sent, Him you do not believe.

39 You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me.

40 But you are not willing to come to Me that you may have life.

 

For Paul is clear in Hebrews 9 that the Word of God appears a second time apart from sin.

 

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.

 

One MUST be born again a second time in the Word of God and in Spirit in order to enter the thousand year kingdom of Christ on earth.

 

As the Lord Himself from above, the Word of God made manifest in man.

 

The written Word is for the natural man, as in everyone who was ever born. Until the fullness of time comes for the heir to take his place.

 

To all those to whom God gave His Word, He called them His Sons. The Son abides in the Fathers house forever.

 

But the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

 

To the unbeliever, even God Himself is a deceiver. If the message of the Gospel is hid, it is hidden to those who are perishing.

Edited January 8, 2007 by fourvetta

[coffee 0]

.

 

I think this thread should be more accurately titled "Deceived and Confused".

 

In this case, I actually feel sorry for fourvetta, that he does not seem to be able to "comprehend" the subject matter that is being discussed.

 

So you are acknowledging that the second coming is IN the present tense?

 

Or would you say that the second coming is not yet here? In other the words the Word of God IS not yet present?

 

You are waiting for the Word of God to come again, are you not?

 

It is pretty clear that Anonymous is using the Scriptures to identify the "Word of God". According to what is recorded in the Bible, in language that is most "precise, the Word of God IS God.

 

"In the beginning was THE WORD, and THE WORD was with GOD, and THE WORD WAS GOD. HE was in the beginning with GOD. All things were made through HIM, and without HIM nothing was made that was made. In HIM was life, and the life was the light of men. And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.

 

And THE WORD became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld HIS glory, the glory as of the only begotten of THE FATHER, full of grace and truth." (John 1:1-17)

 

 

Anonymous was even thoughtful enough to highlight the pronouns the are used to refer to the Word of God as a specific "person". In the Biblical passage from John, I counted no less than 7 instances of the pronoun "HIM", no less than 3 instances of the pronoun "HIS" and no less than 7 instances of the pronoun "HE", all stated in reference to the specific "person" of the very "Word of God".

 

In the Scriptural passage from Revelation 19:13, Anonymous highlights the truth that the name by which the Lord Jesus Christ IS known IS the Word of God. No other person in heaven or earth has the name of "the Word of God". No other person, whether in heaven or on earth, "shall be called" the name that is His and His alone, ever. That name is the WORD OF GOD.

 

Anonymous also pointed out the Scripture that is recorded in the Biblical passage in Revelation 19:16, which proclaims the truth that the WORD OF GOD also has the name of KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS. According to what is recorded in the Holy Scriptures, which is the written Word of God, the only ONE who has that name, the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords, is God Himself.

 

It is indeed sad that fourvetta does not comprehend the relatively simple explanation that Anonymous gave, in a presentation that was extremely elementary and easy to understand.

 

Or would you say that the second coming is not yet here? In other the words the Word of God IS not yet present?

 

You are waiting for the Word of God to come again, are you not?

 

Well, the Apostle John wrote to those who were in the early Church, to those who were the first century followers of the Lord Jesus Christ:

 

....what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is.

 

 

 

From the Bible:

 

And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight.

 

And while they were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes,

 

and said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven."

 

(Acts 1:9-11)

 

 

In other words, the Lord Jesus Christ, Himself, will return in His same glorified body which He ascended into heaven with, and because He is God in the flesh, He does not need any "help" to rule His Kingdom once He has returned to earth.

 

 

Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him. Even so. Amen. (Revelation 1:7)

 

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.

 

(Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven.

 

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

 

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

 

in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.

 

(1 Corinthians 15:49-52)

 

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

 

According to these passages from the Scripture, the "change" that will take place, in the twinkling of an eye, will take place "at the last trumpet", not during the 1800s, and not during the 1900s. This "change", which is going to take place when the Lord Jesus Christ returns, is going to involve HIM, Jesus in His glorified body, actually "transforming" our bodies to be exactly like his own glorified body, so that we will at that time bear the image of HIM, the man of heaven.

 

The only reason that HE can be called "the man of heaven" is that HE, the Word of God Who IS God, became flesh, when HE was begotten to become the human being Who is known as Jesus of Nazareth, the Lord Jesus Christ, who is a man. And, as it is recorded in the Scriptures, from heaven, we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, Who is going to return to earth in the same way as those who saw HIM ascend into heaven, at which time every eye will see him in majestic glory, as the KING, The ONE Who will reign over His Kingdom.

 

Needless to say, the last trumpet has not yet sounded, and the Lord Jesus Christ has not yet returned. Therefore, Rudometkin was both deceived and confused. The "white steed" is still in heaven, apparently still in his celestial stable.

 

.

[fourvetta 0]

The name by which the Lord Jesus Christ IS known IS the Word of God. No other person in heaven or earth has the name of "the Word of God". No other person, whether in heaven or on earth, "shall be called" the name that is His and His alone, ever. That name is the WORD OF GOD.

 

Anonymous also pointed out the Scripture that is recorded in the Biblical passage in Revelation 19:16, which proclaims the truth that the WORD OF GOD also has the name of KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS. According to what is recorded in the Holy Scriptures, which is the written Word of God, the only ONE who has that name, the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords, is God Himself.

 

 

....what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is.

 

 

 

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.

 

(Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven.

 

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

 

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

 

in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.

 

(1 Corinthians 15:49-52)

 

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

 

According to these passages from the Scripture, the "change" that will take place, in the twinkling of an eye, will take place "at the last trumpet", not during the 1800s, and not during the 1900s. This "change", which is going to take place when the Lord Jesus Christ returns, is going to involve HIM, Jesus in His glorified body, actually "transforming" our bodies to be exactly like his own glorified body, so that we will at that time bear the image of HIM, the man of heaven.

 

The only reason that HE can be called "the man of heaven" is that HE, the Word of God Who IS God, became flesh, when HE was begotten to become the human being Who is known as Jesus of Nazareth, the Lord Jesus Christ, who is a man. And, as it is recorded in the Scriptures, from heaven, we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, Who is going to return to earth in the same way as those who saw HIM ascend into heaven, at which time every eye will see him in majestic glory, as the KING, The ONE Who will reign over His Kingdom.

 

You acknowledge that we will have the same glorified body as Christ.

 

That is my point. The believer will also be the Word of God manifested.

 

Peter says,

 

23 For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

24 For, "All men are like grass, and all their glory is like the flowers of the field;

the grass withers and the flowers fall,

25 but the word of the Lord stands forever."And this is the word that was preached to you.

 

And again;

 

10 Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you,

11 searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow.

12 To them it was revealed that, not to themselves, but to us they were ministering the things which now have been reported to you through those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven”things which angels desire to look into.

[coffee 0]

.

 

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithfull.

 

But you, say that Lord God cannot be made Manifest in the flesh.

 

Which is contrary to the scripture, "The Word of God shall be made manifest in man."

 

Then you never understood the message of the Gospel. (Forvetta, Who is Jesus Part II)

 

This is the very "starting point" from which fourvetta and the Rudometkinites have established what they believe about the very "Word of God". This foundation is based on an alleged "Scripture" which does not exist anywhere in the Bible. Not only are these words not found in the Scriptures, there is nothing recorded that would even suggest, imply or give birth to the "concept" or "idea" for such a theory.

 

In other words, the theory that fourvetta and the Rudometkinites continue to "quote", with regard to their hypothesis that the Word of God "shall be made manifest in man", is based on a lie. And from this un-Biblical and extra-Biblical "beginning", fourvetta has demonstrated how the Rudometkinites have taken this very concept and theory, which is nowhere to be found in the Scriptures, and continue to include it as an integral part of the foundation for their extra-Biblical belief system.

 

Again, the theory that it was the intention of God the Father, from the very beginning, for the Word of God to somehow be "made manifest in man", at some point in time, be it in the Old Testament Prophets of God, in the Apostles of the Lord Jesus Christ, in "true believers", or in Jesus Christ Himself, is not a Biblical concept.

 

Although fourvetta has obvious difficulty comprehending the distinctions of what is written in the Bible, Anonymous has made the point with most undeniable clarity, that contrary to fourvetta's yet-to-be-located alleged "Scripture", the Word of God WAS NOT "made manifest" in the flesh, whether in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, or any other human being for that matter. Rather, it is recorded in the Scriptures that the Word of God BECAME flesh, and that "flesh" is the physical human being body of the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

This is the same "spoken" Word of God Who was with God the Father, and was God, in the beginning, from eternity, Who subsequently spoke, literally "breathed out", the words that were eventually written down to become known as the "written" Word of God, Who then "became" flesh, the actual human being body of the Lord Jesus Christ, Who is described in the Scriptures as the One Who is Faithful and True, and His name is called The Word of God, Who is also known as The King of Kings and The Lord of Lords, in other words, GOD.

 

From fourvetta:

 

You acknowledge that we will have the same glorified body as Christ.

 

That is my point. The believer will also be the Word of God manifested.

 

When the Lord returns to earth in His glorified body, it is written in the Bible that He will "transform" the bodies of His followers to be like His glorified body. The distinction is that Jesus will not first make us into "the Word of God", before our bodies are transformed.

 

It is written in the Scriptures that "we will be changed", so that we will "bear the image" of the man of heaven. The distinction is that we will not "become" the man of heaven once this happens, but we will only look like Him, to have the same kind of glorified body that He now has, which is the same body with which He ascended into heaven, which is the same body with which He will return to earth.

 

It is written that when Jesus appears from heaven, coming down in the same way that He ascended into heaven, when every eye will see Him, we shall be "like" Him. In other words, we will not "become" the Lord Jesus Christ, Who is the Word of God Who became flesh. Our glorified bodies will only "resemble" His glorified body.

 

The Lord Jesus Christ is unique in that He is the ONLY one-of-a-kind incarnation, Who is God in the flesh, truly God and truly man. Just as there is only ONE Word of God, there is no other human besides the Lord Jesus Christ who can ever be "the Word of God in the flesh".

 

.

[fourvetta 0]

When the Lord returns to earth in His glorified body, it is written in the Bible that He will "transform" the bodies of His followers to be like His glorified body. The distinction is that Jesus will not first make us into "the Word of God", before our bodies are transformed.

 

It is written in the Scriptures that "we will be changed", so that we will "bear the image" of the man of heaven. The distinction is that we will not "become" the man of heaven once this happens, but we will only look like Him, to have the same kind of glorified body that He now has, which is the same body with which He ascended into heaven, which is the same body with which He will return to earth.

 

It is written that when Jesus appears from heaven, coming down in the same way that He ascended into heaven, when every eye will see Him, we shall be "like" Him. In other words, we will not "become" the Lord Jesus Christ, Who is the Word of God Who became flesh. Our glorified bodies will only "resemble" His glorified body.

 

The Lord Jesus Christ is unique in that He is the ONLY one-of-a-kind incarnation, Who is God in the flesh, truly God and truly man. Just as there is only ONE Word of God, there is no other human besides the Lord Jesus Christ who can ever be "the Word of God in the flesh".

 

.

 

 

10 For it was fitting for Him, for whom are all things and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons to glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings. 11 For both He who sanctifies and those who are being sanctified are all of one, for which reason He is not ashamed to call them brethren,

 

In all things Christ was made like us. Hebrews 2 is clear. But only to His Brethren. He is our supreme example that we are made perfect through suferrings and slander.

 

17 Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people.

18 For in that He Himself has suffered, being tempted, He is able to aid those who are tempted.

 

 

 

If the truth sets one then he is free indeed. His Word Is truth. And by truth we are santified.

 

Isaac for one example, was the Word of God made manifest.

Edited January 9, 2007 by fourvetta

[fourvetta 0]

Again, the theory that it was the intention of God the Father, from the very beginning, for the Word of God to somehow be "made manifest in man", at some point in time, be it in the Old Testament Prophets of God, in the Apostles of the Lord Jesus Christ, in "true believers", or in Jesus Christ Himself, is not a Biblical concept.

 

Again, Hebrews 1 is clear that God spoke to us or was manifest to us through the Prophets and the Lord Jesus Christ. This includes the prophets of God to this day.

 

1 God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, 2 has in these last days spoken to us by His Son,

 

"In these last days" means as in these past days. He has spoken to us all the way through the corridors of time to this day.

 

The Word of God always was, and is, and will, be manifest in His Prophets, His true prophets.

 

Peter says, "For prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit."

 

We can agree that the Spoken Word of God was prior to the written Word.

 

John witnesses to this saying, "I am not the true light but I came to be a witness to the true light. He who comes after me is greater then me. He is preferred to me for He was before me. He shall baptize you in the Spirit and fire."

 

This is the same "spoken" Word of God Who was with God the Father, and was God, in the beginning, from eternity, Who subsequently spoke, literally "breathed out", the words that were eventually written down to become known as the "written" Word of God,

 

This Spoken Word was then recorded in the first five books of the Bible written by Moses as God revealed His Word to him. Not literally breathed out, but Spoken through His Mouth which are His prophets.

 

Israel was then baptized into the name of Moses, immersed into his teachings. Moses said speaking on God's behalf, "I AM the God that led you out of Egypt, out of the house of bondage."

 

Apostle Paul clearly speaks of this in 1 Corinthians 10

 

1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea,

2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea,

3 all ate the same spiritual food,

4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ.

 

We see in verse 4 that who rejected the teachings of Moses rejected Christ.

 

The Spirit of Christ was in all the prophets from the beginning to now.

 

10 Of this salvation the prophets have inquired and searched carefully, who prophesied of the grace that would come to you, 11 searching what, or what manner of time, the Spirit of Christ who was in them was indicating when He testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow.

12 To them it was revealed that, not to themselves, but to us they were ministering the things which now have been reported to you through those who have preached the gospel to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven”things which angels desire to look into.

 

Rather, it is recorded in the Scriptures that the Word of God BECAME flesh, and that "flesh" is the physical human being body of the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

Christ says, "My flesh profits Me nothing. It is the Words that I speak to you that are Spirit and Life." The Spoken Word of God and not the written Word. The Spiritual bread that descends from the heavens and not the literal bread.

 

Christ said, "Seek for the bread which leads to eternal life."

 

Christs teachings were and are God's Word manifested. The Word of God IS God.

 

Not the wafer in the form of a dry cracker and the wine in a glass, which Catholics say is the literal body and blood of Christ. Which they believe, when the bread and the wine are blessed at communion they become the literal body and blood of Christ.

 

This is the same communion that Judas had apart from the disciples. It is by that communion that Satan entered into him. By the dipping of the wafer into the wine. Of course the wafer has no yeast.

 

Our yeast is Christ. Their communion is without Christ.

 

The ultimate deception.

 

Seeking, does this properly describe the communion as you partake in it??

 

As to the final secrets being revealed at the time of the seventh angel?

 

I agree.

 

With the Trump of the seventh angel, the final mysteries of God that are not yet written will be revealed. They will be written down at that time.This of course will be called extra biblical books by the unbeliever.

 

We will eat of these books for a thousand years in bodies that will eternally not die. Being constantly renewed daily, in Spirit and in mind.

 

4 Now when the seven thunders uttered their voices,I was about to write; but I heard a voice from heaven saying to me,"Seal up the things which the seven thunders uttered, and do not write them."

7 but in the days of the sounding of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets.

11 And he said to me, "You must prophesy again to many peoples, nations, tongues, and kings."

 

However, to hear the message of the seventh angel, one must first hear the sound of the trumpets of the first six angels.

 

The Seven Thunders have long uttered their voices unceasingly throughout the whole world, through the lips of Chosen people of God, New Israel. MGR book 11 article 17:11

Edited January 10, 2007 by fourvetta

[fourvetta 0]

Jesus Christ who in times past, spoke to us through the prophets, has now spoken to us through His Son, the King of Spirits.

 

As Christ Himself said, "He who overcomes (singular) shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be My son. Revelations 21: 7

 

quote name='coffee'

 

Well, the Apostle John wrote to those who were in the early Church, to those who were the first century followers of the Lord Jesus Christ:

 

....what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is.

The things that were hidden from the Apostles, for it was not yet time, are now revealed by the King of Spirits. As He states, "What was once hidden from the world is now revealed to me clearly."

 

An example of this is when Apostle Paul mentions the Ark of the Covenant, but that he had not much to say about it. But it is clearly revealed now, by the Spoken Word of God.

 

Hebrews 9

 

This ark contained the gold jar of manna, Aaron's staff that had budded, and the stone tablets of the covenant. 5Above the ark were the cherubim of the Glory, overshadowing the atonement cover. But we cannot discuss these things in detail now.

 

Rather, it is recorded in the Scriptures that the Word of God BECAME flesh, and that "flesh" is the physical human being body of the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

One must also believe then, to resort to cannibalism which is contrary to God's law. Blood is forbidden in the Old testament to drink as it is also to eat the flesh of a human being.

 

But WE know that Christ means to eat His body, which is His Word and drink His blood, which is the Spirit that proceeds from His Word.

 

It is by this that the Son of God sits alongside His Father on His throne, the heart and soul of the believer. The new heaven and new earth where righteousness dwells.

 

"If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him."

 

The Word of God made manifest in man. Just as God intended for man to be in the beginning. Behold the Tabernacle of God is with Men. God in the flesh.

 

Christ showed us the way to the Father.

 

But a skeptic cannot be saved by faith.

[steadfast 0]

Jesus Christ who in times past, spoke to us through the prophets, has now spoken to us through His Son, the King of Spirits.

Taught by Jesus of Nikitino only to the Molokans; Jesus Christ who in times past, spoke to us through the prophets, has now spoken to us through His Son, the King of Spirits.

Taught by Jesus of Nazareth to all mankind; In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son..NIV Heb 1:1-2

[steadfast 0]

Jesus Christ who in times past, spoke to us through the prophets, has now spoken to us through His Son, the King of Spirits.

To get to the Father, Molokans must go thru the son of the Son. You can't prove that with any contextual Bible scripture. Then please explain; Luke 16:16 with contextual Bible scripture; "The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it." Maxim would have to be older than John, of course but maybe in your mind he might have been, since you believe his flesh body is refurbished every 100 years. Kinda like recapping a tire.....Oye! ..... Oye mom look what they've let happen to Dalmatov's church, oye!

[seeking_truth_1 0]

4vetta:

 

You say Jesus will come with a new name "King of Spirits"

You say mgr has a new name "King of Spirits"

 

Wouldn't that make them the same?

 

 

 

 

 

fourvetta is fond of quoting the following passage:

 

"Now when HE was asked by the Pharisees when THE KINGDOM OF GOD would come, HE answered them and said, ˜THE KINGDOM OF GOD does not come with observation; nor will they say, ˜See here!` or ˜See there!` For indeed, THE KINGDOM OF GOD is within you.`" (Luke 17:20-21)

 

Based on his assertions regarding his hero, however, it is evident fourvetta does not truly believe JESUS` words.

 

So, why did the man, maxim gavrilovitch rudometkin, claim to be the king of spirits if the king of spirits, according to fourvetta, is the Lord Jesus Christ Himself?

 

I have heard some people use that to describe their interpretation of the King of Spirits.

 

I however, do not hold that view.

 

If thats true that Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits, then Jesus Christ was imprisoned in the Suzdalski Monastery. MGR book 4 article: 28

 

Jesus Christ holds the title of King of Kings and Lord of Lords. Just as God the Father holds the title of God of Gods.

 

But the King of Spirits is the new name that Jesus Christ Himself gave to the principle victor over the seven headed beast who sits upon the harlot that rules the whole world in order to test those who dwell in the earth.

 

Jesus Christ Himself is the rider upon the White Steed personified as the King of Spirits. Riding at full gallop into the battlefield of Armageddon. The two edged sword proceeds from His Mouth which is the Spoken Words of God. The Word of God made manifest in man.

 

Not the literal teachings of the scriptures but the spiritual teachings of the Holy Spirit. By the letter of the scriptures all the prophets were killed, including Jesus Christ.

 

This is talking to those who know the scriptures in detail. Just as the scribes and Pharisees. The most eloquent anti-christ is the one who is taught by the book. The two horned lamb who came up out of the earth. The seventh from the eight.

 

Also called by Christ, "the False Teacher" that is among you.

 

Matvei S. Dalmatov was our first hero to expose the false teacher and was killed on the wheel because of it. MGR book 9 article 6

 

This, by supposed christians.

 

Christ said, "The days are coming, when those who kill you think they do God's service." The two witnesses also will die by the letter of the law.

 

The false teacher compels every one under the decree of death to worship the beast.

 

By the beatings of slanderous words.

 

Under the banner of the king of Spirits we have protection from the Lord. The wings of the Spirit is our covering. The Lord is Spirit and upon whom the Spirit of the Lord is upon, there is freedom to those who believe in him.

 

Our place of refuge is called Surmagdan, given by the King of Spirits and only to those who believe in him. MGR book 2 articles 19 & 20

 

17 Because you say, ˜I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing`”and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked”

18 I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined in the fire, that you may be rich; and white garments, that you may be clothed, that the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed; and anoint your eyes with eye salve, that you may see.

19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent.

 

One must repent in order to be baptized into the name of the King of Spirits. All those who believe and are baptized will be saved.

[fourvetta 0]

To get to the Father, Molokans must go thru the son of the Son. You can't prove that with any contextual Bible scripture. Then please explain; Luke 16:16 with contextual Bible scripture; "The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it."

 

The Law and the Prophets remain, until one enters the kingdom of God. Prophesy and the Law pass when true love is obtained. Where true love is, there is God also.

 

Apostle Paul says this;

 

 

8 Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.

9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part.

10 But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

 

 

One who has not entered the kingdom of God, still thinks as a child, is still under the law and the prophets, and has not obtained true love.

 

Christ said, " Let them listen to the law and the prophets. If they will not listen to them, they will not listen to Me. Even if one where to return from the dead."

 

17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. [/b]

18 I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

19 Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

 

 

To get to the Father, Molokans must go thru the son of the Son. You can't prove that with any contextual Bible scripture.

Have you not read the scripture?

 

40"He who receives you receives me, and he who receives me receives the one who sent me.

41 Anyone who receives a prophet because he is a prophet will receive a prophet's reward, and anyone who receives a righteous man because he is a righteous man will receive a righteous man's reward.

42And if anyone gives even a cup of cold water to one of these little ones because he is my disciple, I tell you the truth, he will certainly not lose his reward."

 

 

You say Jesus will come with a new name "King of Spirits"

You say mgr has a new name "King of Spirits"

 

Wouldn't that make them the same?

 

Again. Because Christ came in the name of the Father does not make Him the Father. Christ said, "My Father is greater then Me."

 

Even John the Baptist understood saying, "He who comes after me is greater then Me."

 

But to reject the one who is sent, is to reject also the One who sent sent him.

 

 

Even Martin Luther King understood the second coming. He said, "I have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord." I commend him for it.

Edited January 15, 2007 by fourvetta

[seeking_truth_1 0]

You say Jesus will come with a new name "King of Spirits"

You say mgr has a new name "King of Spirits"

 

Wouldn't that make them the same?

 

Again. Because Christ came in the name of the Father does not make Him the Father. Christ said, "My Father is greater then Me."

 

Even John the Baptist understood saying, "He who comes after me is greater then Me."

 

But to reject the one who is sent, is to reject also the One who sent sent him.

 

Even Martin Luther King understood the second coming. He said, "I have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord." I commend him for it.

 

When you say "to reject the one who is sent", are you referring to mgr or Jesus?

 

You are not stating that the second coming was realized in the person of mgr, are you?

 

As for mlk, you realize he's quoting a lyric from a song, right?

 

Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord;

He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored;

He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword;

His truth is marching on.

Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! Glory! Glory! Hallelujah!

Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! His truth is marching on.

[seeking_truth_1 0]

As I was doing some reading I did find these "gems"

 

The day of visitation of the Lord has already come to our people.

 

But did we recognize it? (from fourvetta's post in What is a Molokan thread)

 

 

Do you believe that the following scripture is the true testimony of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit? That the second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ is with a New name? (Response to Dan ***************** thread)

 

 

Also in the Second Coming of the Lord Jesus Christ and His descent to us upon the white horse. The Word of God became flesh, a second time and dwelt among us. His New Name of King of Spirits and God of the faithfull.

 

His Name shall be called the Word of God. (Coffee thread)

 

 

Thats exactly my theogy. The second coming of the Lord Jesus Christ upon His White Steed. First for the Molokan, then for the world! (Rudometkin based everything on the Scriptures thread)

 

 

The Second Coming and the New Name of Jesus Christ is the King of Spirits and God to the faithfull. (What is a Molokan thread)

 

It would appear that 4vetta believes that the second coming of Christ was realized in mgr

 

If that's the case we're in the Millennial Kingdom right now...Where's mgr or for that matter Jesus?

 

Neither is reigning in Jerusalem

 

"And now the LORD says: I am returning to Mount Zion, and I will live in Jerusalem. Then Jerusalem will be called the Faithful City; the mountain of the LORD Almighty will be called the Holy Mountain." (Zechariah 8:3 NLT)

 

It's sure not peaceful now, yet the Bible says there will be peace during this time

 

"2 Many nations will come and say, "Come, let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the Temple of the God of Israel. There he will teach us his ways, so that we may obey him." For in those days the LORD`s teaching and his word will go out from Jerusalem.

3 The LORD will settle international disputes. All the nations will beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. All wars will stop, and military training will come to an end.

4 Everyone will live quietly in their own homes in peace and prosperity, for there will be nothing to fear. The LORD Almighty has promised this!" (Micah 4:2-4 NLT)

 

Why is there poverty? If we're in the Millennial Kingdom, theres unparalleled prosperity according to the Bible

 

"13 "The time will come," says the LORD, "when the grain and grapes will grow faster than they can be harvested. Then the terraced vineyards on the hills of Israel will drip with sweet wine!

14 I will bring my exiled people of Israel back from distant lands, and they will rebuild their ruined cities and live in them again. They will plant vineyards and gardens; they will eat their crops and drink their wine.

15 I will firmly plant them there in the land I have given them," says the LORD your God. "Then they will never be uprooted again."" (Amos 9:13-15 NLT)

[fourvetta 0]

Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord;

He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored;

He hath loosed the fateful lightning of His terrible swift sword;

His truth is marching on.

Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! Glory! Glory! Hallelujah!

Glory! Glory! Hallelujah! His truth is marching on.

 

Beautiful song with excellent words!

 

Even the writer of that song, along with MLK, knew of the second coming of the Lord, as God revealed it to them. He who is taught by God, comes to Him.

 

11 Now I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and makes war.

12 His eyes were like a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns. He had a name written that no one knew except Himself.

13 He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies in heaven, clothed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses.

15 Now out of His mouth goes a sharp[g] sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

 

His army also makes war in righteousness and His truth marches on to the battlefield of Armageddon.

[coffee 0]

.

 

From the perspective of the Bible-based Christian(s):

 

1) Given the fact that the work of the Holy Spirit is to bear witness of the Lord Jesus Christ, and Him alone....

 

2) Given the fact that by Rudometkin's own admission, Rudometkin's "Book of the Sun" writings, which are admittedly the core of what is written in the Spirit and Life book, were inspired by a "new spirit"....

 

3) Given the fact that according to Rudometkin's very own recorded words, Rudometkin's "new spirit" continues to lead his faithful followers on a "new pathway" to God....

 

4) Given the fact that Rudometkin's "new pathway" is innately different from the foundation that is based upon the absolute truth, which has already been established by God long ago, as recorded for all of mankind in the Holy Scriptures....

 

5) Given the fact that the reason Rudometkin's "new revelations" are in such stark contrast to that which has been recorded in the Bible, is because the very "spirit" that inspired Rudometkin to write what he did in the Spirit and Life book is indeed a "new" spirit....

 

6) Given the fact that by its very identity, Rudometkin's "new spirit" is different from the Biblical Holy Spirit, specifically because it bears witness of Rudometkin, exalting him and glorifying him, Rudometkin, instead of Jesus....

 

It is unclear to Molokan Christians exactly what the Rudometkinites find in the teachings and "new revelations" of their hero which would give them cause to revere Rudometkin in the manner that they do.

 

Whatever the reason(s) for the stereotypical Rudometkinite, when it comes to Holy Spirit recognition and accurate discernment of the true context of what has been written in the Bible, the end result has always been the obvious chaos and confusion that is characteristic of their belief system, as can also be seen in the verbal exchanges here on the internet.

 

I personally believe that one of the best things to ever happen within our Molokan brotherhood is for the young and zealous Rudometkinites to come out of their closets and publicly admit their religious affinity to their hero and "king", to willingly come out into the open as they have, and speak frankly, with all sincerity and confidence, and actually attempt to answer questions and explain their theology and world view, according to their personal belief system.

 

What has happened as a result of this is that the serious student of the Bible has been able to recognize the differences between those who are the true followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, versus those who are the members of the "New Israel" Jumpers and Leapers, the faithful followers of Rudometkin.

 

As a result of their devout loyalty to Rudometkin, and to his writings in the Spirit and Life book, the Rudometkinites have basically "reconstructed" that which is written in the Bible to suit their own personal desires, and in the process, they have mangled the true context of the Scriptures. In the process, they deceive themselves in their attempts to convince others that their extra-Biblical belief system is supposedly "Biblical" somehow.

 

One of the best examples of this is demonstrated in what fourvetta and others continue to share about their "understanding" of what God is telling His children, in a number of key passages from the Biblical text.

 

From fourvetta:

 

When Christ said, "If you have seen Me, you have seen the Father."

 

But what Christ was referring to was His Oneness with the Father. Being equal to Him in Spirit. (Post # 40, above)

In the Scripture referred to by fourvetta above, which is from John 14:1-11, the disciple named Philip asked Christ to show them the Father. The context here, from the term that is used in the original Greek text is to see, visibly and visually. Quite obviously, Philip was asking Jesus to reveal for them the visual reality of God the Father, in visible form.

 

Philip did not ask Jesus to "explain" the Father to them. Nor did he ask Christ to "elaborate on His Oneness" with God the Father. In truth, the context of "Oneness" is not found in these specific verses, nor is it even the subject of this particular section of Scripture.

 

Jesus told His disciples that they know the Father, and have seen Him, and that whoever has seen the Lord Jesus Christ in the flesh, has seen the Father. The context of Christ's words is in reference to something most definitely visual and physical in nature, as opposed to the stark contrast of something with a "spiritualized" or cryptic and mystical connotation.

 

In today's vernacular, Philip's request of Christ might sound very similar to this:

 

Jesus - "If you had really known Me, you would have known My Father as well. From this day forward, I am telling you that you do know Him, and that you have actually seen Him."

 

Philip - "Lord, show us the Father, and if you will just reveal Him to us, and point Him out for us to see what He looks like, that will be enough for us, and we will be satisfied."

 

Jesus - "I have been with you all this time, Philip, and you still don't know? I am telling you that the only opportunity anyone will ever have of seeing what the Father looks like, is to look upon Me. Why do you still ask that I show you the Father?"

 

From the Bible:

 

....Christ, who is the [physical and visible] image of God [in human flesh]. (2 Corinthians 4:4)

 

 

He is the [physical and visible] image of the invisible God [in human flesh], the firstborn of all creation. (Colossians 1:15)

 

 

Jesus said, "I am the Road, also the Truth, also the Life. No one gets to the Father apart from me.

 

If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him. You've even seen him!"

 

Philip said, "Master, show us the Father; then we'll be content."

 

"You've been with me all this time, Philip, and you still don't understand?

 

To see me is to see the Father.

 

So how can you ask, 'Where is the Father?'

 

Don't you believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me?

 

The words that I speak to you aren't mere words. I don't just make them up on my own. The Father who resides in me crafts each word into a divine act.

 

"Believe me: I am in my Father and my Father is in me."

 

(John 14:6-14, the Message Bible)

 

 

From fourvetta:

 

Having the Name of the Father upon Himself. Referring to the Word Of God, also known as the Name of the Father. (Post # 40, above)

 

According to what is written in the Bible, the name of God, indeed the very name of God the Father, is "I AM", and is not that which fourvetta seems to want to believe.

 

From the Bible:

 

Then Moses said to God, "If I come to the people of Israel and say to them, 'The God of your fathers has sent me to you,' and they ask me, 'What is his name?' what shall I say to them?"

 

God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM." And he said, "Say this to the people of Israel, 'I AM has sent me to you.'"

 

God also said to Moses, "Say this to the people of Israel, 'The LORD, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.' This is my name forever, and thus I am to be remembered throughout all generations."

 

(Exodus 3:13-15)

 

 

According to what is written in the Scriptures, the name of God is obviously not "Word of God". As we can see, fourvetta basically makes things up as he goes, just like with the unBiblical term that fourvetta is so very fond of using, "the Word of God made manifest in man".

 

From fourvetta:

 

The new name of Jesus Christ is King of Spirits and God to the faithful.

 

But you, say that Lord God cannot be made Manifest in the flesh.

 

Which is contrary to the scripture, "The Word of God shall be made manifest in man."

 

Then you never understood the message of the Gospel. (Post # 5, Fourvetta, Who is Jesus Part II)

 

 

Just like Rudometkin and his Khlysty forefathers before him, a zealous Rudometkinite is not above making up his own Scripture, in order to have it coincide with what he already wants to believe. In truth, there is nothing written in the Bible that contains either the words, "The Word of God shall be made manifest in man", or anything that even comes close, to even remotely convey this particular concept, which fourvetta claims to exist, not even if one were to twist the words of Scripture out of context.

 

Because of their militant defense of Rudometkin, and of his writings in the Spirit and Life book, the Rudometkinites reject the authority of the Holy Scriptures as the absolute truth, especially the Scriptural truth that the preincarnate Word of God, Who is God, became literal flesh in the person of Jesus of Nazareth.

 

As a result, the Rudometkinites have instead established their belief system on the extra-Biblical hypothesis which suggests that God intended for His Word to somehow "be made manifest" in various individuals throughout history, their hero Rudometkin of course being the primary one.

 

This theory is a key part of the belief system of the historical Khlysty, and has never been part of the teachings of our Bible-based Molokan Christian forefathers. The point here needs to be made, and repeated often, that the Rudometkinites are not the remnant our Molokan forefathers, period. The Rudometkinites are the present day equivalent of the historical Khlysty, and are simply perpetuating the heresy of Rudometkin's version of Khlystovschina.

 

What has become most obvious in all of this, and something which I believe to be a good thing, is the recognition within our Molokan community of the total lack of "credibility" among those who are the Rudometkinites, especially when comparing their theology and their belief system with established Biblical truth.

 

In spite of this, the Rudometkinites currently dominate the political control of the majority of the Molokan churches here in America. The point being, that to dominate the political control of the churches, obviously does not require "credibility". Nor does it necessitate a true, contextual knowledge of what is recorded in the Scriptures.

 

As it stands now, all that is necessary to exercise and control political dominance in our Molokan churches, is for someone to be a bully, which is how the historians described the relationship and the kind of authority that Rudometkin had over his followers in Russia. A bully does not need "credibility" in order to dominate others. As it applies to our current situation, the Rudometkinites do not need "credibility" to maintain political domination over those who are the Bible-based Molokan Christians.

 

Remember, the "spirit" that is active among the Rudometkinites today is still the SAME "new spirit" that Rudometkin introduced to his followers during the 1800s, in Russia.

 

From fourvetta:

 

The emphasis of Jesus Christ coming down in the same manner that He was taken up, is that He will return on the Cloud. Which is the gathering of the saints, also known as New Israel. (Post # 42, above)

 

How brilliant is that, huh?

 

So, according to fourvetta, "the Cloud" is the gathering of saints, also known as New Israel, which Christ ascended into heaven on. Let us THINK about this now, as we follow fourvetta's theory, that the alleged "gathering of saints, also known as New Israel", is "the Cloud" upon which the Lord Jesus Christ ascended into heaven, which then means that "New Israel" ascended together with Jesus, and is in heaven right now?

 

No, according to what is written in the Scriptures, the "emphasis" of Jesus Christ coming down in the same manner that He was taken up, is that at the sound of the last trumpet:

 

This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven. (Acts 1:9-11)

 

This means that Jesus will come back to earth in His same glorified body, descending down to earth from heaven, which is the opposite direction from which He ascended up into heaven. The reason that we know this is going to happen is because of what is written in the Scriptures:

 

Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him. Even so. Amen. (Revelation 1:7)

 

This means exactly what it says, that "every eye will see him", visually and visibly, coming in the same glorified body that He ascended into heaven with. And the reason that we know this is going to happen, is because of what God has revealed to all mankind in His recorded Word, the written Word of God, the Holy Scriptures:

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)

 

This means that those who are the true followers of the Jesus Christ are awaiting from heaven our Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and at the time of Christ`s return, we who are followers of Him will have our bodies transformed, literally "changed from our present bodies, into the same kind of glorified body that Jesus ascended into heaven with". And the reason that we know this is because of what is written in the Bible:

 

Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven.

 

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

 

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

 

in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed. (1 Corinthians 15:49-52)

 

This means that according to what is written in the Bible, there is a future event which all followers of the Lord Jesus Christ are still waiting for, which is the return of our Savior, descending down from heaven in the same glorified body that He ascended into heaven with, at which time He will change the bodies of those who are followers of Him into the same kind of glorified body that He Himself now has, in order that we may enter into heaven to live with Him eternally.

 

And the reason that we know this is a future event is because of what the Apostle John wrote to those followers of the Lord Jesus Christ whose care he was entrusted with:

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

Christ is the manifestation and the fulfillment of God coming down from heaven, to save mankind from our sins. In this extremely complicated and miraculous act of grace, God became man, literally in the flesh and person of Jesus Christ. However, the reverse is not true, nor can it be, nor will it ever be.

 

Within the context of the Khlystical and extra-Biblical heresy that fourvetta is so fond of, specifically that elusive, so-called Scripture, "the Word of God made manifest in the flesh", mankind will never, and cannot ever, "become" like Jesus.

 

To be more specific, it is possible for God to become man, for He indeed DID become man, in the person of Jesus Christ, but mankind cannot ever accomplish the reverse, nor has he ever been able to, nor will we ever be able to do so.

 

The Lord Jesus Christ is unique in that He is the ONLY one-of-a-kind incarnation. According to what is recorded in the Scriptures, ONLY Jesus is the fulfillment of the Word of God, Who is God, Who became God in the flesh, Who is truly God and truly man. Just as there is only ONE Word of God, there is no other human besides the Lord Jesus Christ who can ever be "the Word of God in the flesh".

 

Again, the alleged "Scripture" that fourvetta and the Rudometkinites are so fond of "quoting", the scripture, "The Word of God shall be made manifest in man", does not exist, and the manner in which fourvetta continues to twist other Scriptures out of context, in his attempt to manufacture some sort of so-called credible application of this non-existent, yet supposedly "Biblical text", is heresy.

 

From the Bible:

 

He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.

 

For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities”all things were created through him and for him.

 

And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

 

And he is the head of the body, the church. He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in everything he might be preeminent.

 

For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell,

 

and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.

 

(Colossians 1:15-20)

 

 

From fourvetta:

 

Jesus Christ holds the title of King of Kings and Lord of Lords. Just as God the Father holds the title of God of Gods. (Post # 38, above)

 

Again, these kinds of circular exchanges are seemingly endless, but this is another example of the Biblical illiteracy that exists among the majority of today's stereotypical Rudometkinite(s), the same kind of Biblical illiteracy that is demonstrated by Rudometkin in his writings in the Spirit and Life book.

 

From the Bible:

 

"And now, Israel, what does the Lord your God require of you, but to fear the Lord your God, to walk in all his ways, to love him, to serve the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul,

 

and to keep the commandments and statutes of the Lord, which I am commanding you today for your good?

 

Behold, to the Lord your God belong heaven and the heaven of heavens, the earth with all that is in it.

 

Yet the Lord set his heart in love on your fathers and chose their offspring after them, you above all peoples, as you are this day.

 

Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no longer stubborn.

 

For the Lord your God is God of gods and Lord of lords, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God, who is not partial and takes no bribe.

 

(Deuteronomy 10:17)

 

 

Give thanks to the Lord, for he is good,

for his steadfast love endures forever.

 

Give thanks to the God of gods,

for his steadfast love endures forever.

 

Give thanks to the Lord of lords,

for his steadfast love endures forever;

 

(Psalm 136:1-3)

 

 

Obviously, according to what is written in the Scriptures, God the Father has the title of "God", as well as the title of "the Lord", as well as the title of "God of gods", as well as the title of "Lord of Lords", as well as the title of "King of Kings". And, according to these same Scriptures, the Lord Jesus Christ has those exact same titles, including the title of "the only Soverign".

 

 

From fourvetta:

 

Again, Hebrews 1 is clear that God spoke to us or was manifest to us through the Prophets and the Lord Jesus Christ. This includes the prophets of God to this day. (Post # 50, above)

 

God spoke to us: [spoke] - past tense of "to speak", to utter words, to express thoughts orally, to express oneself verbally, to make known by oral communication.

 

God was manifest to us: [manifest] - apparent to the eye or mind, to be shown plainly, to be put on display, to exhibit.

 

As demonstrated by fourvetta, the Rudometkinites not only twist the Scriptures out of context to fit what they want to believe, but they go to similar extremes in doing the same thing with words in the English language as well.

 

.

[lastinline 0]

Coffee,

 

Thank You SO much for your post! I especially enjoyed this part:

 

 

It is unclear to Molokan Christians exactly what the Rudometkinites find in the teachings and "new revelations" of their hero which would give them cause to revere Rudometkin in the manner that they do.

 

Whatever the reason(s) for the stereotypical Rudometkinite, when it comes to Holy Spirit recognition and accurate discernment of the true context of what has been written in the Bible, the end result has always been the obvious chaos and confusion that is characteristic of their belief system, as can also be seen in the verbal exchanges here on the internet.

 

I personally believe that one of the best things to ever happen within our Molokan brotherhood is for the young and zealous Rudometkinites to come out of their closets and publicly admit their religious affinity to their hero and "king", to willingly come out into the open as they have, and speak frankly, with all sincerity and confidence, and actually attempt to answer questions and explain their theology and world view, according to their personal belief system.

 

What has happened as a result of this is that the serious student of the Bible has been able to recognize the differences between those who are the true followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, versus those who are the members of the "New Israel" Jumpers and Leapers, the faithful followers of Rudometkin.

 

As a result of their devout loyalty to Rudometkin, and to his writings in the Spirit and Life book, the Rudometkinites have basically "reconstructed" that which is written in the Bible to suit their own personal desires, and in the process, they have mangled the true context of the Scriptures. In the process, they deceive themselves in their attempts to convince others that their extra-Biblical belief system is supposedly "Biblical" somehow.

 

 

 

As you will notice in my profile, I have not been on this forum for very long. My dear wife had been trying for years to get me interested in getting some of this great reading and reinforcement of my total FAITH IN JESUS CHRIST AND HIM ALONE FOR HIS FINISHED WORK ON THE CROSS! As you stated above, I also feel that these Rudometkinit"s coming out of the closet so boldly is a GREAT thing. So we all can see there belief system and how it can and does affect my loved one's and close friends in the Molokan church.

 

PLEASE KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!

 

lastinline (I love the view from here)

[EGK 0]

Coffee!

 

A very good observation of the current status. I really enjoyed the thoughts on the actions of being "Bullied". I heard a comment from a man recently that he believed 95% of the members of his sobraniya did not believe the same as the leaders of his church. Yet in his church I know of two men, especially, who are very persuasive and will soil their own nest and everyone elses just to get their way. (Bully) It is a very sad state and very reminiscent of children on a playground, more than adults, that 95% live in fear and apathy rather than courage and faith. I have been reading Fox's, Book of Martyrs, which is a collection of the sufferings and deaths of the early Christians, it really showed me how feeble and weak my own faith can truly be to sufferings and persecution surrounding which can befall us.

 

EGK

[fourvetta 0]

In the Scripture referred to by fourvetta above, which is from John 14:1-11, the disciple named Philip asked Christ to show them the Father. The context here, from the term that is used in the original Greek text is to see, visibly and

This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven. (Acts 1:9-11)

 

This means that Jesus will come back to earth in His same glorified body, descending down to earth from heaven, which is the opposite direction from which He ascended up into heaven. The reason that we know this is going to happen is because of what is written in the Scriptures:

 

Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even those who pierced him, and all tribes of the earth will wail on account of him. Even so. Amen. (Revelation 1:7)

 

This means exactly what it says, that "every eye will see him", visually and visibly, coming in the same glorified body that He ascended into heaven with. And the reason that we know this is going to happen, is because of what God has revealed to all mankind in His recorded Word, the written Word of God, the Holy Scriptures:

 

 

Christ said this to the Jews while He was standing in front of them visibly and speaking to them audibly.

 

37And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form,

38 nor does his word dwell in you, for you do not believe the one he sent.

 

Now I know that Coffee has never seen Christ visibly as nobody has, being that He was on earth some 2000 years ago.

 

Coffee please describe to us, what does Christ look like and what does the Father look like?

 

Don't get confused with the picture presented by the worldly christian view, with long flowing hair and a glow about Him, wearing a pure white robe.

 

Isaiah 53 describes what we would consider Him to be if we were to see Him.

 

He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him, nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.

3 He was despised and rejected by men, a man of sorrows, and familiar with suffering. Like one from whom men hide their faces he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

4 Surely he took up our infirmities and carried our sorrows, yet we considered him stricken by God, smitten by him, and afflicted.

 

Paul explains;

 

16 Therefore, from now on, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer.

 

 

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

This means that those who are the true followers of the Jesus Christ are awaiting from heaven our Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ Himself.

 

Not so!

 

The believer who dwells in heaven and while in it, awaits the Savior, who is called the Word of God.

 

 

 

and at the time of Christ`s return, we who are followers of Him will have our bodies transformed, literally "changed from our present bodies, into the same kind of glorified body that Jesus ascended into heaven with". And the reason that we know this is because of what is written in the Bible:

 

Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven.

 

I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

 

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

 

in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed. (1 Corinthians 15:49-52)

 

This means that according to what is written in the Bible, there is a future event which all followers of the Lord Jesus Christ are still waiting for, which is the return of our Savior, descending down from heaven in the same glorified body that He ascended into heaven with, at which time He will change the bodies of those who are followers of Him into the same kind of glorified body that He Himself now has, in order that we may enter into heaven to live with Him eternally.

 

And the reason that we know this is a future event is because of what the Apostle John wrote to those followers of the Lord Jesus Christ whose care he was entrusted with:

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

Christ is the manifestation and the fulfillment of God coming down from heaven, to save mankind from our sins. In this extremely complicated and miraculous act of grace, God became man, literally in the flesh and person of Jesus Christ. However, the reverse is not true, nor can it be, nor will it ever be.

 

The second man from heaven also known as "the Lord from Above"

 

Also known as "the Second birth" or "Being Born again from above."

 

First the physical man and then the spiritual man.

 

But the Spiritual man cannot come down from heaven unless the physical man first ascends into it.

[coffee 0]

.

 

Man oh man, this fourvetta is one confused fellow, which is actually no different from any of the other Rudometkinites.

 

1) Fourvetta went on record, first stating that he believed Rudometkin to be the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and that Jesus returned to earth sometime during the 1800s, in the physical body of Rudometkin, and that Christ's "new name" is the title which Rudometkin gave to himself, the "king of spirits".

 

Then, fourvetta reversed himself later, by stating that he does not really hold to that view, and he then "revised" what he thought that he had previously believed.

 

 

2) Fourvetta stated that God the Father has the title of "Gods of gods", while the title of "King of kings" and "Lord of lords" belongs to the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

However, according to what is written in the Scriptures, God the Father has the title of "Lord of lords", and the Lord Jesus Christ has the title of "God of gods".

 

 

3) And now the latest from fourvetta.

 

Not so!

 

The believer who dwells in heaven and while in it, awaits the Savior, who is called the Word of God.

 

From the Bible:

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

This means that those who are the true followers of the Jesus Christ are awaiting from heaven our Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and at the time of Christ's return, we who are followers of Him will have our bodies transformed, literally "changed" from our present "lowly bodies", into the same kind of glorified body that Jesus ascended into heaven with.

 

And now, fourvetta responds with this statement:

 

Not so!

 

The believer who dwells in heaven and while in it, awaits the Savior, who is called the Word of God.

 

 

Let us THINK about fourvetta's theory now.

 

According to what is written in the Bible, "flesh and blood", which is a common reference to our "lowly bodies", cannot enter into heaven. This truth is found in 1 Corinthians 15:50.

 

The human body of flesh and blood is also referred to in the Scriptures as "perishable", or "corruptible" flesh, which is a very accurate description of our "lowly bodies", and before it can enter into heaven, it must be changed into an "imperishable", or "incorruptible" body.

 

In other words, our mortal bodies must first be changed into "immortal" flesh. This truth is found in 1 Corinthians 15:51-54.

 

According to what is written in the Bible, when the Lord Jesus Christ returns to earth, in the same glorified body that He ascended into heaven with, the Lord is going to "transform" the bodies of His followers, in one miraculous "twinkling of an eye", into the same kind of glorified body that He now has.

 

According to Scripture, one cannot enter into heaven UNTIL one's body has been "changed", from our "lowly bodies" to our immortal flesh.

 

However, as we follow fourvetta's theory, we see that he believes his mortal, perishable and corruptible, lowly body of flesh and blood is already going to be in heaven somehow, and while there, in heaven, he expects that the Savior, who fourvetta limits to being called just "the Word of God", is going to then "transform" his lowly body to be "like" "the Word of God", since it is recorded in the Scriptures:

 

"who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body"

 

 

According to fourvetta and the Rudometkinites, the Scriptures are wrong.

 

If we adhere to what is written in the Bible, our lowly bodies cannot enter into heaven.

 

However, if we are to believe fourvetta and the Rudometkinites, their lowly bodies are most definitely going to already be in heaven somehow, and while in heaven, they are going to wait for their Savior, who will then transform their lowly bodies to have a glorious body like that of their Savior, who they insist is called "the Word of God", as opposed to what is recorded in the Scriptures:

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

If a body is already in heaven, where immortality already exists, where the bodies of the believers will already by imperishable and incorruptible, why would there be any need for a "transformation"?

 

Readers, this is not some simple "game" or type of "competition" between fourvetta and coffee. This is real, and very serious. It has eternal consequences, because it ultimately addresses the issue of truth versus deception, and whether your soul is going to live eternally with the Lord Jesus Christ, or whether your soul is going to be void of any contact with God, to live forever with the Deceiver and Father of Lies, who has been proven to be the source of Rudometkin's "new spirit", which leads and guides the Rudometkinites on his "new pathway" to a "god" other than the God of the Bible.

 

That we should all become students of the Bible, to be solidly grounded on the teachings of the Lord Jesus Christ, which are recorded for all of mankind in the Holy Scriptures. As we can see in the case of fourvetta, as well as the other Rudometkinites who participate here on the internet, it does not take much to twist out of context that which is written in Scripture.

 

Just as this part of fourvetta's belief system has been exposed as false, so it should be in our Molokan churches whenever those from among the Rudomtkinites attempt to present extra-Biblical heresy to the congregations, from the writings that are in the Spirit and Life book.

 

.

[fourvetta 0]

From the Bible:

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

This means that those who are the true followers of the Jesus Christ are awaiting from heaven our Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and at the time of Christ's return, we who are followers of Him will have our bodies transformed, literally "changed" from our present "lowly bodies", into the same kind of glorified body that Jesus ascended into heaven with.

 

Where the Master is, there is His servant also.

 

According to what is written in the Bible, "flesh and blood", which is a common reference to our "lowly bodies", cannot enter into heaven. This truth is found in 1 Corinthians 15:50.

 

The human body of flesh and blood is also referred to in the Scriptures as "perishable", or "corruptible" flesh, which is a very accurate description of our "lowly bodies", and before it can enter into heaven, it must be changed into an "imperishable", or "incorruptible" body.

 

In other words, our mortal bodies must first be changed into "immortal" flesh. This truth is found in 1 Corinthians 15:51-54.

 

According to what is written in the Bible, when the Lord Jesus Christ returns to earth, in the same glorified body that He ascended into heaven with, the Lord is going to "transform" the bodies of His followers, in one miraculous "twinkling of an eye", into the same kind of glorified body that He now has.

 

According to Scripture, one cannot enter into heaven UNTIL one's body has been "changed", from our "lowly bodies" to our immortal flesh.

 

6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.

7 You should not be surprised at my saying, 'You must be born again.'

8 The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit."

11 I tell you the truth, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony.

12 I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things?

 

 

 

However, as we follow fourvetta's theory, we see that he believes his mortal, perishable and corruptible, lowly body of flesh and blood is already going to be in heaven somehow, and while there, in heaven, he expects that the Savior, who fourvetta limits to being called just "the Word of God", is going to then "transform" his lowly body to be "like" "the Word of God", since it is recorded in the Scriptures:

 

"who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body"

 

Peter tells us that those who have been born of the Word of God have put on the incorruptible.

 

23 For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

24 For, "All men are like grass, and all their glory is like the flowers of the field; the grass withers and the flowers fall,

25 but the word of the Lord stands forever."And this is the word that was preached to you.

 

According to fourvetta and the Rudometkinites, the Scriptures are wrong.

 

If we adhere to what is written in the Bible, our lowly bodies cannot enter into heaven.

 

However, if we are to believe fourvetta and the Rudometkinites, their lowly bodies are most definitely going to already be in heaven somehow, and while in heaven, they are going to wait for their Savior, who will then transform their lowly bodies to have a glorious body like that of their Savior, who they insist is called "the Word of God", as opposed to what is recorded in the Scriptures:

 

The glorified body is also flesh and blood, but incorruptible.

 

Just as death manifested itself in man so shall life.

 

36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.

38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?

39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet.

 

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

If a body is already in heaven, where immortality already exists, where the bodies of the believers will already by imperishable and incorruptible, why would there be any need for a "transformation"?

 

There are those who live in heaven. Whose citizenship is with the Lord.

 

And there are those who live in the earth and in the sea, to whom the devil has come down to. Having great wrath after being cast out of heaven, having found no place there.

 

Rejoice you who live in the heavens! But woe to the inhabitants of the earth and of the sea! For the devil has come down to you!

Edited January 23, 2007 by fourvetta

[coffee 0]

.

 

From fourvetta:

 

Peter tells us that those who have been born of the Word of God have put on the incorruptible.

 

 

For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

 

For, "All men are like grass, and all their glory is like the flowers of the field; the grass withers and the flowers fall,

 

but the word of the Lord stands forever." And this is the word that was preached to you.

 

(quoted from the Bible, 1 Peter 1:23-25)

 

 

Unlike fourvetta and the Rudometkinites, or for that matter any other religious group that attempts to defend the heresy of their particular cult leader, the student(s) of the Bible seeks the guidance of the Holy Spirit whenever reading the Scriptures, so that God's Word is understood in context, how the Lord intends it.

 

The Apostle Peter does not teach that the physical body of a mortal believer is "imperishable", or "incorruptible". In fact, if we want to understand the context of what the Apostle Peter means when he uses that term, it is found in the introduction of his epistle.

 

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

 

to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you,

 

who by God's power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. (1 Peter 1:3-5)

 

 

Again, it does not take much to twist out of context that which is written in the Holy Scriptures, which fourvetta and the Rudometkinites continue to demonstrate for us.

 

This inheritance that is imperishable, which is being kept in heaven for those who are the true followers of the Lord Jesus Christ, will be revealed in the last time, just as it is written:

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

 

Again, the heresy of fourvetta's belief system is most obvious in his failure to answer the question:

 

If fourvetta and the Rudometkinites supposedly are so "spiritual" that they are already living in heaven, where, according to what is written in the Bible, "lowly bodies" of flesh and blood cannot enter, and where immortality already exists, where the bodies of the believers will already exist in glorified bodies that are imperishable and incorruptible, why would there be any need for "transformation" of lowly bodies into glorified bodies? This is one of those contradictions that the Rudometkinites never give answer to.

 

If fourvetta and his fellow Rudometkinites are "living in heaven" at the present time, as he has stated, in bodies that are "imperishable" and "incorruptible", why do the bodies of dead Rudometkinites rot and decompose whenever they die and are buried in their graves? For that matter, why do Rudometkinites continue to die at all?

 

God the Word, Who is God, became flesh in the person of Jesus of Nazareth. Contrary to the heresy of fourvetta and the Rudometkinites, The Word did not "become being made manifest" in the body of Jesus. The Scripture declares that The Word "became" the flesh and body of Jesus.

 

Jesus Christ, in His flesh and blood human body, lived a perfect life in perfect obedience to God the Father. He willingly gave Himself up to be crucified on the cross, as the ONLY sacrifice that could ever be good enough to wash clean and take away the sins of the entire world, once and for all, from now and forever.

 

After He died on the cross, his mortal body was buried in a tomb, or grave, but because of His life in perfect obedience to God the Father, death had no power over Him, and the Lord Jesus Christ resurrected from the dead in a glorified body, after which he ascended into heaven, in that same glorified body. The body of the resurrected Jesus is "imperishable", or "incorruptible", but mankind must wait until Christ returns from heaven before those who are the true followers of the Biblical Jesus will receive our glorified bodies.

 

As it is written:

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)

 

This is the message of the gospel to everyone who believes that God actually did this, that He truly came down from heaven to earth in the body of Jesus Christ, as God in the flesh, to become the only perfect sacrifice, to give mankind the ultimate gift of grace, resulting in salvation and eternal life together with Him in heaven. Each person who believes that this gift is the person of the Lord Jesus Christ and His sacrifice on the cross, and His resurrection from the dead, who becomes a follower of THIS Jesus Christ, the Biblical Jesus Christ, not some figment of Rudometkin's imagination named "alfeyil", and who accepts without doubt that Jesus did indeed take away the sins of all who will repent and believe in Him, will eventually receive the same kind of glorified body that Jesus has, and will live eternally in His presence.

 

.

[LTTBT 0]

Jesus Christ, in His flesh and blood human body, lived a perfect life in perfect obedience to God the Father. He willingly gave Himself up to be crucified on the cross, as the ONLY sacrifice that could ever be good enough to wash clean and take away the sins of the entire world, once and for all, from now and forever.

 

I don't think God asked His Son "Will you die for them?"

I think God asked His Son, "Do you Love them?"

Obedience was Love, knowing that death was the act of Love.

[fourvetta 0]

.

 

In the Scripture referred to by fourvetta above, which is from John 14:1-11, the disciple named Philip asked Christ to show them the Father. The context here, from the term that is used in the original Greek text is to see, visibly and visually. Quite obviously, Philip was asking Jesus to reveal for them the visual reality of God the Father, in visible form.

 

Philip did not ask Jesus to "explain" the Father to them. Nor did he ask Christ to "elaborate on His Oneness" with God the Father. In truth, the context of "Oneness" is not found in these specific verses, nor is it even the subject of this particular section of Scripture.

 

Jesus told His disciples that they know the Father, and have seen Him, and that whoever has seen the Lord Jesus Christ in the flesh, has seen the Father. The context of Christ's words is in reference to something most definitely visual and physical in nature, as opposed to the stark contrast of something with a "spiritualized" or cryptic and mystical connotation.

 

In today's vernacular, Philip's request of Christ might sound very similar to this:

 

Jesus - "If you had really known Me, you would have known My Father as well. From this day forward, I am telling you that you do know Him, and that you have actually seen Him."

 

Philip - "Lord, show us the Father, and if you will just reveal Him to us, and point Him out for us to see what He looks like, that will be enough for us, and we will be satisfied."

 

Jesus - "I have been with you all this time, Philip, and you still don't know? I am telling you that the only opportunity anyone will ever have of seeing what the Father looks like, is to look upon Me. Why do you still ask that I show you the Father?"

 

From the Bible:

 

....Christ, who is the [physical and visible] image of God [in human flesh]. (2 Corinthians 4:4)

 

 

He is the [physical and visible] image of the invisible God [in human flesh], the firstborn of all creation. (Colossians 1:15)

 

 

Jesus said, "I am the Road, also the Truth, also the Life. No one gets to the Father apart from me.

 

If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him. You've even seen him!"

 

Philip said, "Master, show us the Father; then we'll be content."

 

"You've been with me all this time, Philip, and you still don't understand?

 

To see me is to see the Father.

 

So how can you ask, 'Where is the Father?'

 

Don't you believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me?

 

To conclude, coffee does not know Christ or the Father, being that He does not know what they look like visibly.

 

Unless of course He shows some sort of proof as to what exactly is the physical and visible image of God.

[steadfast 0]

.

 

In the Scripture referred to by fourvetta above, which is from John 14:1-11, the disciple named Philip asked Christ to show them the Father. The context here, from the term that is used in the original Greek text is to see, visibly and visually. Quite obviously, Philip was asking Jesus to reveal for them the visual reality of God the Father, in visible form.

 

Philip did not ask Jesus to "explain" the Father to them. Nor did he ask Christ to "elaborate on His Oneness" with God the Father. In truth, the context of "Oneness" is not found in these specific verses, nor is it even the subject of this particular section of Scripture.

 

Jesus told His disciples that they know the Father, and have seen Him, and that whoever has seen the Lord Jesus Christ in the flesh, has seen the Father. The context of Christ's words is in reference to something most definitely visual and physical in nature, as opposed to the stark contrast of something with a "spiritualized" or cryptic and mystical connotation.

 

In today's vernacular, Philip's request of Christ might sound very similar to this:

 

Jesus - "If you had really known Me, you would have known My Father as well. From this day forward, I am telling you that you do know Him, and that you have actually seen Him."

 

Philip - "Lord, show us the Father, and if you will just reveal Him to us, and point Him out for us to see what He looks like, that will be enough for us, and we will be satisfied."

 

Jesus - "I have been with you all this time, Philip, and you still don't know? I am telling you that the only opportunity anyone will ever have of seeing what the Father looks like, is to look upon Me. Why do you still ask that I show you the Father?"

 

From the Bible:

 

....Christ, who is the [physical and visible] image of God [in human flesh]. (2 Corinthians 4:4)

 

 

He is the [physical and visible] image of the invisible God [in human flesh], the firstborn of all creation. (Colossians 1:15)

 

 

Jesus said, "I am the Road, also the Truth, also the Life. No one gets to the Father apart from me.

 

If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him. You've even seen him!"

 

Philip said, "Master, show us the Father; then we'll be content."

 

"You've been with me all this time, Philip, and you still don't understand?

 

To see me is to see the Father.

 

So how can you ask, 'Where is the Father?'

 

Don't you believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me?

 

To conclude, coffee does not know Christ or the Father, being that He does not know what they look like visibly.

Unless of course He shows some sort of proof as to what exactly is the physical and visible image of God.

We can always ask Maxim, it sounds like he was there; "Immediately there personally stood before Him a handsome youth of supreme stature, manifestly born and created of Him; by none other than but by GOD His Father. This is why here GOD Himself, first of all, walked up to Him like a real Father to a son, and greeted Him with His image and likeness." MGR 1/5/8-9 Black book page 174 line 8-9.

 

FV do you think you can be just like your Maxim, maybe even better. How many christs are their?

[fourvetta 0]

No man has seen the Father except the Son. AND to whom the Son reveals Him.

[coffee 0]

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It is written in the Bible:

 

Now Thomas, one of the Twelve, called the Twin, was not with them when Jesus came.

 

So the other disciples told him, "We have seen the Lord." But he said to them, "Unless I see in his hands the mark of the nails, and place my finger into the mark of the nails, and place my hand into his side, I will never believe."

 

Eight days later, his disciples were inside again, and Thomas was with them. Although the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, "Peace be with you."

 

Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe."

 

Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!"

 

Jesus said to him, "Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."

 

Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book;

 

but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name. (John 20:24-30)

 

 

 

From fourvetta:

 

To conclude, coffee does not know Christ or the Father, being that He does not know what they look like visibly.

 

Unless of course He shows some sort of proof as to what exactly is the physical and visible image of God.

It is written in the Bible:

 

...Christ, who is the [physical and visible] image of God [in human flesh]. (2 Corinthians 4:4)

 

 

He is the [physical and visible] image of the invisible God [in human flesh], the firstborn of all creation. (Colossians 1:15)

 

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it [meaning from heaven, coming down to earth in the same glorified body that he ascended into heaven with] we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

.

[fourvetta 0]

...Christ, who is the [physical and visible] image of God [in human flesh]. (2 Corinthians 4:4)

 

 

He is the [physical and visible] image of the invisible God [in human flesh], the firstborn of all creation. (Colossians 1:15)

 

 

But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it [meaning from heaven, coming down to earth in the same glorified body that he ascended into heaven with] we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

 

who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)

 

 

Beloved, we are God's children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

 

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I am sorry that you do not as yet have a grasp on the english language. But the Apostolic Church dwelt in heaven. With the Lord Himself.

 

Is Christ going to come as a Lion or a Lamb? Being that the scripture shows Him appear in that manner.

[coffee 0]

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From fourvetta:

 

I am sorry that you do not as yet have a grasp on the english language. But the Apostolic Church dwelt in heaven. With the Lord Himself.

 

As the readers ponder this, be reminded that these individuals are right there next to you in church, calling themselves "Molokans". These are the individuals who are led by inspiration of Rudometkin's "new spirit", which is leading them on a "new pathway" to heaven. Their religious theology begins with Rudometkin's heresies in Rudometkin's "Book of the Sun" writings that are the centerpiece of what is written in the Spirit and Life book.

 

These are the people who deny what is written in the Bible, that God became human flesh in the Biblical person of Jesus of Nazareth. These are the individuals who reject what is written in the Holy Scriptures, because of their devotion to Rudometkin, who remains at the very core of their belief system.

 

Imagine that, we have Rudometkinites who go around calling themselves "Molokans", who believe that not only did Jesus ascend into heaven in His glorified body, but they also beleive that the apostolic church at that time ascended together with Him.

 

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[fourvetta 0]

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Imagine that, we have Rudometkinites who go around calling themselves "Molokans", who believe that not only did Jesus ascend into heaven in His glorified body, but they also beleive that the apostolic church at that time ascended together with Him.

 

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The gathering of the saints, also called New Israel is Christ's Glorified Body in His Second Coming.

[fourvetta 0]

Imagine that, we have Rudometkinites who go around calling themselves "Molokans", who believe that not only did Jesus ascend into heaven in His glorified body, but they also beleive that the apostolic church at that time ascended together with Him.

 

.

 

 

Christ said, "I will come again and take you with Me, so that where I am, you may be also."

 

This fulfilled on the day of Pentecost.

[coffee 0]

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From the Bible:

 

For we know that if the tent that is our earthly home is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

 

For in this tent we groan, longing to put on our heavenly dwelling,

 

if indeed by putting it on we may not be found naked.

 

For while we are still in this tent, we groan, being burdened”not that we would be unclothed, but that we would be further clothed, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life.

 

He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.

 

So we are always of good courage. We know that while we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord,

 

for we walk by faith, not by sight.

 

Yes, we are of good courage, and we would rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord.

 

So whether we are at home or away, we make it our aim to please him.

 

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

 

(2 Corinthians 5:1-10)

 

 

Notice that the Apostle Paul is speaking to believers, to the church of God that is at Corinth, with all the saints who are in the whole of Achaia, who are already born again, re-born and already indwelled by the Holy Spirit Who was sent by God on the Day of Pentecost. Notice also how it is written that if the tent which is our earthly home is destroyed, meaning to die and breathe no more, the believers have an inheritance that is eternal, where we will exist in what the Apostle Paul refers to as a "heavenly dwelling"", as opposed to that which is our earthly home. Also notice where it is written that even though we have been "born again", while we abide in our existing "tent, which is the body that we have been given while we live here on this earth, we are away from the Lord, which means that we will not be able to be in His presence until He returns from heaven, in the same glorified body that he ascended into heaven with.

 

These are the words of the Apostle Paul, one of the Apostles who were part of the first century Apostolic Church, written long after the Day of Pentecost. He obviously was not aware of what fourvetta and the Rudometkinites believe, that the Apostle Paul, together with all of the other Apostles were supposedly already in heaven, with the Lord Himself.

 

From fourvetta:

 

The gathering of the saints, also called New Israel is Christ's Glorified Body in His Second Coming. (Post # 73, above)

 

 

Christ said, "I will come again and take you with Me, so that where I am, you may be also." This fulfilled on the day of Pentecost. (Post # 74, above)

 

 

....the Apostolic Church dwelt in heaven. With the Lord Himself. (Post # 71, above)

 

It does not matter which language is spoken, while the Rudometkinites continue listening to Rudometkin's new spirit, which by Rudometkin's own words leads them on a new pathway to heaven, and as long as they continue to include the writings in the Spirit and Life book to be part of their "spiritual diet", their belief system will never be totally compatible with what is written in the Bible, which is why fourvetta and the other young Rudometkinites are so confused about what they believe.

 

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