Response To Dan Shubin

[anonymous 0]

The Apostle says, "If we rely only upon the name of Christ in this life, we are most unfortunate among all men."

 

And where might we find this quote?

 

poopsqually,

 

You will not find this verbatim quote in THE HOLY SCRIPTURES, neither will fourvetta, nor will he respond to your inquiry because "The Apostle," namely, Apostle Paul, did not say this.

 

In the same spirit as his new Messiah/Christ, fourvetta is compelled to convolute and pervert Apostle Paul’s statement.

 

The passage from THE HOLY SCRIPTURES reads as follows:

 

“If only for this life we have hope in CHRIST, we are to be pitied more than all men” (1 Corinthians 15:19).

 

CHRISTians’ hope in CHRIST is not only for this [temporal] life, it is for life with THE FATHER, THE SON/WORD/JESUS, AND THE HOLY SPIRIT.......GOD.......eternally.

 

CHRISTians continue to pray for the foolish fourvetta.

[Nick Shubin 0]

Thankyou Anonymous!

 

To the other readers, let's look at the full message IN CONTEXT!

 

First Corinthians 15:12-19

12: Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?

13: But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:

14: And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.

15: Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.

16: For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:

17: And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

18: Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.

19: If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.

 

I am simply amazed at the lengths people will go to make scripture fit thier belief system. Fourvetta, simply put, scripture says what it means, and means what it says!

[fourvetta 0]

I am simply amazed at the lengths people will go to make scripture fit thier belief system. Fourvetta, simply put, scripture says what it means, and means what it says!

 

Do you believe in the resurrection of the dead is my question. And I am glad you agree that the scripture means what it says.

 

In the passage quoted from First Corinthians 15:12-19,

you would then agree that to be born again is to be raised from the dead.

 

For in the same chapter and in context.

 

15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

15:43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

 

The first man is of the earth and the second is the Lord from above, a life giving spirit.

 

Paul also tells us that just as death worked in man, life will also work in man. But the earthly is first then the spiritual.

 

One must be born again to enter the kingdom of heaven. The first man of flesh and blood cannot enter, but the second man born from above is already in the kingdom.

 

Christ said, "The kingdom of God is within you."

[seeking_truth_1 0]

<<slight snipage>>

 

If you are saying that Jesus is around, then you are professing that the second coming of Christ is now.  If that is the case, please share.

 

I did not state that the 2nd coming of Christ has occured

 

Being alive or dead is not predicated upon location

 

fourvetta, myself, poops et. al. are all living yet we all are in varying locales

 

I'm asking a real simple question that does not require a multipage response

 

Is Jesus alive or dead?

[coffee 0]

Regarding:

 

I am simply amazed at the lengths people will go to make scripture fit thier belief system. Fourvetta, simply put, scripture says what it means, and means what it says!

 

This has long been a major problem with those who are the followers of Rudometkin and the Spirit and Life book heresy. We see the vivid example of this in fourvetta's responses, as he continues to twist what is written in the Bible, which he does in order to make it conform to the belief system of the Makcimisti, and their agenda of exalting Rudometkin as the physical incarnation of the Holy Spirit, and who they believe to be the actual embodiment of Christ's Second Coming in the physical body of Rudometkin.

 

As Poopsqually and Anonymous have correctly pointed out, the context of the Apostle Paul's statement....

 

If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable. (1 Corinthians 15:19)

 

....is prefaced with an overstatement of the obvious:

 

1) if there be no resurrection of the dead

 

2) And if Christ be not risen

 

3) For if the dead rise not

 

4) And if Christ be not raised

 

Then those who have passed away believing in Christ have simply perished, and speaking about this life here on earth only, if we have placed our hope in the Lord Jesus Christ, then we are of all people to be pitied the most.

 

The context of this Biblical passage is then twisted by fourvetta and Rudometkin's loyal followers to the point to where they shamelessly misquote the Scripture:

 

The Apostle says, "If we rely only upon the name of Christ in this life, we are most unfortunate among all men."

 

 

The readers should also notice that when the abuse of Scripture is pointed out, fourvetta and the Makcimisti give no accountability for their shameful misuse of what is written in the Bible. In fourvetta's case, he simply continues with his agenda of twisting more Scripture further out of context.

 

In the passage quoted from First Corinthians 15:12-19, you would then agree that to be born again is to be raised from the dead.

 

 

This is not true. The passage from 1 Corinthians 15:12-19 is written in context as a continuation of what is written just a few short sentences earlier:

 

For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures,

 

that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures,

 

and that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve.

 

Then he appeared to more than five hundred brothers at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have fallen asleep.

 

Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles.

 

Last of all, as to one untimely born, he appeared also to me. (1 Corinthians 15:3-8)

 

 

This section of what is written in the Bible is in reference to Christ indeed having risen from the dead, but not in the context of being "resurrected" from the dead as a result of "being dead" in the tresspasses of one's sins. Obviously the Lord Jesus Christ did not have any sin in Him, from which He needed to be "resurrected".

 

Equally as obvious, and contrary to what fourvetta believes, this section of the Scriptures is not written about being "born again". It is written as a prelude to the Apostle Paul's statement:

 

But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. (1 Corinthians 15:20)

 

 

The Apostle Paul is speaking to the Corinthians about Christ's physical, natural, earthly body being dead and coming back to life again in a glorified body. Again, this is not speaking about Jesus being "born again".

 

The Apostle Paul is addressing the fact that those who are followers of the Lord Jesus Christ will eventually also receive the same kind of glorified, imperishable and immortal body, at the time of Christ's Second Coming.

 

But someone will ask, "How are the dead raised? With what kind of body do they come?" (1 Corinthians 15:35)

 

 

When does the Apostle Paul say that this "resurrection" will take place? It is written in this same section of the Scriptures:

 

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed. (1 Corinthians 15:51-52)

 

 

The Apostle Paul gives further explanation about this when he differentiates between the physical, earthly, and natural body, versus the glorified body that believers will inherit at the time of Christ's Second Coming.

 

15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

 

The "first man" is speaking literally about "Adam", as in Adam and Eve, in the Garden of Eden, while the "last Adam" is speaking literally about the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

 

15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

 

Again, the "first man", meaning the literal "Adam", is of the earth, but the "second man", meaning the literal Jesus Christ, and only Him, is literally the Lord from heaven.

 

 

15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

 

15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

 

This means that mankind, the descendents of the literal "Adam", have been created with an earthly body, but because the Word of God, being fully God, literally came to earth and took on literal human flesh in the physical, earthly and natural human being body of Jesus Christ (the Word became flesh and dwelt on earth - John 1:14), those who believe in and follow the Lord Jesus Christ will eventually receive the same kind of heavenly body as Him.

 

 

The Apostle Paul is addressing the subject of physical death, where the natural, earthly body dies a physical death, but just like Christ was raised from the dead to receive His glorified body, those who are followers of the Lord Jesus Christ will also one day receive a glorified body to be like him, to bear the image of the heavenly body. This is the "context" of this section from the Scriptures.

[fourvetta 0]

This means that mankind, the descendents of the literal "Adam", have been created with an earthly body, but because the Word of God, being fully God, literally came to earth and took on literal human flesh in the physical, earthly and natural human being body of Jesus Christ (the Word became flesh and dwelt on earth - John 1:14), those who believe in and follow the Lord Jesus Christ will eventually receive the same kind of heavenly body as Him

 

In other words, the Word of God will become flesh and be made manifest in man. As God intended in the beginning.

 

Christ said, "The time is coming and already is, when the dead will the voice of the Son of God and be raised from the dead."

 

God will also walk the earth in the form of a man as He did in the garden.

 

Revelations tell us, "Behold the tabernacle of God is with men. I shall be their God and they shall be My people. I will dwell in them."

 

15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

 

15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

 

This means that mankind, the descendents of the literal "Adam", have been created with an earthly body, but because the Word of God, being fully God, literally came to earth and took on literal human flesh in the physical, earthly and natural human being body of Jesus Christ (the Word became flesh and dwelt on earth - John 1:14), those who believe in and follow the Lord Jesus Christ will eventually receive the same kind of heavenly body as Him.

 

The spiritual man has the same glorified body that Christ has, a life giving spirit. But the natural man of the earth, will return to the earth from which he came.

 

But he who dwells in heaven is a Spiritual man.

 

2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned

2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.

 

We are put here on earth and in this earthly body that we should seek heaven and the heavenly body. To receive the resurrected and gloried body while yet alive in this body.

 

And if we die before that being obtained, there is no hope in the next life. We are men most miserable. Eat drink and be merry for tommorow we die.

 

Christ came to show us that the resurrection is in fact, possible.

 

But to those who do not believe that as being possible, do not believe in Christ and the message of the gospel.

 

Neither does he believe in Paul's message.

 

1:3 Grace be to you and peace from God the Father, and from our Lord Jesus Christ,

1:4 Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:

1:5 To whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

1:9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

1:10 For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.

1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

 

He (the unbeliever), in fact, has another gospel.

[anonymous 0]

But the Spiritual Christian who is called New Israel worships the "Resurrected Christ," as Christ said, "I shall be with you in spirit unto the end of the age."

 

There is no new Israel, and certainly not in the sense in which fourvetta and his brethren believe.

 

Those who have been born again from above, spiritually, by GOD HIMSELF WHO IS SPIRIT, THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH, who accept, believe, follow, love/obey, and trust THE TRUTH.......JESUS CHRIST for life, are CHRISTians. They have no need to distinguish themselves as “spiritual” because among CHRISTians, this is understood, that is, without being born again, spiritually, from above by GOD HIMSELF WHO IS SPIRIT, THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH, one cannot be a true believer and follower of THE TRUTH.......JESUS CHRIST, i.e., a CHRISTian.

 

JESUS did not say what fourvetta "quoted" JESUS as saying.

 

JESUS SAID:

 

‘All authority in Heaven and on earth has been given to ME. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in THE NAME of THE FATHER and of THE SON and of THE HOLY SPIRIT, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age’” (Matthew 28:18-20).

 

Please NOTE that JESUS did not transfer all authority on Heaven and on earth to HIS disciples as the arrogant, high-minded fraud mgr claimed JESUS transferred to him, and they did not claim JESUS' titles as the arrogant, high-minded imposter, mgr, did. JESUS comanded them to go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in THE [ONE] NAME of THE FATHER and of THE SON and of THE HOLY SPIRIT, teaching them to observe all that HE commanded them.

 

And post JESUS’ crucifixion/death, resurrection, and ascension, the Apostle Paul said this:

 

“…but we preach CHRIST crucified; a stumbling block to Jews, and foolishness to Gentiles” (1 Corinthians 1:23).

 

Through his arrogant and ignorant statement, fourvetta has admitted that the crucified CHRIST is foolishness to him.

 

Because fourvetta has chosen to believe in a counterfeit Christ, he is a man to be pitied much not only in this life but for all eternity.

 

CHRISTians continue to pray for THE TRUE LIGHT to shine into the blind, confused hearts and minds of fourvetta and his brethren.

[fourvetta 0]

Please NOTE that JESUS did not transfer all authority on Heaven and on earth to HIS disciples as the arrogant, high-minded fraud mgr claimed JESUS transferred to him, and they did not claim JESUS' titles as the arrogant, high-minded imposter mgr did. JESUS comanded them to go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in THE NAME (singular as in ONE) of THE FATHER and of THE SON and of THE HOLY SPIRIT, teaching them to observe all that HE commanded them.

 

 

Christ gave Peter all authority in heaven and on earth.

 

Matthew

 

16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

 

Apostle Peter had the authority given by Christ Himself for the forgiveness of sins.

 

Christ also tells His disiples in Matthew

 

18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.

18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

 

We also have the power for to forgive sin.

 

Chrsit said, "For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses."

 

And post JESUS’ crucifixion/death, resurrection, and ascension, the Apostle Paul said this:

 

“…but we preach CHRIST crucified; a stumbling block to Jews, and foolishness to Gentiles” (1 Corinthians 1:23).

Through his arrogant and ignorant statement, fourvetta has admitted that the crucified CHRIST is foolishness to him.

 

Paul also says that he was crucified with Christ and that the resurrected Christ was within him.

 

Galations 2

 

I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

 

Paul also says in Romans

 

6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:

 

I find that there is no difference of the Jew in the past and the Christian of today. Neither believed in the resurrection of the dead.

[ligonier 0]

<<snippage>>

Even though there are different congregations, there is only one Church.  <<snippage again>>

<<snippity>> Maxim writes about seven churches, which in the Spirit is likened upon a wife because the Holy Spirit that dwells within the members of those Congregations dwelled within him.<<snip-snip>>

 

So are you implying that mgr believed that whoever has the holy spirit were/are one in the same?

 

That would mean that blacks, asians, hispanics and so on could all be a part

 

That being the case, why aren't blacks, asians, hispanics welcomed in molokan churches today?

9) "......and with your blood you purchased men for God from every tribe and language and people and nation." Rev. 5 (NIV)

 

Is there a need, or even a requirement, for all people to meld into one big unified church group ? What would be the point, or profit, to bring in all comers into the molokan church ?

[lastinline 0]

Back to the Top!!!!!

[seeking_truth_1 0]

This seems like it could be revisited

[LTTBT 0]

This seems like it could be revisited

 

You cou have talked with him at the wedding Sunday. What I would give to be a fly on that wall

[seeking_truth_1 0]

Paul:

 

I think I know the list you are speaking about

 

I didn't find it yet

 

However there is this post that has much of what you are looking for

 

From Red October:

 

Does anyone ever bother looking at the headers? It says "A Song".....that should be a clue. Its a praise...as in not a prophecy or testament, etc....but a praise....which leads me to number..

 

Its a SONG....and MGR is incorporating refernces to God, Christ and the Holy Spirit concering mans disobediance and Grace from Christ. Versus 31-32 is about Christ, verse 33 is about the Holy Spirit.

 

Not everyone is capable to tell the difference when he was refering to God, Christ or the Holy Spirit. I guess he presumed too much in thinking people would be more devout to God.

 

King of Spirits does not equate to God and does not mean God.

 

Your making the title "King of Spirits" out to be much larger with more authority than it is.

 

God = God of Gods (above all other Gods....FYI, Rulers such as the Tsar, often demanded to be revered like Gods, your using God in the extreme sense while MGR is not).

 

The header said "A Song", not "A Testament" or "A prophesy" or anything of the like. But "A Song" meaning its going to have metaphors and allegorical references.

 

 

Red October, echoing the excuses of those who are the loyal and faithful followers of Rudometkin, is adamant about defending his hero's honor with the sorry excuse that Rudometkin's claims about being "God" are done within the context of "praise", as if lyrics that are part of a "song". This could be considered a plausible answer if it were even remotely close to being the case with what is written in the Spirit and Life book.

 

Rudometkin wrote:

 

"(Because) of this you have forced me prematurely to make known to you my wonderfully extraordinary New Israelite name, which is the majesty of the Almighty's title, that was put upon me by God Himself."

 

(From Rudometkin's writings in the Spirit and Life book, Page 575, Book 13, Article 2, Verse 2)

 

 

 

In Rudometkin's Russian text, the term "Almighty" is capitalized. Whenever Rudometkin capitalizes the proper name of the "title" of God throughout his writings, he is always referring to The Almighty, as in the Lord God Himself.

 

In this excerpt quoted above, Rudometkin is stating that his wonderfully extraordinary New Israelite name is specifically that of the majestic "title" of The Almighty. In other words, Rudometkin claimed to have the title of "The Almighty", Who is God.

 

This is not the prelude to a "song". Nor does the rest of the text continue in "praise" to God. In fact, this is the section of Rudometkin's writings where he proclaims the "message" to his loyal "followers" that he was the "seven-storied heavenly ladder, by which eternally ascend and descend the secret pronouncements of God Almighty".

 

 

Rudometkin begins this specific section of his writings with the disclaimer:

 

I, your renowned brother, formerly incarcerated at Solovetski Island, and now I sit in the same kind of pit at the Suzdalski Monastery. (Page 575, Book 13, Article 1, Verse 11)

 

 

In other words, Rudometkin is identifying himself as the writer, and he is not writing "in the spirit". From this, we know that the one writing this is not God the Father, nor the Lord Jesus Christ, nor is this coming from someone who is the alleged "mouthpiece" for the Holy Spirit. Rudometkin wrote these words as coming from himself, M. G. Rudometkin.

 

In the very next statement, Rudometkin proceeds to tell his followers this:

 

I have written you many letters, but you have not yet understood that which is written about me in them, and therefore I see that you are still ignorant. Either that or your spirit is not in agreement with my Spirit like it used to be; for it is clear that you have quickly forgotten me. (Page 575, Book 13, Article 2, Verse 1)

 

 

Again, these are the words of Rudometkin. Neither the Father, the Son, nor the Holy Spirit were writing these "many letters". For certain, the context here is not a song of "praise".

 

Obviously, Rudometkin is attempting to "explain" to his followers about himself and his "status" as some sort of spiritual "leader" over them. According to the context of what is written, Rudometkin was telling his followers that he had been given his "wonderfully extraordinary New Israelite name", which was "the majesty of the Almighty's title" that was "put upon him" by God Himself.

 

Rudometkin was trying very hard to "convince" his followers that he had been given the "majesty" of having the very title of "The Almighty" bestowed upon him by "God Himself". Those who are familiar with the history of the Khlysty in Russia are able to recognize immediately that Rudometkin's claim about being Deity in the flesh over his "followers" is identical to the claims commonly made by those Khlysty who were historically revered as "christs" over their own followers.

 

 

 

(From Rudometkin's writings in the Spirit and Life book, on Page 580, Book 13, Article 6, Verse 1-2)

 

By this is how I (Rudometkin) am called by my new name, which I have written to you here in these lines by the testimony of the true Spirit. (Verse 1)

 

The first name: Enfayil - Mighty God; second: Savakhan - King of promise; third: Youlia-Yar - Prince of Peace, Father of the age to come. (Verse 2)

 

 

Again, this was not written in the context of a song, and the only "praise" being given, is being given to Rudometkin, by Rudometkin.

 

 

"Even though I (Rudometkin) was first born of sinful flesh, but by my second birth I was born the Lord from heaven and, through my suffering, I was born God of the faithful." (Page 541, Book 11, Article 13, Verse 11)

 

 

Consistent with the Khlysty heresy that he introduced to his followers, Rudometkin openly stated that he was "God". Rudometkin NEVER claimed to be "a" god. In each instance, his claim was that he is "God".

 

On Page 536, Rudometkin wrote that he will never forgive those who offended him. In the very next breath, he stated the following:

 

"I am a martyr for the truth, and God of the faithful." (Spirit and Life book, Page 536, Book 11, Article 9, Verse 2)

 

 

This is not the personality characteristic of the God of the Bible, of Whom King David wrote about in the Scriptures:

 

For you, O Lord, are good and forgiving, abounding in steadfast love to all who call upon you. (Psalm 86:5)

 

 

Danilo Filipov was the legendary "christ" among the Khlysty, who pronounced himself to be "God Sabaoth" on earth. Rudometkin, following in the footsteps of his Khlysty forefather, was deceived into believing that he, Rudometkin himself, was the final "christ", as "God on earth", who would usher in the thousand year kingdom on earth.

 

"And for this He (God the Father Himself) will set me (Rudometkin, in the flesh) as king upon it (the world), because I am everywhere lord of the truth.

 

And truly, that is why my portion is the cross, God of the faithful.

 

Although I (Rudometkin), by my first birth, am a man of sinful bones, but by my second birth, I am the Lord Himself, from heaven." (Page 415, in Book 7, Article 27, Verses 6-8)

 

 

At the beginning of this section (Page 414, Introduction to Article 27), Rudometkin explains that these words were in response to three questions that he was asked while in prison. In other words, Rudometkin was answering questions. He was not writing some alleged "song of praise".

 

 

On Page 497 of the Spirit and Life book, Article 8 begins with the heading as The Reading For New Israel. This is not a "song". From Rudometkin's other writings, we know that he often referred to his own loyal "followers" as the "new israel". After introducing this "reading", Rudometkin proceeds to tell his followers this:

 

And moreover I, your master, am sitting in the city of Suzdal all this time....(Rudometkin wrote this while in the monastery prison in Suzdal.)

 

....I am called by this new name, today and always, both in heaven and on earth; for I am Youl'iesar, King Yoorece, the New Jewish Messiah; and the Jew and all the tribes of all the nations shall bow down to me. (Rudometkin, Pages 497-498, Book 10, Article 8, Verses 4 & 7)

 

 

This same "theme" is continued throughout Rudometkin's writings in the Spirit and Life book, as we can read in the following:

 

Even though I was first born of sinful flesh, but by my second birth I was born the Lord from heaven and, through my suffering, I was born God of the faithful. (Page 541, Book 11, Article 13, Verse 11)

 

 

I am a martyr for the truth, and GOD of the faithful. (Rudometkin, Page 536, Book 11, Article 9, Verse 2)

 

 

....I am the first and the last, as GOD of the earth. (Rudometkin, Page 503, Book 10, Article 14, Verses 3-4)

 

 

None of these excerpts were written by Rudometkin in the context of some alleged "song of praise". The only "praise" being given is the heretical praise of Rudometkin, praising himself.

 

 

From the Spirit and Life book, Page 352, ARTICLE 17:

 

The Third Discourse

 

(Again, this is a "discourse", not some alleged "song of praise". According to the dictionary, a discourse is a speech, or "lecture", or treatise on a subject. A "treatise" is defined as a "written work" dealing with one particular subject.)

 

 

Following is Rudometkin's discourse:

 

....Let each heed - those that have ears - and with them, listen well to that which my new spirit evangelizes in new fiery tongues, to all of you, regarding the promised peace for a thousand years. Amen.

 

For this you will be rewarded by me with eternal life, and the Kingdom of peace of our Lord Jesus Christ, upon this good land for a thousand years,

 

Moreover, you will truly be given all of this from me, if only you justly fulfill my will in the Spirit.

 

Then I, the New Youlia, will congratulate you with the rank of the inheritance of all the thrones of the new land in Israel, and therein I will give you a new name.

 

Therefore, heed this, each one of you today; look boldly upon me....and always be prepared for me, your vigilant master.

 

 

Regarding Red October's statement in defense of Rudometkin:

 

He thinks he's God, so he could have walked out of prison at anytime he wanted (and he did want out from what I gather reading).

 

 

Among each group of the Khlysty, they each believed that the individual "christ" who reigned over their specific "ark" was the physical incarnation of "God" in human form. The Khlysty believed this about the Lord Jesus Christ, which is what Rudometkin constantly and consistently attempted to "educate" his followers about himself, and his contention that he personally was the physical incarnation of the Holy Spirit, in human form:

 

For this Spirit is in person God Himself, and the King of all the new Israel. (Page 434, Book 8, Article 15, Verse 2)

 

 

Again, this is not some alleged "song". It is "instruction" from Rudometkin about himself, concerning that which he, Rudometkin, was deceived into believing about himself. To defend and participate in this heresy is idolatry against the Lord. Idolatry is defined in the dictionary as "blind admiration and devotion".

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It's doesn't exist in Scripture

 

The Apostle says, "If we rely only upon the name of Christ in this life, we are most unfortunate among all men."

And where might we find this quote?

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Even a fervent Molokan without an actual reverence for the s&l, would call what four(NO)vetta contends here, akin to being influenced by a evil spirit. But, in my estimation an actual in-dwelling evil spirit, which his daddy and granddaddy has shown a propensity for in likewise manner.

 

I would surmise that fv would fit right in the would of Leo Tolstoy (christian anarchist) and Tolstoy devotee danny-boy.

 

lastinline (where my 2-cents, keeps the ball rolling)

 

There is a difference from the "crucified Christ" and the "resurrected Christ."

 

The Christian world today worships the "crucified Christ" who died and still hangs on the cross.

 

In other words, a "dead Christ" who has not, the power of the resurrection.

 

Christ said, "My flesh profits Me nothing. It is the Spirit that gives life." He Himself died according to the flesh and was raised up again by the Spirit.

 

The Apostle says, "If we rely only upon the name of Christ in this life, we are most unfortunate among all men."

 

But the Spiritual Christian who is called New Israel worships the "Resurrected Christ," as Christ said, "I shall be with you in spirit unto the end of the age."

 

He walks among two or three who are gathered in His Name. Under the banner of the Seven Spirits of God. Rev. 5:6

 

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Back to the top?? four(no)vetta & danny, same last name and pretty much two-peas in a pod! And, now hiding out in the u n d e r g r o u n d, no less.

 

lastinline (& under only the Blood of the Lamb)

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